If the LAKOTA can do it - so can the MUMWEKMA OHLONE - federal recognition now.

The Sioux can "declare independence" all they want, but it means nothing. The reside in the US, and no declaration will change that. This was settled in 1865. Their silly "liens" on property that have no legal title to are absurd. One must have had previous title to impose a lien, and the Sioux have none.

The "Ohlone", also calle the Costanoan, have no title to anything. Restoration of federal status does not entitle a tribe to land. Any land transfers must be negotiated with existing owners, who will hardly be likely to sell. If very lucky, the "Ohlone" might get title to a part of some open space on the peninsula, or perhaps in the East Bay. The Ramaytush, the SF Costanoan, will receive no land. For one, the tribe is extinct, and two, there is no empty land in SF for them to claim. The Presidio is already federal land, mostly occupied by the base and the cemetary, neither of which will be abandoned.

Dream on, Francisco.

The declaration is from only one faction, led by Russell Means, who doesn't necessarily represent the Lakota. Porcupine on the Pine Ridge is only one part of the Lakota Nation so Means has little standing. Remember he ran for president as a Libertarian a couple of times and maybe he's looking for more publicity to run again.

Other Lakota people established the League of Indigenous Sovereign Nations years ago. It doesn't make sense to declare the treaties void and then call for a return of the Black Hills to the Lakota based on the 1868 Treaty of Fort Laramie. Unfortunately, there are no treaties with California Tribes, only the process of seeking federal recognition to become a gaming entity. That recognition as a tribe wouldn't be a step towards indepencdence.

http://www.commondreams.org/archive/2007/12/21/5946/

the events in this news article amazingly similar as described in hilarious book by Robert

Ludlum
"The Road to Omaha"
http://content.answers.com/main/content/wp/en/c/c4/Ludlum-omaha.JPG

Ludlum was such a sharp-witted author:
what he's written as practically a comedy comes true nowadays in real life !

book was published in 1992, 16 years ago

The Presidio of San Francisco is NOT a Military Base, anymore - sickco Ahmed - it s a National Park at least Area A and Area B - is governed by the Presidio-Trust.

For sure the Muwekma will gain Federal Recognition and skunks like you will be given marching orders - may be a one way ticket to Alaska in Winter - to chill out.

I did not know that indeed there are Racist Jerks like you in the Bay Area. I would surely like to meet you Ahmed - and Ali Baba and the forty thieves - to which I presume you belong.

Your logic betrays your education and your IQ is below 32.

Now can you ever write the nonsense you write.

This is great news.
Their first act should be to demand the release of Leonard Peltier back to Lakota country.
http://www.freepeltier.org

It is good to remember that this land is Sacred Land and belongs to the First People.

You can steal the land but you have to accountable to the Great Spirit. And that is NOT the White House as some - come to think of it.

The time has come to fight for our Rights - and the Democratic Values - that were here for thousands of year - and practiced by the Six Nations.

Much of the Constitution was inspired by the Six Nations - the Founding Fathers would tell you that - but, somewhere along the line - some one has forgotten to speak the truth. No wonder we say they "speak with fork tongues". They rewrite history - even as they speak of lies as the "truth".

Sixty percent of California Tribes are NOT Federally Recognized - how can there be justice when all the time the "thieves" are prowling day and night.

Time to restore - justice - and Federally Recognize all the First People - who were here for thousands of years. In San Francisco the Ohlone and the Sacred Shellmounds. Aho.

It is good to remember that this land is Sacred Land and belongs to the First People.

You can steal the land but you have to accountable to the Great Spirit. And that is NOT the White House as some - come to think of it.

The time has come to fight for our Rights - and the Democratic Values - that were here for thousands of year - and practiced by the Six Nations.

Much of the Constitution was inspired by the Six Nations - the Founding Fathers would tell you that - but, somewhere along the line - some one has forgotten to speak the truth. No wonder we say they "speak with fork tongues". They rewrite history - even as they speak of lies as the "truth".

Sixty percent of California Tribes are NOT Federally Recognized - how can there be justice when all the time the "thieves" are prowling day and night.

Time to restore - justice - and Federally Recognize all the First People - who were here for thousands of years. In San Francisco the Ohlone and the Sacred Shellmounds. Aho.

Indians were only given dual citizenship in 1924. In many areas they were only allowed to vote after the 60s.

The Declaration of Independence specifically declares indian nations to be separate and foreign nations, with which treaties can be negotiated, and it also says that treaties are the highest law of the land.
Legal title is the whole point here.

If the law were followed, the title belongs to these nations. It is only in the incorrect, but intuitive understanding of many that they think that this is a matter of zoning, or that the current state and city governments can at whim decide what they wish to do about land. Under this idea or argument, one would be saying "that land was conquered fair and square, so the nation is now the U.S., and reservations exist at our mercy", as though they could be taken away or modified at will.
Another common mistaken idea is that american indian nations were given 'special' privileges as a matter of 'politically correct' charity.

There is no doubt in my mind that the Muwekma Ohlone have a clear case. They were Federally Recognized and then removed in 1927 from the Federal Register.

The other 18 treaties signed by various California Tribes were NOT ratified. The pertinent documents were found years after the treaties were signed. That is how Congress acts in many cases. They lie.

We all know how Billions of Dollars kept in trust by the Department of Interior went missing. When it suits the "thieves" they do as they please.

In California - the Governors sent edicts - previous years all documented - to kill Native Americans and for every scalp one could fetch $5. That was not too long ago.

Here is California innocent Native American women were raped, children abused, many taken from their families and put into boarding school to be reformed - forced tolearn the White Man's Evil ways.

As to Land Rights - according to the dictates of the White Men - they were wrong - according to their own laws and regulation. You cannot take land by force and you cannot own anything without signed documentation. At some point the land was stolen - and in California we have proof that it was taken by force and at gun point.

When it suits the Palefaces they can do anything at gun point - the Iraq Case is a glaring example but intruding into other Nation's business has been an on going process - in the history of this Nation.

As to the Federal Recognition of the Muwekma the First People of San Francisco - the evidence is there.

Tomorrow - when the Federal Recognition is complete - Congressperson Nancy Pelosi, Senator Diane Feinstein, Mayor Gavin Newsom - will have nothing to stand on - they will all be evicted.
Scum bags - all of them - with no conscience - less respect for Native Americans and Mother Earth.

This real nightmare is what these skunks are all afraid of - including Ahmed who hides behind his key board. Little knowing that I have tracked him down - using IP as a tool.

It should be simple - to recognize the Muwekma - since the Muweka Ohlone linked to the Verona Band were once Federally recognized - to be easily put on the Federal Register.

But, NO - the Muwekma Ohlone have been forced to start all over again. I know the U.S. Government would NOT do that to Whites, if they were in such a situation. The U.S. Government would bend backwards to accommodate them.

The Lakota are making some people think.

Some jerks go all the way to steal land even now in the year 2007 - without just cause and have destroyed people lives. Billions are spent abroad to deprive people of their freedom.

Here at home - Native People, the First People have had their land stolen and others put on Reservations.

The whole world laughs at America - always trying to enforce their silly norms on others. Calling themselves a Super Power - when they have no Moral Compass and more have lost it.

Recently in Australia - land has been given back to the First People there - and it is NOT too late to take it all back - right here in San Francisco. Some jerks must be put on notice and with due consequences.

Here is a short recap of the 18 treaties - signed by the U.S. Government and the California Tribes that were NOT ratified.

They were found years later after signing the Treaties - collecting dust - and in the early 1990s revealed to the Public at Large:

http://www.nps.gov/history/history/online_books/5views/5views1e.htm

I sure hope this happens with other tribes as well...
Take yuh LAND BACK!

fuck babylon

Francisco, calling someone "racist" for disagreeing with you is tired, and you really should try to get past it. It's tedious.

I am not going to be given "orders" to leave, nor is anyone else. There has never been a single case of non-Indian property owners being forced to give up property in ANY Indian settlement, anywhere. There have been provisions for first-refusal when property sells, but not removal of people or confiscation of property. I do know a bit about this since I worked and continue to work with Indians in four states on language and language-recovery issues, and have done so for over 20 years. I don't need to be lectured to by you.

Your fantasy of evicting the non-Indians in SF is delusional. What, exactly, do you think would replace the current city? Do you propose to return to the stone-age level of existence that the Ramaytush, the Chochenyo, the Karkin, the Tamyen, the Awaswas, the Mustun and the Chalon Costanoans? Or perhaps the former Esselen, who were even more primitive than the Costanoans? In truth, aboriginal existence was rather brutal and short, riven by disease and almost constant warfare among tribelets. I certainly hope you don't hold onto the silly belief of "the noble savage" with its myths of peace and harmony among tribes. It's just that...a myth.

I with the Costanoans well in their quest for federal recognition. It helps with many issues, such as education, family life, and traditions. It does not, however, restore any tribe to its previous existence, especially when the language and culture have been extinct for decades.

I came across this article through the link below...is my impression right that the Muwekma Ohlone have been fighting the Department of the Interior for longer than the recently announced Lakota movement? Also, what is the next step on the path to Lakota freedom? Although the article above makes it sound like they have had their land returned to them, I can't see how the United States Government would allow that to happen. Even if the International Court and the United Nations agree with Lakota unfortunately the U.S. will simply ignore the rulings I believe.

http://politirant.com/forums/the-latest-happenings/new-country-lakota/0/

Ahmed - your logic is so screwed up and you still cannot fathom based on your concepts that today's First People are perfectly capable of ruling themselves - and evicting those that they desire NOT to have in their midst - once they have jurisdiction over their land.

I do not give a rat ass as to your vague statements about the various tribes that you mention but do not go beyond that. My premise is that the land was stolen by the Whites ( I presume you are White) - consequently is has to be returned - and that is the law.

There is the law of Karma that is much more powerful then the Magna Carta and other modes of the Roman Law. The Native Americans had their own laws and some very sophisticated such as those practices by the - " very civilized" - Six Nations.

Where do you get the idea that the First People were not civilized?

Whites were not civilized for thousands of years. When Whites first met the Japanese they had much to learn - foremost learning to take a bath and keep themselves clean.

Filthy Whites brought diseases to America and took them elsewhere - many of them Sexually Transmitted Diseases (STDs) - a reflection on their life styles and dirty habits.

Whites fought and killed one another for hundreds of years. And even here in America - count the number of Whites that died in the Civil War - and that too on the land of the First People.

The major plagues took place in areas where Whites made their abode - read history, Ahmed.

My point is simple and very clear - the land must be returned. Here, in San Francisco we want it all. The owners could remain - but the property taxes and other liens - will be beholden to the Muwekma Ohlone - when they are put on the Federal Register.

As to how civilized or otherwise the Muwekma Ohlone will act - depends on the time when we cross the Rubicon.

White folks think they know it all - and they also want it all.

History proves that it is good to be simple. It is also good to practice KISS - keep it simple stupid - which you do not get - Ahmed.

The Department of the Interior, the Bureau of Indian Affairs, Congress, the Senate, the White House - have blood on their hands when it comes to the First People - known to the Whites as Native Americans.

What is it that baffles you about doing the "just" thing for the First People of San Francisco?

Giving up the land that was stolen in the first place? Keeping intact the materialism and the rip-off attitude that saturates the various levels controlled by perverts and racists that are Whites?

Let me tell you - if some has a right - they have to fight for it - and when they get it - exercise their rights to the fullest possibility.

Now you may think that is not possible but it is. In Northern California - the First People took control of their land - thousands of acres - it can be done and it will be done.

I am not one to tire - not when I deal with racists such as you. You talk the talk but you cannot walk the walk.

Once again, you drag out the tired "racist" screed when you have nothing of susbtance to say.

No one is going to evict the current residents of SF. Not you, not the BIA, not anyone. Indian land settlements don't work that way. If you would look beyond the endless dogma you put on this site, day after day, and actually do some research on these claims then you might have something to say.

As of now, however, you do not. You write screeds against everyone, constantly, without any substance other than your own delusions of grandeur. You seem to think that by constantly insulting the elected officials of this city and state that this makes you a "spokesman" for something. Sadly for you, it doesn not.

There is no point having a conversation with you. You rant and rave and say nothing of substance. You know nothing about the Indians you claim to represent. You create a fantasy of Indian life based on decades of leftist twaddle passing for anthropology. I dare say you've never picked up a scholarly book on the Costanoan in your life. You have a lot to learn. Perhaps you should start.

Where did you get the idea that indian nations which also have states somehow implies living with customs and lifestyle from circa 1700. Are you saying that indian nations are an outdated concept, despite the legal basis of sovereignty? Or that they are special ethnic groups which are required to remain fixed in time, without any sort of international trade or adaptation of international technologies? Do you think that Asians shouldn't be allowed to use technologies developed in europe, or that europeans should abandon potatoes, tomatoes, squash, etc.- in other words ethnic groups can only keep technology they invented themselves?

Maybe when you return to digging around in the mud in an irish village, dressed like a peasant from Monty Python, some tribes might consider historical reenactment. A border or distance is pretty significant to culture. If you just compare canadian culture to american, there are tremendous differences due to both governance and the composition of ethnic groups.

In your very first rant you proclaimed the Muwekma Ohlone are all extinct! From which scholarly Ohlone book did you get that rubbish?

The Muwekma Ohlone are alive and over 500 in number - know that for a fact.

http://www.muwekma.org

It is just a matter of time before the Muwekma are put on the Federal Register.

You, Ahmed the ignorant - can rant all you want with your rubbish comments. The First People were here for thousands of years and will be here in control - soon

Armchair critics like you contribute nothing to society. I have never read one piece from you worth anything and the fact that you have a low IQ is revealed in each of your putrid replies.

Everything Francisco says is valid points. Treaties? What treaties. They were thrown out the door even before the ink stopped drying.

As a pale face, I find the American Indian culture full of Strength, Honor and a deep respect for the Earth.. I find their views on Tobacco as a sacred herb resonant with my beliefs.
I could go on and on.

Things will change for their benefit. You will see it happen very soon.

She:kon (greetings).

Francisco, what of the good mind? Why all the hatred and vitriol in your posts. It is enough that you fight the good fight. Do not waste your energies on personal attacks. After all, what is happening here is only people posting their point of view, their opinion from their own perspective. This should not turn into an angry debate with people "tracking" other people. My brother, I am of the Iroquois (Mohawk, Seneca, Oneida, Cayuga, Onondaga & Tuscarora - The Six Nations). I urge you to speak your truth clearly and quietly. Ignore those comments which inflame you for you are too passionate to make objective rebuttal. Calm your mind my brother & become of the Good Mind and others will see your truth first and not your anger.

Be assured, nothing we, as First Nations people across Turtle Island say, will ever make our white brothers & sisters go away. Do NOT lose sight of the fact that there are a great many "palefaces" who are of the Good Mind and who's support we need. Accept that they are here to stay and let us continue our fight using THEIR courts and THEIR own system to achieve our goals. The bureaucrats themselves, in their arrogance, have provided us with the vehicle by which we can realize many of our goals; their very own legal system. Properly applied, we can make the judicial system look at itself squarely in the mirror of public opinion and were it to conduct itself in any less than an honourable way, the U.S. would make a mockery of its own laws in the eyes of the world.....again.

Be not so angry with Ahmed because you have no answers to some of the points he raises. Accept that this is a very complex issue and *some* of his points of view are quite valid. The Iroquois - known too for our great diplomacy - asks you to calm your mind and concentrate on your goals. Debate these things with a view towards somehow, finding an acceptance of our differences and make the debate a productive one....not a hateful angry one. We have had far too much of this in our past and what has it gained us? Slow down Francisco, make your passion work for you...not against you.

From the Land of the Iroquois,
Six Nations of The Grand River Territory

Nia:wen

Ona

Dane toh.

I am as cool as they come
having been trained well
in some of the major world
institutions - including mind games
so Ahmed - it but a gadfly
I could swat him
but I have to play him
and so with words - a tool
he understands - I swat him
I would not waste my time
hating - I know better
I detest sending words in his direction
but, that is the only tool I have
as to the Six Nations and its noble traditions
I will listen to what you have to say
patience - I have
our children are dying
so - patience - leads to pain
and pain to shock
and shock to anger
and anger to words
I am - as cool as they come
believe you me
and if you visit
san francisco - check me out
best wishes to the Six Nations
and accept the best to self