San Francisco Fails to Mobilize for Immigrant Rights

Oh, wonderful. Another "protest". Another "action". Give it a rest, please. No one CARES how many people you get in the street. Those days are over. Americans all over the country saw plenty of rallies over the weekend, with the thousands of Mexican flags. I'm sure Mr and Mrs Middle Class are just thrilled about that, Randy. Immigrantion is good for the country. Immigrants are good for the country. But you do it OUR way, under OUR system, according to OUR rules. If you came home from a trip and found a family living in your house, would you think it proper to let them stay because "they're already here"? I think not.

don't care, don't care, don't care. Fucking wake up, gente!

To define people by the color of their skin is racist by definition.

not sure what dictionary you're using

to simply mention race is not in and of itself racist, unless you believe Ward Connerly's colorblind America already exists

thanks for your knee-jerk defense of the ever-oppressed whites though

Actually, if anything the author is guilty of being prejudiced, because racism is a term that is tied to power, and white people as a whole, particularly white males hold more power both socially and economically than other groups such as minorities.

In short, Racism isn't name calling, its subjugating one people over another.

sure is. who hires and fires people at virtually every ''job'' ? whites. im not prejudiced , im white myself.

No offense every time I go to pro-immigrant rallies I get treated like crap. I am white and would really like to support them(illegal immigrants) but they are not nice nor sociable.
Be nice and get support. Be racist and get reported. (period)

I went to a counter protest in January for reproductive rights- there will thousands of anti choice activists and only about 600 pro-reproductive rigths activists. I think people are burned out

we are 3 years into the war - all of our protests have been 100% ineffective.

our "liberal, left" leaders (feinstein, pelosi, et al) are, in fact, war profiteers, racists, and sadists of the highest order.

now they want to make it a felony to teach (certain) children.

folks, the time for marching is the streets is LONG GONE.

as the panthers reminded us so long ago, it's time to pick up the gun.

every tank they bring to our cities is a tank they can't use in iraq. every policeman removed from the force by whatever means is one less cop to brutalize our communities.

time to END this empire.

look how the panthers turned out, dumbass. and they didn't pick up arms to start a revolution anyway, but to defend themselves. even so, they just scared mainstream people in the end which allowed them to get murdered or set-up by cops and their dreams of building long-term community support were washed away

it's done been long past time for armed insurection. it's already too late for such a conflict and probably has been since before WWII. the powers that be will run us over with those tanks, and now they have a wide assortment of other weapons to use. you ever notice how the military tends to vote right-wing? that means most ain't gonna sign on to your little insurrection

alone or in small groups, your peashooters ain't gonna do shit against all that serious US military hardware. the only revolution that can happen will be people uniting together to strike nationwide or massive civil disobedience to shut down society as we know it, and if they do that, there don't have to be no shooting done

short of massive unification (when anarchists pathetically can't even get along with communists in these parts to achieve common goals), fugget about it. short of massive unification, you're talking civil war and who knows who will align with who in such a conflict and there's no guarantee the results would be any better than before the bloodbath started. we could end up in a military theocracy for all you know

you want a bloody civil war with millions of americans dead? well, then, time for you to stand up for your beliefs and be the next american John Brown. go for it. maybe it will work, maybe it won't (odds are it won't). won't know 'til you try, right? put your pistol where your mouth is and go to town. stick your own damned neck out

otherwise, your violent-fantasy shittalking here only goes to show that you have run out of ideas, and indeed it is you who are fatigued and ineffective. you are just another american armchair chickenhawk ready to send others off to die in your dreams of the perfect world.

There is nothing we can do but try to have fun until the end of this cursed capitalist nation arrives.
Whether by nature or by attack the USA will be done soon enough.
Then perhaps there will be the opportunity for some real change.

your answer is more marching in circles, more sitting down in the streets.

meanwhile, iraqis get killed, get raped, and get tortured by your friends and relatives in the US military.

convince americans? of what? you people have been over here killing and enslaving anything that doesn't look like you for 500 fucking years. why would anyone give a flying FUCK about lowlives like you?

americans killing americans would be pure joy for the rest of the world, who are weary of your violence (war) and your selfishness (pacificism). it doesn't matter if you are the rapist colonel from oklahoma or the "peaceful" san franciscan marching around in your pathetic, permitted, little circles - the iraqi gets raped all the same.

better that the world be rid of both of you.

civil war in the USA? americans killing americans? about fucking time...

you're so full of it

you, the righteous one, will initiate the bloody revolution and everything will turn out exactly as you planned. good people, like you, will win, of course, and bad people, as you define them, will lose. the world will cheer it on. heaven on earth forever more.

you can take your charlie manson dreams somewhere else, pal. I ain't signing up to be a martyr in your civil war, and I don't see a line forming either. take your apocalypse fantasies somewhere else.

what are you a gubment agent provacatuer? you must be, cause your chickenhawk ass ain't gonna be on the evening news for starting the violent revolution. I don't see you takin' out cops or hitting a local military base, just punk-assed urging others to do it for you. what a chump

the panthers became dangerous in the eyes of the FBI not when they used guns, but when they served food.

"On May 15, 1969, in an internal memo, FBI Director J. Edgar Hoover wrote: "The Breakfast for Children Program represents the best and most influential activity going for the BPP and, as such, is potentially the greatest threat..."

what is so ridiculous about the poster's claim that we need mass civil disobedience is this: they will kill you just the same. the only difference is that you won't be shooting back because of some self-hating delusions about "non-violence."

do something useless (like marching in circles) and they willignore you.
do something useful (like feeding people who are hungry) and they will kill you.
pick up the gun, and they will (try) to kill you.

revolution now.

"poster's claim that we need mass civil disobedience"

not what I read

I read "pick up a gun" and follow panther's example, as if they led a charge for american coup (which they didn't)

civil disobedience is another thing all together, and that's not what mr. bloody revolution was talking about. note the word "civil" without attachment to the word "war"

massive civil disobedience is what *I* was talking about.

it's clear that you do not consider iraqis to be human beings.

if your family or your neighors were being subjected to what iraqis are being subjected to right now, you most certainly would kill to stop it. that is, if you had anything approaching love in your heart.

but you prefer marching in permitted little circles and then rushing home to see yourself on tv and feel great about yourself because you "did something against the war."

you are a hateful, violent, selfish person. you do NOTHING while thousands die and you have the power to stop it. that's why it gets you so upset to hear someone who comes from a position of love and action.

that's a straw man you dick

basically it's time you put up or shut up

I want to hear about you John Browning a military base tonight

no more talk. no more BS, just go and do it. lead by example

or show yourself to be another worthless chickenhawk who criticizes others and does nothing himself

yes, you were talking about civil disobediance.

and, yes, that is a completely ridiculous, hateful, thing to say while human beings (iraqis) are being tortured to death right before our eyes.

if it were YOUR family, you would not sit by for one second blocking roads or chanting kumbaya. you would ACT with love in your heart. well, that is if you had any.

but iraqis aren't your family or even americans. so you consider them worthy of a few words here and there or maybe even a ticket for blocking the intersection of bush&powell. wow, you are SUCH a humanitarian.

meanwhile, iraqis are being raped, tortured, and killed unabated.

yup, no more BS.

i would like to hear about YOU doing something EFFECTIVE against the war.

sitting down at bush&powell and getting the charges dropped didn't do it.

you hate iraqis so much that you use them to make yourself feel good even as they die and are tortured and raped. then you get really upset when someone calls you on it.

you're arguing with straw men about sitting on market street. I never said such a thing. I just called you out on your manson-esque BS

you're the one calling for armed insurection, and saying that if people don't take up arms they are hateful of iraqis or whatever.

so, what are you doing? do you hate iraqis? where is your armed insurection? or are you too chickenshit to do it on your own? or would you prefer chichenhawk-style that others do your fighting for you?

again, put up or shut up. I want to hear about you hitting a military arms depot tonight in tomorrow's news, or assassinating a cop, like you said people should do. put your own neck out there. do something now, or hang that hating iraquis albatross around your own neck

it's all so much blither blather until your own actions meet your words

I look forward to reading in tomorrow's news about your iraqi-loving, american-hating, revolution-starting actions tonight. how serious are you about what you say? surely you are not accusing others of things you are too chicken to do yourself. just how will you set things in motion?

the suspense is killing me.

Viva la Revolucion!!!

As we all know by now, the Senate dropped the provisions making it a felony to be an undocumented worker and a felony to aid undocumented workers. According to KPFA news, they also sent The Dream Act, an education bill for immigrants, to the full Senate. Of course, the rest of the year will be spent kicking this political football around as the House will have to agree to the final bill. This is the "democracy" the immigrants claim they are here for. As time goes on, they will learn what we all have learned: There is no freedom, democracy or opportunity in capitalist America. unless one is willing to either promote US imperialism and its wars and/or exploit the workingclass.

There was a demonstration on Monday, March 27, 2006 in the middle of the day in SF, with the usual American & Mexican flags, both of which do not belong in any demonstration. The red flag is the workers' flag; all national flags are the bosses' flags. April 10 is also a weekday, a Monday, difficult for most people to attend. We will also hear of demonstrations for immigrants during the Cinco de Mayo celebrations and all the rest of the year.

As to the SF Catholic Church, this weekend, the Catholic Church was attacking the right to abortion with tables on the sidewalks of San Francisco outside their churches. This is certainly a violation of the church's tax exempt status. Religion by deifnition is supserstition, and depending on a bankrupt supsertitious gang like the Catholic Church to lead anything is insulting and reactionary. Our response to this increased political activity on the part of the anti-abortion fascists whenever we see them should be: Abortion is a right, science is knowledge; evolution is a fact.

Considering Southern California has 25 million of California's 36 million peoplel, and Los Angeles public schools are 73% Latino (out of some 800,000 students), it is perfectly reasonable that Los Angeles takes the lead in California in a massive demonstration on immigration. They did the job; they got the Senate to move against the worst provisions of the publicity-stunt House bill, which was not at all feasible but rather an election stunt, catering to the reactionary voters, who are most voters. The entire House is up for election this year while only 1/3 of the Senate is.

Our demonstrations nationwide and locally obviously do have an effect; Bush is desperately trying to build support for his warmongering, and is losing. However, Northern California is by far the smaller part of California. In statewide elections, most state propositions and state races are decided by Southern California. It is long overdue that Los Angeles take the lead in all California demonstrations. Considering we are a state of 36 million people, having 2 million demonstrate on this immigration issue is just a small beginning.

"It's clear that you do not consider iraqis to be human beings.

if your family or your neighors were being subjected to what iraqis are being subjected to right now, you most certainly would kill to stop it. that is, if you had anything approaching love in your heart."

No, it was done poorly. Cluster bombs are not needed to get one man out of power, and now that he is out of power, what the hell are we doing over there? The Iraqis are setting up the government that is best for themselves and it's time to get the hell out.

What ever happened to good ol' assassinations?

>the only revolution that can happen will be people uniting together to strike nationwide or massive civil disobedience to shut down society as we know it

"Nationwide"!?! Wont work. Rise up in one country and be crushed by the rest. Capitalism is global. So, too, must be our resistance. We must rise up simultaneously across the globe. This will require a degree of organization that we have yet to build. We have much work to do.

and the truth shall set us free

running into the streets willy-nilly, or even with a specific target or two, at this point in history is bound to lead to a miserable and bloody failure, even if you had, say, 25% of the population on your side

nationwide, major cities or states, massive civil disobedience can indeed be the begining of the end of the current system of injustices, not the be all and end all but a solid start. shit, california is what like the 7th largest world economy and the effects would ripple everywhere. do it here and this country and the world will take note. even a couple of large california cities like SF and LA could put a hurtin' on many other areas if they shut down completely

about the whole world rising up at once, now that's a piece of utopian pie in the sky as it has never been done in the history of the world

perhaps the truth actually lies somewhere in between

This was once true. Cost prohibited transcontinental, grass roots organizing. Now we have the internet. It's spreading very, very quickly. Soon it will be in every village and on every farm. Already it has enabled people to organize simultaneous demos on four continents, five if you count those scientists in Antarctica, that included somewhere between 13 and 20 million people, depending on whose version you believe. It did not, of course, have any effect on the invasion of Iraq.But it did prove the concept. yeah, it can be done. Eventually we'll be able to mobilize 200 million on the same day. Then we can grow it to two billion. Then we can think about making real change on this planet.

We get some of what we try for and none of what we don't try for. It's time to think big. Thinking small has proved a dismal failure.

as soon as someone stands up and points out the hypocrisy of those that march around in little circles so that they can feel good about themselves while iraqis die at the hands of ther friends and relatives, one can see the reaction of the delusional, selfish, extremely violent pacifists.

they tell us 'the state will wipe you and your peashooters out!' seemingly relishing the idea... and supporting the thought of an all-powerful daddy state. guess what, morons, the state will gladly mow you down with gunfire too - at the moment you become an ACTUAL THREAT to what they are doing. as long as you march around burning sage and dancing in the streets, you are serving them. they point to you and say "see, we have an open society!" - meanwhile iraqis are raped, tortured, and killed.

they tell us 'go! kill! see what happens to you!' again seemingly relishing the thought of our deaths. meanwhile, they will be sitting at home, enjoying the latest PBS/NPR/Pacifica lies, and patting themselves on the back for being oh-so-peaceful (while iraqis die) and oh so morally high (while iraqis die).

during vietnam you had millions of pacifist scumbags filling the streets of america. what did it win? it won nixon. and what did nixon do? he added 2 million cambodians to the 3 million-high pile of dead vietnamese bodies.

and what did these brave american pacifists do? well, after a couple of them got murdered at kent state, not much of anything. after that it was all EST, TM, cults, disco, and other me-me-ME bullshit. oh right, i forgot, the demonstrations were just the cool thing to do; it got you laid afterall.

meanwhile vietnamese and cambodians died. and were torturted. and raped.

and here we are 40 years later. and americans are doing it again. murderers in the white house screaming war! murderers in the streets of san francisco singing peace!

straw man arguements are sure easy to make, huh? "relish the idea" and "love the state" blah blah so much crap

well, you love iraqis so much/hate protesters so much

why don't you do something?

everyone but you is an idiot, mm-hm

lead the way, bright shining star, start the killing today, light the fire of the BIG revolution, set off the next american civil war, you shall be the next John Brown. go for it

but wait, I notice that your actions last night didn't match your rhetoric and I didn't read about you doing anything bold last night. no armed insurrection. no assassination of cops. just more of your meaningless blather in comment threads and more condescension toward just about everyone else

well, the time for action is now! right? you rate yourself as an old time activist. well, you've sure been ineffective for a long long time, and you want to blame everyone else.

time to get up, stand up, and put your actions in line with your blither blather. get busy. start the revolution. time to start slaughtering "evil" americans. what are you waiting for? do you yourself hate iraqis?

oh, wait, nevermind, that's just BS spewing from your mouth not any kind of sincere intentions. you just sit there and do next to nothing and slag off on others who are trying to do something, even if it doesn't rise up to your bloody manson-esque fantasies

get real. go kill somebody or shut the fuck up, you pathetic washed up poseur

"and here we are 40 years later. and americans are doing it again."

Acculturated Americans are greedy fuckin throat-slashing human garbage and always have been. The Golden Age of dissidence and egalitarianism in the US (1880s to 1930s) wasn't the work of typical Americans, who've always been throat-slashing human garbage, but of IMMIGRANTS, who poured into this country in huge numbers during those years and brought non-throat-slashing-human-garbage sensibilities with them. Of course, all their descendants are now... you got it: greedy fuckin throat-slashing human garbage. That's what privilege does.

The '60s and '70s were a feeble echo of the Golden Age. Most of the '60s peace crowd were just shallow frauds out looking for the next party, the next score, the next hot hippy girl giving it away for free, etc. The proof of what frauds they were is that now they're the greediest fuckin throat-slashing human garbage in US history. The deepening gloom of fascism we're seeing now is **THEIR OWN** handiwork, LOL!

So much for "America the shining beacon of hope." Ah well, that was never anything but PT Barnum bullshit anyway. Bye-bye, America! Your glory days are over now, America! Sizzle and scream in hell, America! You deserve nothing less, America! And if you had a particle of honesty you'd know it, America! But you don't cuz you're greedy fuckin throat-slashing human garbage, America! You think you're above justice, America! But you're not, America! HAHAHAHA