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Indybay Feature

Al-Quds (Jerusalem) International Day 2005 :::Special Edition:::

by al-masakin
PORTLAND, Ore., Oct. 31—(al-Masakin) The International Day of Quds was observed with vigor by Muslim Shi’ites around the world Oct. 28, boycotted by Sunni’ites. In Portland, Jerusalem Day organizers after 26 years of protesting on this day were incapable of producing an event worthy of media coverage. International Jerusalem Day that was declared by Imam Khomeini in 1979.
yom.al.quds.special.2005.jpg
In the Iranian capital millions took to the streets declaring their commitment to defend the Holy city of Jerusalem and in support of the remarks of the Iranian President Mahmud Ahmadi Nejad’s remarks to the effect that “Israel” must be “wiped out.” Demonstrators reportedly chanted "Israel must be annihilated…we support Palestinians…Quds belongs to Muslims.”

The Tehran Times reported that former Iranian president and Expediency Council Chairman Akbar Hashemi Rafsanjani said in his Friday sermon at Tehran University that Palestinian nation the most oppressed people in the world due to the catastrophes inflicted upon them by Zionism and the global arrogance.

According to al-Manar Television the Palestinian people celebrating this day under the most cruel and inhumane military occupation: “tens of thousands were not allowed into the Aqsa Mosque to perform the Last Friday prayer in Holy Ramadan, they were face with soldiers who threw on them tear gas and hot water. In Syria Palestinians and Syrians celebrated the occasion in Yarmouk refugee camp. Thousands demonstrated in the streets of the camp raising flags of Palestine, Palestinian factions, and Hezbollah.
Most of the slogans stressed on the importance of preserving the Weapons of the Resistance.” Al-Manar Television also reported that Muslims in Jakarta besieged the US embassy and chanted: "Go to hell USA and Israel."

Al-Manar Television was placed on Washington’s list of terrorist organizations in 2004. The FBI threatened al-Masakin in March of 2005 with the same fate.

Lebanon’s Daily Star reported that Palestinian refugees at massive rally in Ain al-Hilweh refugee camp in Sidon “spoke with a unified voice on Friday in rejecting UN Security Council Resolution 1559, stressing the need to maintain the weapons of the Palestinian resistance.” The resistance groups assembled there displayed a banner that read: “The liberation of Palestine is the duty of every Muslim.” Fatah Secretary General in South Lebanon Khaled Aref reported said: “In the name of the Palestine Liberation Organization and Fatah, we declare that the arms of the resistance inside and outside Palestine are sacred and will never be an issue for discussion.”

The Gulf Daily News reported that thousands of people chanted "Death to America and Israel" as they demonstrated in support of the Palestine in Manama Bahrain. Carrying Palestinian flags and chanting Islamic slogans they marched along the Shaikh Khalifa bin Salman Highway, separating Sanabis from the Seef District. The protest culminated in the burning of hand-made Israeli and American flags and an effigy painted in red, white and blue, resembling American symbol Uncle Sam. A large American flag was also laid on the road for demonstrators to stamp over. Aljezeera Info reported 5,000 Bahraini demonstrators, mainly Shiites, took to streets who criticized the recent

government decision to lift the ban on Israeli imports, announcing the launch of a petition signing effort to reject normalization of relations with Israel.

They also called on Arab and Islamic countries to bar the United States from using their grounds as a launching pad for attacks against other Arab and Muslim nations.

In Beirut, Lebanon tens of thousands of flag-waving supporters cheered and applauded, more than 6,000 Hezbollah guerrillas in black, olive and green military uniforms and fatigues marched in formation through Hezbollah's south Beirut.


Members of the Hezbollah military showed off their commando training with spectacular aerial acrobatics during the annual rally to mark Al-Quds Day, Jerusalem Day, in the southern suburbs of Beirut, Lebanon, Friday, Oct. 28, 2005.

Hezbollah paraded its army in Beirut in a massive show of strength to counter international calls to disarm. Meanwhile Hezbollah Secretary General Sheik Hassan Nasrallah backed beleaguered Syria in the face of intense pressure over the U.N. probe into the assassination of a Lebanese former Prime Minister Rafik Hariri.

In al-Quds itself, Zionist Gestapo fired stun grenades at worshipers trying to enter the masjid al-Aqsa. According to Hezbollah news sources, the Jewish Gestapo Mishtarah and Jerusalem city police threw stun grenades at hundreds of Palestinians gathered at the A-Ram checkpoint north of Jerusalem (al-Quds) on Friday morning, in an effort to maintain the closure imposed on the West Bank in the wake of Wednesday’s bombing in Hadera.
The Palestinians were trying to reach Jerusalem Old City so they could pray at the al-Aqsa Mosque on the last Friday of the Islamic holy month of Ramadan.
Some members of the crowd attempted to break through the checkpoint,
spurring security forces to use the stun grenades, the Border Police said.

No casualties were reported.

Police officers were deployed throughout the Old City and at the entrances to al-Quds on Friday as some 200,000 Muslim worshipers prayed at the al-Aqsa Mosque, “Israel” Radio

Furious demonstrations also erupted in Karachi, Berlin, and Damascus. Pro-
Palestinian demonstrators clashed with a Zionazi counter demonstration in Berlin. Militant demonstrations were also reported in Copenhagen, London, and elsewhere in Europe.

A mighty show of solidarity was made in Damascus, Syria. AsiaNews.IT reported that tens of thousands of people take to the streets to protest against the charges made against Syria by the UN which recently voted to implement Un resolution 1559 which calls for the disarmament of Hezbollah and several Palestinian resistance groups.

In Syria, the grand Mufti of the Syrian Arab Republic Ahmed El Hassoun appealed to tens of thousands of people in the capital’s main square attacking the injustices and challenges the country is facing in a delicate moment when the “United States and its allies are trying to trick people with their ‘political’ accusations.” He renewed his appeal for the liberation of Jerusalem from all the enemies of God and Islam, criticizing the terrorist acts committed by the Israelis against Syria’s allies.

Hezbollah’s Sec. General Sayyed Hassan Nasrallah remarked “We don’t accept legality from Red-Larsen or anyone else.” Referring to Kofi Annan’s envoy Terje-Roed Larsen (Terry Roed Larsen) who spearheaded the measure.

The Arab Monitor Addressing a vast crowd of participants in the celebrations of World Day in solidarity with Jerusalem, the secretary general of Hezbollah called on the Arab League to stop the project to install "an international mandate on Lebanon" and to halt mounting aggressions against Syria. Sheikh Hassan Nasrallah accused main Western governments of supporting Israel at the expense of the Palestinians and the Arabs, was supported by voices in the Arab press. Nasrallah accused important Arab states like Egypt and Saudi Arabia of adopting a passive attitude towards American ambitions to dominate the region, pointing out that Syria was being punished for refusing to capitulate. He asked in public how it was possible that the text of the international investigation report had been leaked to Israel before being handed over to the UN Secretary General.

Nasrallah also denounced the report of Kofi Annan's envoy Terry Roed Larsen which he accused of implanting division and sectarianism between the Lebanese and the Palestinians and among Lebanese themselves, as well as between the Lebanese resistance and the government, stating furthermore that "the aim of Larsen and his masters is to disarm the Palestinian camps and the Lebanese national resistance" and accusing Larsen of "practicing international mandating on Lebanon". The former Lebanese Prime Minister Selim al-Hoss also warned against the dangers of foreign intervention in Lebanese internal affairs and of using the UN Security Council resolution 1559 as a tool to force divisions on the Lebanese people. Hoss invited to take action against these dangers by unifying the ranks against foreign projects.

Nasrallah’s speech accused the Americans and the international community, the latter guilty in his views, “of being enslaved to the interests of the mighty”.

Nasrallah reiterated his full support to Syria, a “sister country”, and expressed his conviction Syria was not involved in the assassination of former Lebanese Prime Minister Rafik Hariri.




He also denounced the danger of the United Nations reports—one by German prosecutor Detlev Mehlis; the other by Norwegian Terry Roed Larsen —and



called for the “truth about the Hariri assassination, which is not in the Mehlis report but concealed in the hearts of the true accomplices”.

Nasrallah thanked the true lovers of peace, not only in Lebanon and in Syria, but also around the world, a world that is still seeking a true, lasting and just peace through a just solution to the Palestinian question.

Finally, the Hezbollah leader said that his group was prepared to meet all components of Lebanon’s society and expressed total respect for the common values that bind Christians and Muslims.

Al-Masakin
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by tehran tim
Leader renews call for referendum on status of Palestine

Tehran Times Political Desk
TEHRAN – In an address to officials and people from all walks of life on the occasion of Eid-ul-Fitr, Supreme Leader of the Islamic Revolution Ayatollah Seyyed Ali Khamenei reiterated Iran’s position on the need to hold a referendum to allow the Palestinian people to determine their destiny.

Ayatollah Khamenei said here on Friday that Eid-ul-Fitr (the holiday marking the end of the holy month of Ramadan) is one of the shared experiences of the entire Islamic world and should be used to unify Muslim nations.

“Today Islamic nations have awakened, and the Islamic Ummah has become an undeniable reality in the world. God willing, the hope that the Islamic Republic of Iran has implanted in the hearts of Muslim nations by raising the banner of Islam will bear fruit,” he stated.

He thanked Iranians and other Islamic nations for reviving the issue of Palestine by participating massively in the World Qods Day demonstrations on October 28.

“If the occupiers of Palestine and their international supporters thought that the issue of Qods would be forgotten, today, thanks to the Palestinians’ resistance and the Islamic world’s decisive stance toward the issue, this unfounded idea no longer exists.”

The Supreme Leader noted that any retreat by Islamic countries in regard to the policies of the global arrogance, and particularly the aggressive U.S. administration, would only further embolden those powers.

“Major world powers, despite their propaganda and commotion, do not enjoy unlimited and absolute power and will not be able to realize their demands if nations resist them. For example, the situation in Iraq did not turn out as the occupiers had wanted, although Iran is extremely suspicious of U.S and Israeli intelligence agencies in regard to the daily terrorist acts that occur in that country.”

By resisting the global arrogance, the Palestinian and Islamic nations will prevent the powers that be from reaching their goals, Ayatollah Khamenei noted.

“Iran’s stance toward the Palestinian issue is a logical stance which we have frequently repeated, i.e., that the Palestinians should be allowed to elect the government of Palestine through a free referendum and that this legitimate government should try the criminals of Palestine, including (Israeli Prime Minister Ariel) Sharon, in a fair court.

“This logical proposal is also a means to test the honesty of those who claim to be upholding democracy and human rights in the world.”

Earlier in the day, in a sermon to thousands of worshipers attending the Eid-ul-Fitr prayers, the Leader said that the Iranian nation would not give in to oppression.

Ayatollah Khamenei stated, "Our nation is firm, brave, and determined and will not invade any other nation nor trample upon anyone’s rights, but our people will not tolerate oppression and (others) trampling on their rights, no matter who the oppressor is.

"The world knows you as a nation that seriously pursues and achieves its objectives.”

Recalling the seizure of the U.S. Embassy in Tehran, which is called the "Den of Spies" in Iran, Ayatollah Khamenei said Iranians gave voice to their suffering on November 4, 1979 -- the day the Students Following the Imam's Line captured the embassy.

“November 4 is the symbol of the Iranian nation’s oppression, but, although the great Iranian nation has been oppressed, it will not tolerate oppression,” he added.

The Leader extended his congratulations to the Muslim nation of Iran and the Islamic Ummah on the auspicious occasion of Eid-ul-Fitr, calling it a real feast.

He also advised all Iranians and all political parties of various persuasions to rely on themselves and their great Iranian identity in order to attain their rightful place.
by al-masakin
In the Name of God, the Compassionate, the Merciful

The Religious Authority, Ayatullah Al Ozma Sayyed M. H. Fadlullah delivered the two Friday prayer sermons at the Imamain Al-Hassanain Mosque, Ramadan 24 1426 H,October 28 2005 A.D. Several prominent religious scholars, dignitaries and thousands of believers attended the Jumu’a prayer.


The Jerusalem (Quds) Day:
Let us remember Ali's struggle and knowledge



The First Sermon

In the Name of God, the Compassionate, the Merciful

Today is the last Friday in the month of Ramadan because the Eid according to accurate astronomical calculations is next Thursday, based on our juristic ruling that is originated from the possibility of seeing the moon in the countries that we share part of the night with . And in this occasion, we ask Allah to make it a happy and blessed day full of victory for all the believers and the downtrodden.

Jerusalem a symbol of Palestine:

Today is also the Jerusalem day that is meant to remind all people of Jerusalem being a symbol of all Palestine… Palestine that was usurped by the Jews, supported by international plots of America, Europe and several other countries that legalized the Jewish usurpation of Palestine through a UN resolution. Moreover if they have considered Jerusalem as a debatable issue, they tended to follow the Israeli point of view.

Therefore, we need to keep the anniversary of the fall of Jerusalem in mind to liberate it in the future provided that the Muslims become strong enough to do that.

Ali, the knowledgeable believer

In this respect, we have also to remember our Imam, Ali bin Abi Talib (a.s), who lived all his life with the people and for the people. He struggled to give the people a mind like his, a heart like his, and a righteousness like his. He wanted to raise the people to the level that draws them near God, so that they will unify God, the most exalted, and obey Him.

When he was in his mosque in Kufa, and even when he was in Medina, He used to give sermons in which he preached and warned for he was responsible for succeeding the Messenger (p.) in preserving Islam as well as running the affairs of Muslims.

Ali (a.s.) was the only companion who had all the knowledge of Islam; He says: "The Messenger of Allah taught me 1000 branches of knowledge; from each one thousand doors were opened for me".

The Messenger (p.) said: "I am the city of knowledge and Ali is its door; who wants to enter the city should come through the door".

That is why we saw that after the death of the Prophet (p.) , Ali (a.s.) did not have to ask anybody about anything, for he knew all thought and knowledge. One of the Arab famous linguists, Al-khalil bin Ahmad says when he was asked "why do you prefer Ali (a.s.)”: "He needs nobody and everybody needs him, proving that he is the Imam of everybody". Everybody used to need Ali, while he needed no one . People from other religions used to come to the caliphs and ask them, but more often than not they used to send them to Ali (a.s) because they could not find an answer, and that is how the saying that "Had it not been for Ali (a.s.), Omar would have been doomed" came to be.

Adhering to the line of Righteousness:

In this age, we are in need of Imam Ali (a.s) who should always be present with us in his knowledge as well as his sacrifice dedication and all the other traits of his personality.

He says in the context of teaching people how to learn Islam when they read the Quran and to understand it.

"Allah the most Exalted says: As for those who say: Our Lord is Allah, then continue in the right way, the angels descend upon them, saying: Fear not, nor be grieved, and receive good news of the garden which you were promised. Show us the straight way ,to His worship
You have said: "Our Lord is Allah". Then keep steadfast to His Book, to the way of His command and to the virtuous course of . Thereafter do not go out of it, do not introduce innovations in it, and do not turn away from it, because those who go away from this course will be cut off from (the mercy of) Allah on the Day of Judgment. You said so which means that Allah is your reference in religion and in every thing you do or say, since he is the one who decides on everything and the only one who knows what will happen in the future, worship Him and do not ascribe any partners to Him in all your actions . Beware from destroying your manners and changing them, maintaining one tongue. A man should controls his tongue because it is obstinate with its master. By Allah, I do not find that fear of Allah benefits a man who practices it unless he controls his tongue. Certainly the tongue of a believer is at the back of his heart while the heat of a hypocrite is at the back of his tongue; because, when a believer intends to say anything, he thinks it over in his mind. If it is good he discloses it, but if it is bad he lest it remain concealed. While a hypocrite speaks whatever comes to his tongue, without knowing what is in his favor and what goes against him.

The Prophet of Allah – peace and blessing of Allah be upon him and his descendants – said: "The belief of a person cannot be firm unless his heart is firm, and his heart cannot be firm unless his tongue is firm". So whoever of you can manage to meet Allah, the Sublime, in such a position that his hands are unsmeared with the blood of Muslims and their property and his tongue is safe from exposing them, he should do so.

This is the line of righteousness in which are stand in each prayer to say: Show us the straight path, The path of those upon whom Thou hast bestowed favors. Not (the path) of those upon whom Thy wrath is brought down, nor of those who go astray. And we also read His saying: Verily, this is My way, leading straight: follow it: follow not (other) paths: they will scatter you about from His (great) path: thus doth He command you. that ye may be righteous

And this is what we have to educate ourselves on in this month.

The Second Sermon

In the Name of God, the Compassionate, the Merciful


Israel: More killing and destruction:

Israel still acts as if did not withdraw from Gaza. It tries to thwart any attempt to reach an agreement with the Palestinians over the crossing points, and the road that links between Gaza and the Western Bank, because it acts out of a deeply rooted inner hatred against the Palestinians, which is in turn a part or the historic Jewish complex against the Arabs and Muslims.

In addition, Israel continues to assassinate the Intifada militants and leaders as well as its invasions of the cities and towns of the West Bank, and the raids whether by air or by artillery on Gaza that target schools and charity organizations, killing civilians including children women and the elderly, it relies on very weak and false excuses, we have not heard any condemnations, whether by the US or any European state, despite the fact that these actions violate the ceasefire the Palestinians have agreed to abide by.

In acting in this way, Israel went to prove that the Palestinian problem is one of security and a political one. Thus, justifying its refusal to enter in the final status negotiations before destroying the Intifada infrastructure, which means a civil war between the Palestinians allowing Israel to win the war without having fight.


A message to the Enemy:

Thus, the Palestinian operations were in retaliation to the assassinations of their leaders. In this respect, the martyr operation of Khudaire is a message to the enemy that his aggression will not remain without punishment. Yet we find that the major powers, and even the Palestinian Authority have condemned this operation and considered it an act of terror, without studying its reasons, for these countries, with America in their forefront, believe that Israel has the right to eradicate the Palestinians while they don't have the right to defend themselves, with all the talks about human rights, and freedom notwithstanding.

It is the American racism that intersected with the Israeli one. This is what we saw in the latest meeting between the American president and the head of the PA, when Bush postponed the establishment of the Palestinian state into a time that lies beyond his presidency.

In the meantime Israel would have finished building its settlements and its separating well leaving the Palestinians with nothing to build their state on.

The Americans and their allies have created the notion of fighting terrorism to fight any resistance against occupation or any struggle for freedom.

They practice state terrorism and claim that it is legitimate in the name of freedom and democracy while they wish to destroy popular democracy and political and economic freedoms.

The Judizing of Jerusalem :

On the international day of Jerusalem, we notice that most Arab and Muslim countries are rushing towards Israel as a result of the America pressure on them. We are afraid that the conspiracy of Judizing Jerusalem and the Aqsa Mosque in particular have already begun, under the pretense of allowing the Jews to pray there… Faced by this, If the Muslims respect their Islam, they should start planning on how to confront this plot and protect their sacred shrines that represent their Islamic identity, since Jerusalem is the sacred symbol of Muslims and Islam.

Iraq: Occupation should withdraw :

As for Iraq which is still living in a river of blood spilled by the terrorism of the apostators, it is still living under a state of political division along sectarian lines, to the extent that Iraqis no longer feel their unity and the feeling of sectarianism is being implanted deep into the Iraqi national fabric, making the problem one between the Sunnis and the Shiites and not between the Iraqis and the occupation, although it is known that this occupation interferes with all aspects of Iraqi political life depriving the state from any real freedom to run its affairs, despite all the formalities that try to prove otherwise.

We call on the Iraqis to rise to the level of the current challenges to pursue their freedom and independence. They should expel the occupier out of their country in every possible means; they should know that the occupier has never been, and will never be, a savior of nations. It only seeks to serve its interests which, by definition, runs counter to that of the nation.

America, and Britain, have sunk in the Iraqi quagmire as a result of the people's resistance.

They now suffer from their own public opinion that demands withdrawal from Iraq, since the war was not legitimate. It was built on a big lie and did not gain international legitimacy. It has also cost them a lot of losses.

The Iraqi people should cling to their Islamic and national unity, no matter how deep the potential political differences are, since this is the only way to win their freedom.

Call for a national dialogue:

The US plans, along with those of France and Britain, aim at serving American's own interest by exploiting complications in Lebanon to put pressure on the region, especially Syria, that is pressurized to stop supporting the Intifada and expel the Mujahideen and consider them as terrorists.

It is also being asked to support the American occupation of Iraq and accused of interfering in Lebanon's domestic affairs, as well as other unattainable conditions.

Washington was trying to impose unattainable conditions on Syria, after Damascus was officially accused of interfering in Lebanon's domestic affairs.

The Lebanese should be aware that the central issue of the U.S. policy in Lebanon is not for Lebanon's interest, freedom and independence, but it the disarmament of the Resistance and the tangling of Palestinian refugee camps for Israel's interests. Lebanon is being used as a pressure card against Syria… (the U.S.) is mobilizing all of its pressure to serve its wide strategy.

Therefore, we have to study those plans in the light of the American and French interests and not the Lebanese. And we have to engage in a serious national dialogue to study the political and security situation in Lebanon, and particularity the country's relations with Syria, aiming at strengthening the historic relations between the two countries.

We appreciate the political figures rejection of the proposed sanctions on the Syrian people, since that will turn into a big problem for Lebanon. However, everybody agrees on the necessity to punish the criminals, whoever they are , but provided that there is substantial evidence against them .

There are many challenges and risks ahead for the region due to the U.S. Israeli alliance, which does not abide by international resolutions concerning Israeli terrorism.

However, this U.S. – Israeli alliance is currently focused on issuing resolutions against countries in the Arab world, particularly Lebanon and the Islamic state of Iran.

http://english.bayynat.org.lb/FridaySpeeches/ke28102005.htm
by Becky Johnson
" Jerusalem a symbol of Palestine:

Today is also the Jerusalem day that is meant to remind all people of Jerusalem being a symbol of all Palestine… Palestine that was usurped by the Jews,...."

BECKY: Many people remember the story of Jacob's Ladder from the Bible. Jacob, one of the Jewish patriarchs, fell asleep with his head on a rock, fearing he would not survive the night. His fear was so great, that prior to falling asleep he had prayed to God that were he to survive the night, he would return one day and build a temple on the spot. That night, as he slept he dreamt of a ladder studded with angels ascending into heaven and to God. Jacob survived the night, and did return to build the temple. Thus was the beginning of the Holy Temple Mount in Jewish scriptures, and the founding of Jerusalem where the Mount is located.

This was 1500 B.C. Palestine, the Roman occupier's name for the ancient State of Israel, didn't come into being until after the burning of the Temple to the ground in 70 A.D. and following a failed rebellion which was crushed in 135 A.D.

Islam didn't come into being until the 610 A.D

Throughout this period (135 A.D. - 1948) despite the persecution, some Jews remained in the area of ancient Israel, continued to pray to their God and practice their religion, and to toast each Passover saying "Next year in Jerusalem!".

So, the Jews preceeded any Muslim presence in Israel by 2110 years. The Jewish people have had a continuous presence with the land of Israel for 3, 300 years. The Jews and Israel pre-dated the name "Palestine" as well, which was neither an Arabic name nor an Islamic name. Many Jews returned over the years so that by 1844, Jerusalem had a majority Jewish population.

The name Palestine was never more than the name for a geographical region, and disappeared completely under the Ottomans. The name was resurrected in modern times by leading British generals who were openly anti-Jewish. While some Britishers favored enacting the 1917 Balfour Declaration, which was adopted after decades of lobbying by Zionists in Europe, by the League of Nations, other generals wanted nothing to do with helping re-establish a Jewish State in the region.

Hence, in 1917, when the British government was awarded a large part of the Turkish Ottoman empire, which had ruled the lands of ancient Israel for the past 400 years, they named it "the British Mandate for Palestine," rather than the name more desired by the Jews, Israel.

In 1917, Palestine was much larger than Samaria, Judea, and Gaza. 77% of the British Mandate for Palestine became TransJordan in 1921. Therefore, the remaining 23% was the area the UN resolution 181 voted to partition into a Jewish state = Israel and an Arab state = Palestine.

Islam's connection with Jerusalem is quite tenous. First, Mohammed never visited Jerusalem in his lifetime. It is not mentioned once in the Koran. Moslems pray facing Mecca.

The Al Aqsa Mosque, built on top of a Christian Church, erected on top of the Jewish Temple Mount only shows conquest,plagarism, and disrespect for the Jewish faith.

Jerusalem is no "symbol of Palestine." Palestine is however a symbol of theft, deceit, conquest, and occupation.






by two interacting brain cells
But your "we were there 2,000 years ago" talking point is absolutely asinine. A territorial claim this dated is completely meaningless in the real world, i.e. anywhere outside the head of a rabid pro-Israel baby-killer like you. And that's even assuming modern diaspora Jews are pure lineal descendants of the ancient Hebrews, which they're not, they just follow the same religion. To say this gives them a right to Israel is like saying Irish-Catholics have a right to the territory of Constantine's Holy Roman Empire. Yeah, that's right, the "logic" is EXACTLY the same, i.e. stupid as fuck
by can't weee allll just geta long
Why can't wee allll just geta long????
by yeah, sure
Just as soon as the crypto-fascist zionist mind-cops stop shoving their talking points on a website they wouldn't spend two seconds in otherwise.
by keep up the good work
keep on with the debate...it's entertaining to read sometimes.....
by there are haters on both sides
who will mock and ridicule peace.

they are both on the same side. on the other side is humanity.
by Tia
Talking points:
Its an interesting concept- some Zionists have been criticized because their defense of Israel often sounds like a series of talking points ie: Israel is a democracy; Israel gives full civil rights to its Arab citizens, etc.

The Palestinians, and their hosts at Big oil have realized the use of "talking points" can be effective in many circumstances, and as a result have recommneded some changes in the way their constituency discusses these issues. These are being publicized in many circles- clearly some of the regular Indy Bay regulars have already experienced their indoctrination, er, learning of these "talking points"

* They recommend the use of the term "self determination" to discribe the palestinains quest.

* They recommend blaming the issue of terrorism/suicide bombing on the "occupation"

* They recommend using the term "economic leverage" instead of "divestment" in regards to a boycott of Israel

*They recommend couching the conflict in terms of a civil rights struggle rather than a political struggle.

There are pages of recommendations, of these "talking points"- painstakingly prepared by a Wall Street Public Relations firm, paid for by your $3.00 a gallon petrol. They'll be coming to a protest near you. Very grassroots.
by you have some evidence for that?
because, if it's true, i am gladdened.

it 's high time the palestinians discovered good PR.

if they had it, they wouldnt need the desperate and dangerous method of blowing themselves up to be heard. that means it would be a win for the israelis, too.
by Tia
The evidence is sitting right in front of me. I see it for what it is. If you do an A.N.S.W.E.R. training or an I.S.M training or any other "grassroots" training you'll hear about it, too.

Now they have the best PR that money can buy. I would rather they put that money into schools for their children, or health and human services, but perhaps that is my western bias. I also long for the time that people will stop blowing themselves up and start working for peace. Too many people have died- and the Palestinians have long been used as a pawn by their own leaders, and the leaders of the Arab world.
by i mean empirical evidence.
show me a source that says it, that i can go independently verify says the words you say it says.

or are you your own source? is that what you mean? do you mean, really, that YOU say so?
by physical evidence
I went to a training conference. I have the conference materials.
I went to a workshop where we practiced "our talking points" in various role playing scenarios.
It was facinating, and very well attended. When you see the time, money and effort involved, you realize the roots of the Palestinian movement for "self determination" are anything but "grassroots"
by good show
now, what in this material indicates the existence of a hired PR firm?

please, be as specific as possible.

and, how may this information be independently verified by anyone who cares to?
by I'lam
You know the word in Arabic for news is the same as the one for Public relations.

We were told it was prepared by a public relations firm. I will check my notes to see if they mentioned the firm, or if it is listed in the references. Copies of current talking points were widely distributed. I can scan them and post them here, if you feel you aren't current with the lingo. But it will be just a matter of time before they are incorporated into various bay area trainings. Except for how they want to handle the divestment, er , economic leverage issues, most of it wasn't that different than you'd expect.
by please do
i would be extremely interested, and surely others would be as well... on all sides of the question.

this is indeed big news.............
by Audit
What the ISM, ANSWER, MEca etc really need is an audit. How much tainted money from undisclosed, illcit sources REALLY funds them.
by Becky Johnson
Read about discrepancies of funding of the ISM, MECA and others at:

http://www.frontpagemag.com/Articles/ReadArticle.asp?ID=19908
by Becky Johnson
Reply to Two interacting Brain Cells:
"A territorial claim this dated is completely meaningless in the real world...."

BECKY: My comment was on the historical connections with the land of Israel and on the relative impropriety of the use of the name "Palestine."

Where in the lead article does it prove the claim that Jerusalem is a Palestinian city, much less the "heart" of Palestine?

Surely you have heard those who claim the Palestinian Arabs are the "indigenous" people and that the Zionists are "European colonialists." I think I've thoroughly put that theory into the dust.

My TERRITORIAL CLAIMS have to do with the 1917 Balfour Declaration, the League of Nations, UN resolution 181 & 242, as well as land purchased by the early Zionists. One can also look at the Geneva Convention rules regarding territories conquered in a defensive war, which the UN determined the 1967 war was.

by al-masakin
al.quds.hezbollah.comandos.28oct05.jpg
ADVANCE FOR JAN. 21-22 TO GO WITH STORY LENANON HEZBOLLAH CHALLENGE BY ZEINA KARAM Members of the Hezbollah guerilla group show military skills in the air as people watch them from a building during the annual rally to mark Al-Quds Day, Jerusalem Day, in the southern suburbs of Beirut, Lebanon, in this Friday, Oct. 28, 2005, file photo. From a shadowy group linked to some of the worst violence of the 1980s, to a potent guerrilla force and a mainstream political party, Hezbollah has managed to reinvent itself over the years and ensure its survival as a strong player in Lebanon's complex politics. But with the collapse of the power in Lebanon of its main Syrian backers and the political upheaval in a country trying to wean itself from decades of Syrian tutelage, the militant group may now be facing its greatest challenges yet. (AP Photo/Hussein Malla, File)
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