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ANSWER is not the Answer
Watched most of the antiwar rally that commenced in DC on Sat. It was organized primarily by ANSWER, a Stalinoid sect that has, from what I can see, zero contact with the working people it claims to champion, but which does one hell of a job getting rally and march permits in DC. And as I expected, the majority of speakers either parroted the ANSWER line or stayed close to it. What is the ANSWER line? Go here and read for yourself -- and if sucking up to a decrepit monarchy in northern Korea doesn't jazz you, then I suggest you look up some of their dispatches from Saddam's Iraq. ANSWER and its many other manifestations loves those who murder and jail leftists and trade unionists, so long as said murderers mutter slogans they can co-opt.
Other than the Raging Grannies, an amiable group of older women who sing antiwar/anti-administration songs to the tunes of dated melodies, there wasn't a hint of original creativity seen on that stage. As I said, a fair number of speakers got to pretend they were Lenin, Mao, Che, Ho, or whatever revo-caricature they were imitating in their heads -- barking at the crowd, spitting out statements so old and tired they needed crutches to reach the mike. My daughter, who's fiercely antiwar, watched this with me and asked "Who the hell are these people?"
"Oh, most of them were around when I was active in New York."
As Ramsey Clark ambled onto the stage, I added, "And this guy -- I met him back in '90 with a few other activists who were against the build-up in the Gulf. He used to be LBJ's Attorney General who tried to throw Noam Chomsky in jail. He was pretty full of himself when I met him. Kind of a creep, actually. I later read about his cozy visits with Saddam, where they exchanged stories about their relatives while Iraqi dissidents were being tortured and killed. He's a fraud. But make up your own mind."
She continued watching the conga line of ANSWER-bots, then said, "They're all over the place. Why don't they stick to the war?"
"They don't care about the war -- hell, they support China's occupation of Tibet. They'll use whatever issue they can to inflate their importance. They're not progressive. They're assholes."
Still, there were bright spots. Several family members of those serving in Iraq were allowed to speak, and instantly brought some credibility to the pageant. Cindy Sheehan of course appeared, and received enthusiastic applause. Nancy Wolforth, Executive Vice President of the AFL-CIO, spoke about solidarity with Iraqi trade unionists. A representative from US Labor Against The War, a union group that also works with Iraqi trade unionists (as opposed to their killers), was given too little stage time, but at least was present. And that was pretty much it, save for celebs like Jessica Lange, Jesse Jackson, Ralph Nader, Al Sharpton and George Galloway who, as with any seasoned comic, used his best lines tested the night before on Bill Maher's "Real Time," where he appeared with, once again, Mr. C. Hitchens, reluctant, grimacing straightman to Galloway's clown persona.
I suspect that growing criticism of ANSWER's restricted speaker list and input from co-organizer United For Peace & Justice had a lot to do with the openings seen. But there were far too many topics addressed, most in demagogic, simplistic terms, to capture the casual C-SPAN viewer. The Iraq war and the fallacy of "the war on terror" should have been the sole focus. Wanna talk about Aristide? Stage a Haiti rally. Wanna praise Hugo Chavez? Put together a Hands Off Venezuela march. With the majority of Americans turning against the war, a leaner, tighter, more direct series of speakers (with labor groups, military relatives and dissident soldiers and Marines leading the way -- why wasn't someone from Iraq Veterans Against The War invited to speak?) would've been electrifying. And why not mix in some antiwar libertarians and Repubs? If you truly oppose the brutal status quo, I'd think you'd want to reach as many people as you can.
Nationalize the opposition to this war and the wars on the horizon. Don't let groups like ANSWER privatize it.
Naturally, many antiwar liberals were appalled by the ANSWER fest, and for good reason, as I've already said. But I do not share every one of their objections, some of which are, at this late date, rather surprising if not completely ridiculous. Of all the liberal criticisms I've read, none have topped Steve Gilliard's statement that --
"Palestine is really unpopular in the US, even among liberals."
Really? I know that most mainstream Dems toe the Greater Israel line, and have for decades. But I seem to recall as far back as 1988, at the Dem national convention in Atlanta, that a large group of party delegates won the right to introduce a plank to the party platform that favored "mutual recognition, territorial compromise and self determination for both Israelis and Palestinians." The party leadership so feared this outbreak of democracy that they struck a deal with the delegates: drop the platform request in favor of a debate about the issue. The delegates accepted, doubtless after much backroom pressure, and James Zogby ably debated Charles Schumer, who was booed as he defended Israeli expansion and air strikes on civilians.
Indeed, most polls I've seen over the years have shown that a majority of Americans are in favor of a two-state settlement, which is, in essence, a "pro-Palestinian" position. And thanks to the tireless efforts of Israeli, Arab and American activists, one can speak about Palestinian rights much more freely than you could twenty years ago. Shit man, even Bush has done it, regardless of how phony and corrupt his intentions.
Is Steve G. suggesting that American liberals are outside of this ongoing consensus? Or that they should be? While I agree with his view that the rally should have focused solely on the war, it's hard to divorce what's going on in Iraq from Israel/Palestine, which for those on the ground is the issue that frames regional debate.
But even without Sat's rally and march, the majority of Americans would remain against this war. Their -- our -- numbers are steady, and continue to grow.
Other than the Raging Grannies, an amiable group of older women who sing antiwar/anti-administration songs to the tunes of dated melodies, there wasn't a hint of original creativity seen on that stage. As I said, a fair number of speakers got to pretend they were Lenin, Mao, Che, Ho, or whatever revo-caricature they were imitating in their heads -- barking at the crowd, spitting out statements so old and tired they needed crutches to reach the mike. My daughter, who's fiercely antiwar, watched this with me and asked "Who the hell are these people?"
"Oh, most of them were around when I was active in New York."
As Ramsey Clark ambled onto the stage, I added, "And this guy -- I met him back in '90 with a few other activists who were against the build-up in the Gulf. He used to be LBJ's Attorney General who tried to throw Noam Chomsky in jail. He was pretty full of himself when I met him. Kind of a creep, actually. I later read about his cozy visits with Saddam, where they exchanged stories about their relatives while Iraqi dissidents were being tortured and killed. He's a fraud. But make up your own mind."
She continued watching the conga line of ANSWER-bots, then said, "They're all over the place. Why don't they stick to the war?"
"They don't care about the war -- hell, they support China's occupation of Tibet. They'll use whatever issue they can to inflate their importance. They're not progressive. They're assholes."
Still, there were bright spots. Several family members of those serving in Iraq were allowed to speak, and instantly brought some credibility to the pageant. Cindy Sheehan of course appeared, and received enthusiastic applause. Nancy Wolforth, Executive Vice President of the AFL-CIO, spoke about solidarity with Iraqi trade unionists. A representative from US Labor Against The War, a union group that also works with Iraqi trade unionists (as opposed to their killers), was given too little stage time, but at least was present. And that was pretty much it, save for celebs like Jessica Lange, Jesse Jackson, Ralph Nader, Al Sharpton and George Galloway who, as with any seasoned comic, used his best lines tested the night before on Bill Maher's "Real Time," where he appeared with, once again, Mr. C. Hitchens, reluctant, grimacing straightman to Galloway's clown persona.
I suspect that growing criticism of ANSWER's restricted speaker list and input from co-organizer United For Peace & Justice had a lot to do with the openings seen. But there were far too many topics addressed, most in demagogic, simplistic terms, to capture the casual C-SPAN viewer. The Iraq war and the fallacy of "the war on terror" should have been the sole focus. Wanna talk about Aristide? Stage a Haiti rally. Wanna praise Hugo Chavez? Put together a Hands Off Venezuela march. With the majority of Americans turning against the war, a leaner, tighter, more direct series of speakers (with labor groups, military relatives and dissident soldiers and Marines leading the way -- why wasn't someone from Iraq Veterans Against The War invited to speak?) would've been electrifying. And why not mix in some antiwar libertarians and Repubs? If you truly oppose the brutal status quo, I'd think you'd want to reach as many people as you can.
Nationalize the opposition to this war and the wars on the horizon. Don't let groups like ANSWER privatize it.
Naturally, many antiwar liberals were appalled by the ANSWER fest, and for good reason, as I've already said. But I do not share every one of their objections, some of which are, at this late date, rather surprising if not completely ridiculous. Of all the liberal criticisms I've read, none have topped Steve Gilliard's statement that --
"Palestine is really unpopular in the US, even among liberals."
Really? I know that most mainstream Dems toe the Greater Israel line, and have for decades. But I seem to recall as far back as 1988, at the Dem national convention in Atlanta, that a large group of party delegates won the right to introduce a plank to the party platform that favored "mutual recognition, territorial compromise and self determination for both Israelis and Palestinians." The party leadership so feared this outbreak of democracy that they struck a deal with the delegates: drop the platform request in favor of a debate about the issue. The delegates accepted, doubtless after much backroom pressure, and James Zogby ably debated Charles Schumer, who was booed as he defended Israeli expansion and air strikes on civilians.
Indeed, most polls I've seen over the years have shown that a majority of Americans are in favor of a two-state settlement, which is, in essence, a "pro-Palestinian" position. And thanks to the tireless efforts of Israeli, Arab and American activists, one can speak about Palestinian rights much more freely than you could twenty years ago. Shit man, even Bush has done it, regardless of how phony and corrupt his intentions.
Is Steve G. suggesting that American liberals are outside of this ongoing consensus? Or that they should be? While I agree with his view that the rally should have focused solely on the war, it's hard to divorce what's going on in Iraq from Israel/Palestine, which for those on the ground is the issue that frames regional debate.
But even without Sat's rally and march, the majority of Americans would remain against this war. Their -- our -- numbers are steady, and continue to grow.
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Well, I tell you...you might be right that most Americans are against this war, and it's growing, but without some pretty big demonstrations, nothing is going to happen....and possibly, even with...and Answer may not be the only answer, or the best answer, but they sure did put on a heck of a march...and it got a lot of press, and for that I give them a lot of credit.
Somebody's got to do it....and to get the numbers you have to be all inclusive....the issues are too big (Bush is too dangerous) to complain about any successful demonstation against him.
Somebody's got to do it....and to get the numbers you have to be all inclusive....the issues are too big (Bush is too dangerous) to complain about any successful demonstation against him.
while i agree with your criticism of ANSWER and that nothing can get done with them, as well as their lack of focus with the speakers...i want to know how this is any different from the scab union the AFL-CIO (who you praise) and their relation to workers struggles...
ANSWER has an agenda and ANSWER does the work. For whatever reason, they know how to do what needs to get done, and that way they get time to grandstand their own issues.
I don't see them - at all - as cozying up to fascist regimes. I see them opening people's eyes to other places, events and people in the world that we never hear about in everyday life. And why is that?
I think seeing someone talking about Haiti and Palestine on CSPAN is like a breath of fresh air. One speaker after another endlessly talking about Iraq would not be the answer to this.
Indeed, I was awestruck by the speeches that went on in DC -- did you even actually listen to them all? Just because ANSWER, who did all the organizing work, had their own brand of speakers in between, doesn't diminish the amazing stuff that came out of the people who were later broadcast on Democracy Now. Their talks had moved from trying to tell us what's going in Iraq to lyrical metaphorical pieces of art . . . really, they were pretty amazing. Because right now, most people know it's a big problem and don't need to hear over and over about the same problems with Iraq - they need inspiration. Those speakers gave that. And they brought the destruction of Katrina and Bush into focus as well.
Leave ANSWER alone. They have their own way. You can go work for UPJ if you need a yuppie crowd, or the Million Worker March people or whatever if you need the worker thing.
I went out to Safeway awhile back to support "LABOR" when they were being trashed and I got to talk to some of the "workers." These white folks told how they were so happy to be voting for Arnold.
That's what a lot of "labor" is doing in CA these days.
I don't see them - at all - as cozying up to fascist regimes. I see them opening people's eyes to other places, events and people in the world that we never hear about in everyday life. And why is that?
I think seeing someone talking about Haiti and Palestine on CSPAN is like a breath of fresh air. One speaker after another endlessly talking about Iraq would not be the answer to this.
Indeed, I was awestruck by the speeches that went on in DC -- did you even actually listen to them all? Just because ANSWER, who did all the organizing work, had their own brand of speakers in between, doesn't diminish the amazing stuff that came out of the people who were later broadcast on Democracy Now. Their talks had moved from trying to tell us what's going in Iraq to lyrical metaphorical pieces of art . . . really, they were pretty amazing. Because right now, most people know it's a big problem and don't need to hear over and over about the same problems with Iraq - they need inspiration. Those speakers gave that. And they brought the destruction of Katrina and Bush into focus as well.
Leave ANSWER alone. They have their own way. You can go work for UPJ if you need a yuppie crowd, or the Million Worker March people or whatever if you need the worker thing.
I went out to Safeway awhile back to support "LABOR" when they were being trashed and I got to talk to some of the "workers." These white folks told how they were so happy to be voting for Arnold.
That's what a lot of "labor" is doing in CA these days.
[Reposted for re-demolishment by JA of glib crack by so-called 'Scholar'. (I have to hold 'Scholar' up, Ali style, so I can knock him down again!)]
North Korea
by Scholar Thursday, Sep. 29, 2005 at 10:04 AM
ANSWER has no problem cozying up to North Korea. They do have an agenda and its NOT anti-war.
North Korea
by Scholar Thursday, Sep. 29, 2005 at 10:04 AM
ANSWER has no problem cozying up to North Korea. They do have an agenda and its NOT anti-war.
[Reposted so that I can re-demolish so-called 'Scholar'. It feels so good!]
'Scholar' of *WHAT*!?
by JA Thursday, Sep. 29, 2005 at 10:55 AM
'Scholar': "ANSWER has no problem cozying up to North Korea."
I guess South Koreans don't either, as they have been seeking to re-unify their country and some 11 million border-divided family members (against U.S. attempts to disrupt that) for the past 10 years.
The U.S. was the *FIRST* to introduce nuclear weapons -- including *HUNDREDS* of tactical nukes -- to the Korean penninsula. So, why shouldn't North Korea have them too? (Just like the U.S. let Israel be the first country to introduce a couple hundred nuclear weapons to the Middle East -- so why shouldn't Iran have them too?)
North Korean nukes are the ultimate guarantee that the U.S. won't do to North Korea what it has done to Iraq -- but with a *MUCH* higher civilian death toll in *both* North and South Korea, as North Korea is quite fully armed (and Seoul, a metropolitan area of about 13 million people -- about a quarter of South Korea's population -- is only about 20 miles from the DMZ). North Korea -- unlike Saddam -- not only claimed to have WMD's -- including NUCLEAR weapons -- it said that, if the U.S. attacked it, it would turn the West Coast of the U.S. (in particular California) into "A LAKE OF *FIRE*" with its long-range ballistic missiles (believed to be able to just reach the U.S. West Coast)!! And unlike with Saddam, the U.S., just recently, finally had to give "SECURITY GUARANTEES" to North Korea. That's how the U.S. ultimately treats a country that REALLY DOES have weapons of mass destruction.
So, if the U.S. security guarantees are true, North Korea's nuclear program (as an intermediate stop-gap) will help keep the U.S. out of the way and actually help bring about the potential of permanent PEACE on the Korean penninsula, so that the divided Koreans can reunify their country (just like the Germans finally re-unified their country). It was the U.S. who divided Korea in the first place, totally innocent victims of Japan and WWII, rather than support its total independence. SO THERE, 'Scholar'!
(Nice comment "reader".
Those of you who don't *ideologically* like ANSWER -- especially you *Zionists* -- CAN GO START YOUR OWN ANTI-WAR ORGANIZATIONS AND MARCHES. People who march under ANSWER's organizing and logistical power are no more all members of ANSWER than those who were in the Million Man March all members of The Nation of Islam. Both organizations were principle organizing parts of their respective umbrella coalitions.)
'Scholar' of *WHAT*!?
by JA Thursday, Sep. 29, 2005 at 10:55 AM
'Scholar': "ANSWER has no problem cozying up to North Korea."
I guess South Koreans don't either, as they have been seeking to re-unify their country and some 11 million border-divided family members (against U.S. attempts to disrupt that) for the past 10 years.
The U.S. was the *FIRST* to introduce nuclear weapons -- including *HUNDREDS* of tactical nukes -- to the Korean penninsula. So, why shouldn't North Korea have them too? (Just like the U.S. let Israel be the first country to introduce a couple hundred nuclear weapons to the Middle East -- so why shouldn't Iran have them too?)
North Korean nukes are the ultimate guarantee that the U.S. won't do to North Korea what it has done to Iraq -- but with a *MUCH* higher civilian death toll in *both* North and South Korea, as North Korea is quite fully armed (and Seoul, a metropolitan area of about 13 million people -- about a quarter of South Korea's population -- is only about 20 miles from the DMZ). North Korea -- unlike Saddam -- not only claimed to have WMD's -- including NUCLEAR weapons -- it said that, if the U.S. attacked it, it would turn the West Coast of the U.S. (in particular California) into "A LAKE OF *FIRE*" with its long-range ballistic missiles (believed to be able to just reach the U.S. West Coast)!! And unlike with Saddam, the U.S., just recently, finally had to give "SECURITY GUARANTEES" to North Korea. That's how the U.S. ultimately treats a country that REALLY DOES have weapons of mass destruction.
So, if the U.S. security guarantees are true, North Korea's nuclear program (as an intermediate stop-gap) will help keep the U.S. out of the way and actually help bring about the potential of permanent PEACE on the Korean penninsula, so that the divided Koreans can reunify their country (just like the Germans finally re-unified their country). It was the U.S. who divided Korea in the first place, totally innocent victims of Japan and WWII, rather than support its total independence. SO THERE, 'Scholar'!
(Nice comment "reader".
Those of you who don't *ideologically* like ANSWER -- especially you *Zionists* -- CAN GO START YOUR OWN ANTI-WAR ORGANIZATIONS AND MARCHES. People who march under ANSWER's organizing and logistical power are no more all members of ANSWER than those who were in the Million Man March all members of The Nation of Islam. Both organizations were principle organizing parts of their respective umbrella coalitions.)
I've heard this accusation 1000 times but have never found a quote. Are you saying that ANSWER as a group has a pro-North Korea platform, that ANSWER as a group has an anti-US invasion of North Korea agenda, that members groups in ANSWER have taken such stands...?
The WWP did support certain Soviet actions that most Trotskyist groups didn't but while the Workers Wold Party used to dominate many leadership positions in ANSWER, they have never been (and are definitely not now) the same group as ANSWER. I remember some WWP propaganda on Serbia when they were opposing Clinton's war there and it did border on excusing some of Molosoviks actions but I wouldnt have called in an apology for the actions or even an endorsement.
The WWP did support certain Soviet actions that most Trotskyist groups didn't but while the Workers Wold Party used to dominate many leadership positions in ANSWER, they have never been (and are definitely not now) the same group as ANSWER. I remember some WWP propaganda on Serbia when they were opposing Clinton's war there and it did border on excusing some of Molosoviks actions but I wouldnt have called in an apology for the actions or even an endorsement.
[Also reposted so that I can re-demolish so-called 'Scholar'. It feels so good!]
Bluster but no content
by Scholar Thursday, Sep. 29, 2005 at 12:23 PM:
"What I gleaned from your bluster with no content is that you have no idea whatsoever that North Korea is perhaps the sinlge most oppresive state in the world. Similarly, you have no idea that ANSWER perceives those like you as "useful idiots". JA might define the genre."
Bluster but no content
by Scholar Thursday, Sep. 29, 2005 at 12:23 PM:
"What I gleaned from your bluster with no content is that you have no idea whatsoever that North Korea is perhaps the sinlge most oppresive state in the world. Similarly, you have no idea that ANSWER perceives those like you as "useful idiots". JA might define the genre."
How can anyone go to a protest by people who make excuses for earthquakes?
[And again reposted so that I can re-demolish so-called 'Scholar'. Oh it feels so good!]
Bluster but no content
by Scholar Thursday, Sep. 29, 2005 at 12:23 PM:
"What I gleaned from your bluster with no content is that you have no idea whatsoever that North Korea is perhaps the sinlge most oppresive state in the world. Similarly, you have no idea that ANSWER perceives those like you as "useful idiots". JA might define the genre."
COULDN'T RESPOND TO OR DISCREDIT MY **ARGUMENTS**, COULD YOU, O GREAT 'SCHOLAR'? HA!!
In case you haven't noticed, most of the world -- including most of the Western world -- considers the *United States* to be the single greatest threat to world peace (with your little U.S.-armed to the teeth friend apartheid state Israel next in line -- and, with the fall of apartheid in South Africa, now the last state of its kind in the entire world).
And the history of U.S. (about 300 years of Native American genocide; about 250 years of chattel slavery; about 100 years of "Jim Crow" apartheid, complete with massacres, untold shootings, burnings and lynchings; brutal colonizations (as in the Philippines); the completely unnecessary nuclear incineration of two large cities (just to try to scare the Russians, who weren't scared at all, but just developed their own nuclear weapons and delivery systems); genocidal wars in 3rd World countries; triggering genocides in 3rd World countries like the Indonesia genocide and the Cambodia genocide (and trying to stop Vietnam from putting and end to it); overthrows of non-European democracies all over the world; mightily provoking wars (as the U.S. did in Afghanistan vis-a-vis the Soviets, resulting in another million deaths and turning the Taliban/al-Qaeda into a 'world power'); support for genocidal dictators all over the world, etc.; export of torture; and now a brutal attempt again at direct colonization) has shown that the U.S. has been the single most oppressive state in the world -- and with the help of many neocons (real *particularly nasty* people like Henry Kissinger and Eliot Abrahms) in the U.S. government. All while declaring itself to be the world's greatest "democracy"! The U.S. has savagely killed far more people (*MILLIONS*) in the non-European world than North Korea *EVER* has. But, then non-European/non-Jewish people never count to Zionists.
(Why do UTTERLY PRETENTIOUS ZIONISTS always pick those *IRONIC* names for themselves. It is to LAUGH!! HA-HA!!)
Bluster but no content
by Scholar Thursday, Sep. 29, 2005 at 12:23 PM:
"What I gleaned from your bluster with no content is that you have no idea whatsoever that North Korea is perhaps the sinlge most oppresive state in the world. Similarly, you have no idea that ANSWER perceives those like you as "useful idiots". JA might define the genre."
COULDN'T RESPOND TO OR DISCREDIT MY **ARGUMENTS**, COULD YOU, O GREAT 'SCHOLAR'? HA!!
In case you haven't noticed, most of the world -- including most of the Western world -- considers the *United States* to be the single greatest threat to world peace (with your little U.S.-armed to the teeth friend apartheid state Israel next in line -- and, with the fall of apartheid in South Africa, now the last state of its kind in the entire world).
And the history of U.S. (about 300 years of Native American genocide; about 250 years of chattel slavery; about 100 years of "Jim Crow" apartheid, complete with massacres, untold shootings, burnings and lynchings; brutal colonizations (as in the Philippines); the completely unnecessary nuclear incineration of two large cities (just to try to scare the Russians, who weren't scared at all, but just developed their own nuclear weapons and delivery systems); genocidal wars in 3rd World countries; triggering genocides in 3rd World countries like the Indonesia genocide and the Cambodia genocide (and trying to stop Vietnam from putting and end to it); overthrows of non-European democracies all over the world; mightily provoking wars (as the U.S. did in Afghanistan vis-a-vis the Soviets, resulting in another million deaths and turning the Taliban/al-Qaeda into a 'world power'); support for genocidal dictators all over the world, etc.; export of torture; and now a brutal attempt again at direct colonization) has shown that the U.S. has been the single most oppressive state in the world -- and with the help of many neocons (real *particularly nasty* people like Henry Kissinger and Eliot Abrahms) in the U.S. government. All while declaring itself to be the world's greatest "democracy"! The U.S. has savagely killed far more people (*MILLIONS*) in the non-European world than North Korea *EVER* has. But, then non-European/non-Jewish people never count to Zionists.
(Why do UTTERLY PRETENTIOUS ZIONISTS always pick those *IRONIC* names for themselves. It is to LAUGH!! HA-HA!!)
[reposted]
To (closet) Zionist critics of ANSWER. (Follow-up)
by JA Thursday, Sep. 29, 2005 at 11:15 AM
(Closet) Zionist (Dennis Perrin) critic of ANSWER: "But there were far too many topics addressed, most in demagogic, simplistic terms, to capture the casual C-SPAN viewer. The Iraq war and the fallacy of "the war on terror" should have been the sole focus. Wanna talk about Aristide? Stage a Haiti rally. Wanna praise Hugo Chavez? Put together a Hands Off Venezuela march. With the majority of Americans turning against the war, a leaner, tighter, more direct series of speakers (with labor groups, military relatives and dissident soldiers and Marines leading the way -- why wasn't someone from Iraq Veterans Against The War invited to speak?) would've been electrifying. And why not mix in some antiwar libertarians and Repubs? If you truly oppose the brutal status quo, I'd think you'd want to reach as many people as you can."
WE DON'T TELL YOU ZIONISTS (OVERT OR CLOSETED) HOW TO OPPRESS AND KILL PALESTINIANS.
YOU DON'T TELL US WHAT TO TALK ABOUT -- OR, RATHER, WHAT *NOT* TO TALK ABOUT -- AT OUR ANTI-WAR MARCHES.
WE'LL WORK THAT OUT OURSELVES.
GOT IT?
(Notice ole Perrin didn't mention Palestine in his list above. You can hardly talk about the most major U.S. imperialist issues today or the Middle East without invoking Palestine.)
To (closet) Zionist critics of ANSWER. (Follow-up)
by JA Thursday, Sep. 29, 2005 at 11:15 AM
(Closet) Zionist (Dennis Perrin) critic of ANSWER: "But there were far too many topics addressed, most in demagogic, simplistic terms, to capture the casual C-SPAN viewer. The Iraq war and the fallacy of "the war on terror" should have been the sole focus. Wanna talk about Aristide? Stage a Haiti rally. Wanna praise Hugo Chavez? Put together a Hands Off Venezuela march. With the majority of Americans turning against the war, a leaner, tighter, more direct series of speakers (with labor groups, military relatives and dissident soldiers and Marines leading the way -- why wasn't someone from Iraq Veterans Against The War invited to speak?) would've been electrifying. And why not mix in some antiwar libertarians and Repubs? If you truly oppose the brutal status quo, I'd think you'd want to reach as many people as you can."
WE DON'T TELL YOU ZIONISTS (OVERT OR CLOSETED) HOW TO OPPRESS AND KILL PALESTINIANS.
YOU DON'T TELL US WHAT TO TALK ABOUT -- OR, RATHER, WHAT *NOT* TO TALK ABOUT -- AT OUR ANTI-WAR MARCHES.
WE'LL WORK THAT OUT OURSELVES.
GOT IT?
(Notice ole Perrin didn't mention Palestine in his list above. You can hardly talk about the most major U.S. imperialist issues today or the Middle East without invoking Palestine.)
IAC has leaders with close ties to the WWP which used to have close ties to ANSWER before the WWP split with the nonWWP group being the one associated with ANSWER.
In the past they have denounced certain US actions during the Korean war. When people accuse ANSWER of supporting N Korea is this all they are really referring to? If so it's understandable why the accusation is always thrown around without any supporting links since its pretty obvious that one can be against war crimes but not support the group who the crime is comitted against (for example most peopel would be opposed to US troops torturing German soliers for fun during WWII but nobody would equate that with support for the Nazis)
---
IN NORTH KOREA: Witnesses testify on U.S. crimes in 1950-53 war
By Brian Becker
Co-Director, International Action Center
Pyongyang, DPRK
Becker is a co-director of the International Action Center and the co-coordina tor of the upcoming Korea Truth Commission War Crimes Tribunal that will be held June 23 at the Interchurch Center, 475 Riverside Drive, in New York. He was in Korea in May with the Commission.
In the past they have denounced certain US actions during the Korean war. When people accuse ANSWER of supporting N Korea is this all they are really referring to? If so it's understandable why the accusation is always thrown around without any supporting links since its pretty obvious that one can be against war crimes but not support the group who the crime is comitted against (for example most peopel would be opposed to US troops torturing German soliers for fun during WWII but nobody would equate that with support for the Nazis)
---
IN NORTH KOREA: Witnesses testify on U.S. crimes in 1950-53 war
By Brian Becker
Co-Director, International Action Center
Pyongyang, DPRK
Becker is a co-director of the International Action Center and the co-coordina tor of the upcoming Korea Truth Commission War Crimes Tribunal that will be held June 23 at the Interchurch Center, 475 Riverside Drive, in New York. He was in Korea in May with the Commission.
For more information:
http://64.233.161.104/search?q=cache:S0_Of...
"sucking up to a decrepit monarchy in northern Korea doesn't jazz you"
Are you only referring to Brian Becker's statements about the Korean War or is there more.
Are you only referring to Brian Becker's statements about the Korean War or is there more.
It's been 50-some years since the anti-red hysteria got going under Truman, and still here we are getting commie pinko boogeymen waved in our faces. It's downright depressing I tell ya. Why don't I ever see these closet-fascist zionist fucks carrying on about Indonesia this way? Or Guatemala? Or ... nah, that would NEVER happen
JA writes "You can hardly talk about the most major U.S. imperialist issues today or the Middle East without invoking Palestine."
I suggest to any reader to go to the original post where you can clearly see that Dennis Perrin says that the anti-war movement should address the situation in Palestine. Perrin is clearly on the pro-Palestinian side of things.
JA then enters with his usual bullshit and calls the author (Dennis Perrin) a closet Zionist. This is JA's obvious method of distracting criticisms of ANSWER into some other debate.
ANSWER noxious politics are a hinderance to building a broader movement, regardless of their ability to put on an anti-war march. Loony left shit like The Cuban 5, Hugo Chavez ass-kissing, and Mumia have zero appeal to ordinary Americans.
I suggest to any reader to go to the original post where you can clearly see that Dennis Perrin says that the anti-war movement should address the situation in Palestine. Perrin is clearly on the pro-Palestinian side of things.
JA then enters with his usual bullshit and calls the author (Dennis Perrin) a closet Zionist. This is JA's obvious method of distracting criticisms of ANSWER into some other debate.
ANSWER noxious politics are a hinderance to building a broader movement, regardless of their ability to put on an anti-war march. Loony left shit like The Cuban 5, Hugo Chavez ass-kissing, and Mumia have zero appeal to ordinary Americans.
[ Usual lying drivel by JA
by the secret zionist conspiracy Thursday, Sep. 29, 2005 at 8:41 PM
JA writes "You can hardly talk about the most major U.S. imperialist issues today or the Middle East without invoking Palestine."
I suggest to any reader to go to the original post where you can clearly see that Dennis Perrin says that the anti-war movement should address the situation in Palestine. Perrin is clearly on the pro-Palestinian side of things. ]
Yes, let's do go back:
Let's see what Perrin said: "But there were far too many topics addressed, most in demagogic, simplistic terms, to capture the casual C-SPAN viewer. The Iraq war and the fallacy of "the war on terror" should have been the sole focus. Wanna talk about Aristide? Stage a Haiti rally. Wanna praise Hugo Chavez? Put together a Hands Off Venezuela march. With the majority of Americans turning against the war, a leaner, tighter, more direct series of speakers (with labor groups, military relatives and dissident soldiers and Marines leading the way -- why wasn't someone from Iraq Veterans Against The War invited to speak?) would've been electrifying. And why not mix in some antiwar libertarians and Repubs? If you truly oppose the brutal status quo, I'd think you'd want to reach as many people as you can."
Now, let's see what JA said (Thursday, Sep. 29, 2005 at 6:06 PM): "Notice ole Perrin didn't mention Palestine [**]IN HIS LIST ABOVE[**]. You can hardly talk about the most major U.S. imperialist issues today or the Middle East without invoking Palestine."
Now, let's see LATER what Perrin said: "While I agree with his view that the rally should have focused [**]SOLELY[**] on the war..."
So, Palestine apparently is important to Perrin, BUT "the rally should have focused [**]SOLELY[**] on the war..."
This *USED* to be ANSWER's position -- in particular that officially including a Palestinian speaker or talk about Palestine was outside of the anti-war/anti-imperialist movement; that it would alienate the marchers. ANSWER had to be talked into officially including mention/speakers of Palestine on the stage. (And I know the white Eastbay people -- principally Jewish and non-Jewish ISM activists, among others like the *Palestinians* -- who *finally* convinced ANSWER to *finally* allow an official position and presence for Palestinian-American leaders.) Yet, the marches kept getting *LARGER*!
Now let's see what the usual lying Zionist scum said: "...Perrin says that the anti-war movement should address the situation in Palestine."
Now, one might *suppose* that, but that's not what Perrin actually said (unless the lying Zionist scum can pull a quote from Perrin *saying* that).
We *do* know what Perrin *DID* say: "The Iraq war and the fallacy of "the war on terror" should have been the sole focus."
And Perrin said it again: "I agree with his view that the rally should have focused [**]SOLELY[**] on the war..."
Furthermore Perrin also said: "Wanna talk about Aristide? Stage a Haiti rally. Wanna praise Hugo Chavez? Put together a Hands Off Venezuela march."
So, one might also conclude that Perrin thought that his idea of a casual [white liberal] C-SPAN audience *wouldn't* appreciate educative talk about the Palestinians.
In fact, Perrin said: "there were far too many topics addressed, most in demagogic, simplistic terms, to capture the casual C-SPAN viewer."
And *what* is "demagogic" in reminding "the casual C-SPAN viewer" that the country that talks about bringing "democracy" to Iraq has *KIDNAPPED* the *democratically* elected head of Haiti and -- once again -- encouraged the moneyed right-wing overthrow of *democratically* elected head of Venezuela (not to mention threatened to send U.S. troops down there to do it, and let one of their right-wing Christian 'Taliban' fundamentalist brethren nutcases *terroristically* call for the asssassination of that head of state on national American TV without disavowing agreement with that call)?
I *HATE* those affluent lilly-livered white "liberals" like Perrin: 'Gee, I agree that all those things are important (Haiti, Venezuela, Palestine: the U.S. kidnapping of a democratic Black president; the U.S. encouragement of the overthrow and perhaps asssassination of a democratic Latino president; the U.S.-sponsored brutal oppression of indigenous Palestinians), but let's not mention them at *ANTI-WAR* marches.You'll scare all the other white people!'
FINALLY, for all those Zionists and other people who don't want to go to ANSWER marches...
*** DON'T GO !! ***
(We won't miss you.)
by the secret zionist conspiracy Thursday, Sep. 29, 2005 at 8:41 PM
JA writes "You can hardly talk about the most major U.S. imperialist issues today or the Middle East without invoking Palestine."
I suggest to any reader to go to the original post where you can clearly see that Dennis Perrin says that the anti-war movement should address the situation in Palestine. Perrin is clearly on the pro-Palestinian side of things. ]
Yes, let's do go back:
Let's see what Perrin said: "But there were far too many topics addressed, most in demagogic, simplistic terms, to capture the casual C-SPAN viewer. The Iraq war and the fallacy of "the war on terror" should have been the sole focus. Wanna talk about Aristide? Stage a Haiti rally. Wanna praise Hugo Chavez? Put together a Hands Off Venezuela march. With the majority of Americans turning against the war, a leaner, tighter, more direct series of speakers (with labor groups, military relatives and dissident soldiers and Marines leading the way -- why wasn't someone from Iraq Veterans Against The War invited to speak?) would've been electrifying. And why not mix in some antiwar libertarians and Repubs? If you truly oppose the brutal status quo, I'd think you'd want to reach as many people as you can."
Now, let's see what JA said (Thursday, Sep. 29, 2005 at 6:06 PM): "Notice ole Perrin didn't mention Palestine [**]IN HIS LIST ABOVE[**]. You can hardly talk about the most major U.S. imperialist issues today or the Middle East without invoking Palestine."
Now, let's see LATER what Perrin said: "While I agree with his view that the rally should have focused [**]SOLELY[**] on the war..."
So, Palestine apparently is important to Perrin, BUT "the rally should have focused [**]SOLELY[**] on the war..."
This *USED* to be ANSWER's position -- in particular that officially including a Palestinian speaker or talk about Palestine was outside of the anti-war/anti-imperialist movement; that it would alienate the marchers. ANSWER had to be talked into officially including mention/speakers of Palestine on the stage. (And I know the white Eastbay people -- principally Jewish and non-Jewish ISM activists, among others like the *Palestinians* -- who *finally* convinced ANSWER to *finally* allow an official position and presence for Palestinian-American leaders.) Yet, the marches kept getting *LARGER*!
Now let's see what the usual lying Zionist scum said: "...Perrin says that the anti-war movement should address the situation in Palestine."
Now, one might *suppose* that, but that's not what Perrin actually said (unless the lying Zionist scum can pull a quote from Perrin *saying* that).
We *do* know what Perrin *DID* say: "The Iraq war and the fallacy of "the war on terror" should have been the sole focus."
And Perrin said it again: "I agree with his view that the rally should have focused [**]SOLELY[**] on the war..."
Furthermore Perrin also said: "Wanna talk about Aristide? Stage a Haiti rally. Wanna praise Hugo Chavez? Put together a Hands Off Venezuela march."
So, one might also conclude that Perrin thought that his idea of a casual [white liberal] C-SPAN audience *wouldn't* appreciate educative talk about the Palestinians.
In fact, Perrin said: "there were far too many topics addressed, most in demagogic, simplistic terms, to capture the casual C-SPAN viewer."
And *what* is "demagogic" in reminding "the casual C-SPAN viewer" that the country that talks about bringing "democracy" to Iraq has *KIDNAPPED* the *democratically* elected head of Haiti and -- once again -- encouraged the moneyed right-wing overthrow of *democratically* elected head of Venezuela (not to mention threatened to send U.S. troops down there to do it, and let one of their right-wing Christian 'Taliban' fundamentalist brethren nutcases *terroristically* call for the asssassination of that head of state on national American TV without disavowing agreement with that call)?
I *HATE* those affluent lilly-livered white "liberals" like Perrin: 'Gee, I agree that all those things are important (Haiti, Venezuela, Palestine: the U.S. kidnapping of a democratic Black president; the U.S. encouragement of the overthrow and perhaps asssassination of a democratic Latino president; the U.S.-sponsored brutal oppression of indigenous Palestinians), but let's not mention them at *ANTI-WAR* marches.You'll scare all the other white people!'
FINALLY, for all those Zionists and other people who don't want to go to ANSWER marches...
*** DON'T GO !! ***
(We won't miss you.)
I'll let readers be the judge whether Perrin is a "closet zionist" (JA's words). They can go up to the original post and see what Perrin has to say as to the issue of Palestinians. My opinion is that JA interpretation is so way off the mark, that JA is a liar or just a fool. Again I'll let readers decide.
As to criticisms of ANSWER, JA stumbles around with various Stalinoid apologetics, race baiting, and generally avoiding the heart of anti-ANSWER criticism. To the degree that the anti-war movement is growing, it's growing despite ANSWER not because of it.
As to criticisms of ANSWER, JA stumbles around with various Stalinoid apologetics, race baiting, and generally avoiding the heart of anti-ANSWER criticism. To the degree that the anti-war movement is growing, it's growing despite ANSWER not because of it.
Get a life!
tzc: "To the degree that the anti-war movement is growing"
And that's all that's important.
As JA says, if you don't like ANSWER, don't go to the marches.
tzc: "To the degree that the anti-war movement is growing"
And that's all that's important.
As JA says, if you don't like ANSWER, don't go to the marches.
" JA stumbles around with various Stalinoid apologetics"
You can say that peopel aren't responding to valid criticisms of ANSWER but as far as I can tell most of the criticisms are way off mark. When people accuse ANSWER of supporting N Korea,what exactly do they mean? Is it just that one leader of ANSWER on the E Coast went to Korea and spoke out against US actions during the Korean War? Brian Becker's writings on N Korea that I can find don't sound Stalinist and if thats all there is to the accusation it seems pretty underhanded. Since ANSWER is not run by Becker and I've never heard N Korea mentioned at an actual protest what is being proposed? That ANSWER ban members who denounce US actions during past wars? Japan during WWII was probably worse than N Korea could ever get so shouild all anti-nuke people who talk about Horoshima be banned from protests in order for ANSWER to clear its name?
In terms of issuses surrounding diversity of messages at protests I also wonder what people want. Wouldn't a protest be smaller if no contingents could march who have other issues aside from the war. At most antiwar marchs Ive been to the entire march is full of contingents so banning nonwar related messages seems like it would limit the attendence. The same probably goes for speakers; by limiting the issues talked aboutat a protest to just one you would end up limiting who could speak more than focusing the message. Was New Orleans a valid issue to link to the war? If so who decides whats a valid issues that relates and what is a side issues that cant be addressed from stage because it takes the focus off the war?
You can say that peopel aren't responding to valid criticisms of ANSWER but as far as I can tell most of the criticisms are way off mark. When people accuse ANSWER of supporting N Korea,what exactly do they mean? Is it just that one leader of ANSWER on the E Coast went to Korea and spoke out against US actions during the Korean War? Brian Becker's writings on N Korea that I can find don't sound Stalinist and if thats all there is to the accusation it seems pretty underhanded. Since ANSWER is not run by Becker and I've never heard N Korea mentioned at an actual protest what is being proposed? That ANSWER ban members who denounce US actions during past wars? Japan during WWII was probably worse than N Korea could ever get so shouild all anti-nuke people who talk about Horoshima be banned from protests in order for ANSWER to clear its name?
In terms of issuses surrounding diversity of messages at protests I also wonder what people want. Wouldn't a protest be smaller if no contingents could march who have other issues aside from the war. At most antiwar marchs Ive been to the entire march is full of contingents so banning nonwar related messages seems like it would limit the attendence. The same probably goes for speakers; by limiting the issues talked aboutat a protest to just one you would end up limiting who could speak more than focusing the message. Was New Orleans a valid issue to link to the war? If so who decides whats a valid issues that relates and what is a side issues that cant be addressed from stage because it takes the focus off the war?
"Was New Orleans a valid issue to link to the war? If so who decides whats a valid issues that relates and what is a side issues that cant be addressed from stage because it takes the focus off the war?"
And what the _true_ nature of "homeland security" should mean.
People around the entire world made the ironic connection between Iraq and New Orleans. One British example at the time: "Bush can go all the way to Iraq, but he can't even go to New Orleans." Everybody understood that 'side issue'. Everybody but Perrin and these zionists understands (or wants to understand) the directly connecting issues to an imperialist war.
And what the _true_ nature of "homeland security" should mean.
People around the entire world made the ironic connection between Iraq and New Orleans. One British example at the time: "Bush can go all the way to Iraq, but he can't even go to New Orleans." Everybody understood that 'side issue'. Everybody but Perrin and these zionists understands (or wants to understand) the directly connecting issues to an imperialist war.
that no matter what the thread they turn it around to try and indict the ZIONISTS!!!!!
Thats got to tell you something about these folks.
Thats got to tell you something about these folks.
Is it a CONSPIRACY? Wack jobs!
one of the liveliest group at these San Francisco marches are younger generation and student aged Korean Americans (often dressed in white and red, and wearing Korean character headbands, with their dance-marching and gong playing) and their 'side issue' is -- guess what!? -- anti-U.S. imperialism, anti-U.S. belligerance against North Korea, and South & North Korean reunification!
*EVERYONE* WHO OPPOSES IMPERIALISM AND OPPRESSION CAN BRING SOMETHING TO THE DEMONSTRATION TABLE.
AND, IN FACT, IT *ALL* FOCUSES THE MESSAGE.
=============================================
"interesting and by quite telling (Friday, Sep. 30, 2005 at 11:35 AM):that no matter what the thread they turn it around to try and indict the ZIONISTS!!!!! Thats got to tell you something about these folks."
Yeah, it tells you that those Zionists must be a pretty nasty bunch!
*EVERYONE* WHO OPPOSES IMPERIALISM AND OPPRESSION CAN BRING SOMETHING TO THE DEMONSTRATION TABLE.
AND, IN FACT, IT *ALL* FOCUSES THE MESSAGE.
=============================================
"interesting and by quite telling (Friday, Sep. 30, 2005 at 11:35 AM):that no matter what the thread they turn it around to try and indict the ZIONISTS!!!!! Thats got to tell you something about these folks."
Yeah, it tells you that those Zionists must be a pretty nasty bunch!
JA , when I wrote "wack job" I was thinking of you.
SchtarkerYid: "JA , when I wrote "wack job" I was thinking of you."
(P.S. I love you too.)
(P.S. I love you too.)
Love is a new and better attitude for anti-zionists. Like "chesed" and"tikkun olam". Very good, maybe you'll come arround yet.
Juan Cole: "Surely no one thinks that International ANSWER or the Workers World Party of Ramsey Clark has more than a handful of members. They were good for setting a date and getting a permit. Popular discontent with the war supplied the demonstrators."
Let anyone who doesn't want ANSWER organize their OWN marches.
If you don't like Americ..... I mean ANSWER don't got to the march.
tzc: "If you don't like Americ..... I mean ANSWER don't got to the march."
Wow, now the zionists are equating ANSWER with all of America! Is there nothing that zionists won't say to try to twist a valid point?
I didn't realize that ANSWER had that much POWER! Maybe next time it can get a turn out of the enitre country (minus the Israel-right-or-wrong zionists of course).
Wow, now the zionists are equating ANSWER with all of America! Is there nothing that zionists won't say to try to twist a valid point?
I didn't realize that ANSWER had that much POWER! Maybe next time it can get a turn out of the enitre country (minus the Israel-right-or-wrong zionists of course).
"ANSWER has an agenda and ANSWER does the work. For whatever reason, they know how to do what needs to get done, and that way they get time to grandstand their own issues.
I don't see them - at all - as cozying up to fascist regimes."
BECKY: Have you ever wondered where they get their funding? And since they are always trying to fit in some Jew-bashing into their agenda, perhaps thats the deal they've made with their funders. We organize protests here in Santa Cruz and can't afford a single porta-pottie. I wouldn't be at all surprised if ANSWER got funding from wealthy Jew-haters in the mideast.
Be careful of anti-semiticism riding in on the back of the anti-war movement.
I don't see them - at all - as cozying up to fascist regimes."
BECKY: Have you ever wondered where they get their funding? And since they are always trying to fit in some Jew-bashing into their agenda, perhaps thats the deal they've made with their funders. We organize protests here in Santa Cruz and can't afford a single porta-pottie. I wouldn't be at all surprised if ANSWER got funding from wealthy Jew-haters in the mideast.
Be careful of anti-semiticism riding in on the back of the anti-war movement.
...these other fetishes shared by pro-Israel closet fascists as a whole:
the anti-Chomsky fetish
the anti-Vanunu fetish
the anti-Ostrovsky fetish
the anti-Dennis-Bernstein fetish
the anti-Medea-Benjamin fetish
the anti-Barbara-Lubin fetish
the anti-Gilad-Atzmon fetish
the anti-Naturei-Karta fetish
the anti-UN fetish
the anti-George-Galloway fetish
the anti-Robert-Fisk fetish
the anti-John-Pilger fetish
the anti-JA fetish
the anti-nessie fetish
the anti-TW fetish
the anti-Indymedia fetish
on and on to infinity...
In every case, they will lie relentlessly about their real reason for smearing the person or organization: that they/it take positions on Israel that express other than gushing total approval.
diagnosis: Zionists are NUTS, true political maniacs. In true Nazi fashion, they'll even turn their fascism against anti-zionist Jews:
"I am well aware of the tactics YOU, my Zionist brethren, use to quiet anyone who attempts to expose any of your subversive acts. If the person is a gentile, you cry, "you're anti-Semitic," which is nothing more than a smokescreen to hide your actions. But if a Jew is the person doing the exposing, you resort to other tactics:
First, you ignore the charges, hoping the information will not be given widespread distribution.
If the information starts reaching too many people, you ridicule the information and the person giving the information.
If that doesn't work, your next step is character assassination. If the author or speaker hasn't been involved in sufficient scandal, you are adept at fabricating a scandal against the person or persons.
If none of these are effective, you are known to resort to physical attacks.
But NEVER do you try to prove the information wrong. So, before you commence efforts to silence me, I offer this challenge: You Zionists assemble a number of Zionist Jews and witnesses to support your position; and I will assemble a like number of anti-Zionist, pro-American jews and witnesses.
Then, the Zionists and anti-Zionists will state their positions and debate the material in this book as well as related material -- and the debate WILL BE HELD ON PUBLIC TELEVISION. Let's explore the information both sides can present and let the American people decide for themselves if the information is true or false. ISN'T THAT A FAIR CHALLENGE? Certainly, you will willingly accept the challenge if what I have written is false. But if you resort to crying "Lies, all lies" and refuse to debate, you will, in effect, be telling the American people that what I have written here are the true facts."
from The Life Of An American Jew In Racist-Marxist Israel.
by Jack Bernstein
© 1984
http://100777.com/node/61?PHPSESSID=5409ba7c199a0abf8401d7f914e7cc9e
the anti-Chomsky fetish
the anti-Vanunu fetish
the anti-Ostrovsky fetish
the anti-Dennis-Bernstein fetish
the anti-Medea-Benjamin fetish
the anti-Barbara-Lubin fetish
the anti-Gilad-Atzmon fetish
the anti-Naturei-Karta fetish
the anti-UN fetish
the anti-George-Galloway fetish
the anti-Robert-Fisk fetish
the anti-John-Pilger fetish
the anti-JA fetish
the anti-nessie fetish
the anti-TW fetish
the anti-Indymedia fetish
on and on to infinity...
In every case, they will lie relentlessly about their real reason for smearing the person or organization: that they/it take positions on Israel that express other than gushing total approval.
diagnosis: Zionists are NUTS, true political maniacs. In true Nazi fashion, they'll even turn their fascism against anti-zionist Jews:
"I am well aware of the tactics YOU, my Zionist brethren, use to quiet anyone who attempts to expose any of your subversive acts. If the person is a gentile, you cry, "you're anti-Semitic," which is nothing more than a smokescreen to hide your actions. But if a Jew is the person doing the exposing, you resort to other tactics:
First, you ignore the charges, hoping the information will not be given widespread distribution.
If the information starts reaching too many people, you ridicule the information and the person giving the information.
If that doesn't work, your next step is character assassination. If the author or speaker hasn't been involved in sufficient scandal, you are adept at fabricating a scandal against the person or persons.
If none of these are effective, you are known to resort to physical attacks.
But NEVER do you try to prove the information wrong. So, before you commence efforts to silence me, I offer this challenge: You Zionists assemble a number of Zionist Jews and witnesses to support your position; and I will assemble a like number of anti-Zionist, pro-American jews and witnesses.
Then, the Zionists and anti-Zionists will state their positions and debate the material in this book as well as related material -- and the debate WILL BE HELD ON PUBLIC TELEVISION. Let's explore the information both sides can present and let the American people decide for themselves if the information is true or false. ISN'T THAT A FAIR CHALLENGE? Certainly, you will willingly accept the challenge if what I have written is false. But if you resort to crying "Lies, all lies" and refuse to debate, you will, in effect, be telling the American people that what I have written here are the true facts."
from The Life Of An American Jew In Racist-Marxist Israel.
by Jack Bernstein
© 1984
http://100777.com/node/61?PHPSESSID=5409ba7c199a0abf8401d7f914e7cc9e
Answer is the latest front group for the Workers World Party, a Stalinist Group that broke from mainstream American Coomunist party in 1956 because the main communist party would not support the Soviet invasion and occupation of Hungary and the Chinese occupation of Tibet. Many Answer organizers broke away from the World Workers Party in 2004, forming the "Socialism and Liberation" party with the same views and policies. The local cell still identifies as part of the International Action center divison of the World Workers Party.
"Answer is the latest front group for the Workers World Party"
ANSWER may have been founded by members of the WWP but the WWP split awhile ago and the group that went with ANSWER wasnt the one named WWP. Many leaders of ANSWER are not WWP members and never were.
ANSWER may have been founded by members of the WWP but the WWP split awhile ago and the group that went with ANSWER wasnt the one named WWP. Many leaders of ANSWER are not WWP members and never were.
"Then, the Zionists and anti-Zionists will state their positions and debate the material in this book as well as related material -- and the debate WILL BE HELD ON PUBLIC TELEVISION. Let's explore the information both sides can present and let the American people decide for themselves if the information is true or false. ISN'T THAT A FAIR CHALLENGE?"
"ANSWER is a Stalinist Group that broke from mainstream American Communist party in 1956 because the main communist party would not support the Soviet invasion and occupation of Hungary and the Chinese occupation of Tibet"
The Chinese invasion of Tibet didn't happen until '59, so why should I trust anything else you've said, for example "Stalinist."
The Chinese invasion of Tibet didn't happen until '59, so why should I trust anything else you've said, for example "Stalinist."
How is that anyone who is critical of ANSWER is somehow a "Zionist"? Aren't most anarchists critical of ANSWER? Are they Zionists too?
Does this mean we should support the war?
(re Becky's anti-ANSWER fetish is a variation on...
by symptoms and diagnosis Sunday, Oct. 02, 2005 at 9:06 PM
...these other fetishes shared by pro-Israel fanatics:)
the anti-Edward-Said fetish
the anti-Hanan-Ashrawi fetish
the anti-Marwhan-Barghouti fetish
the anti-Chomsky fetish
the anti-Nelson-Mandela fetish
the anti-Illan Pappe fetish
the anti-Vanunu fetish
the anti-Moustafa-Barghouti fetish
the anti-Rachel-Corrie fetish
the anti-Tom-Hurndall fetish
the anti-Brian-Avery fetish
the anti-Ostrovsky fetish
the anti-Lenni-Brenner-fetish
the anti-Norman-Finkelstein fetish
the anti-Tariq-Ali fetish
the anti-Dennis-Bernstein fetish
the anti-Jeffrey-Blankfort fetish
the anti-Barbara-Lubin fetish
the anti-Women-in-Black fetish
the anti-Medea-Benjamin fetish
the anti-Jess-Ghannam fetish
the anti-Hatem-Bazian fetish
the anti-Joel-Beinin fetish
the anti-ISM fetish
the anti-JVP fetish
the anti-Gilad-Atzmon fetish
the anti-Rashid-Khalidi fetish
the anti-Israel-Shahak fetish
the anti-Naturei-Karta fetish
the anti-Uri-Avnery fetish
the anti-UN fetish
the anti-Fidel-Castro fetish
the anti-Hugo-Chavez fetish
the anti-Mumia fetish
the anti-George-Galloway fetish
the anti-Robert-Fisk fetish
the anti-John-Pilger fetish
the anti-Cynthia-McKinney fetish
the anti-Chalmers-Johnson fetish
the anti-Ralph-Schoenmann fetish
the anti-Alexander-Cockburn fetish
the anti-Jeffrey-Sinclair fetish
the anti-Alison-Weir fetish
the anti-Michael-Neumann fetish
the anti-JA fetish
the anti-Angie-from-Canada fetish
the anti-nessie fetish (_provisionally_)
the anti-TW fetish
the anti-Indymedia fetish
the anti-ANSWER fetish ( 'now apparently a neo-Nazi organization' )
the list goes on
and on and on to all good people of global justice honor ...
(Our sincerest apology if any person of such honor, integrity and distinction - or any such persons who wishes to _join_ this list - has been unintentionally omitted. Consider it with the same such honor as, before, Nixon's enemies list or, now, Daniel Pipes' McCarthyist CampusWatch list. Please feel free to _INSIST_ on joining this list.)
by symptoms and diagnosis Sunday, Oct. 02, 2005 at 9:06 PM
...these other fetishes shared by pro-Israel fanatics:)
the anti-Edward-Said fetish
the anti-Hanan-Ashrawi fetish
the anti-Marwhan-Barghouti fetish
the anti-Chomsky fetish
the anti-Nelson-Mandela fetish
the anti-Illan Pappe fetish
the anti-Vanunu fetish
the anti-Moustafa-Barghouti fetish
the anti-Rachel-Corrie fetish
the anti-Tom-Hurndall fetish
the anti-Brian-Avery fetish
the anti-Ostrovsky fetish
the anti-Lenni-Brenner-fetish
the anti-Norman-Finkelstein fetish
the anti-Tariq-Ali fetish
the anti-Dennis-Bernstein fetish
the anti-Jeffrey-Blankfort fetish
the anti-Barbara-Lubin fetish
the anti-Women-in-Black fetish
the anti-Medea-Benjamin fetish
the anti-Jess-Ghannam fetish
the anti-Hatem-Bazian fetish
the anti-Joel-Beinin fetish
the anti-ISM fetish
the anti-JVP fetish
the anti-Gilad-Atzmon fetish
the anti-Rashid-Khalidi fetish
the anti-Israel-Shahak fetish
the anti-Naturei-Karta fetish
the anti-Uri-Avnery fetish
the anti-UN fetish
the anti-Fidel-Castro fetish
the anti-Hugo-Chavez fetish
the anti-Mumia fetish
the anti-George-Galloway fetish
the anti-Robert-Fisk fetish
the anti-John-Pilger fetish
the anti-Cynthia-McKinney fetish
the anti-Chalmers-Johnson fetish
the anti-Ralph-Schoenmann fetish
the anti-Alexander-Cockburn fetish
the anti-Jeffrey-Sinclair fetish
the anti-Alison-Weir fetish
the anti-Michael-Neumann fetish
the anti-JA fetish
the anti-Angie-from-Canada fetish
the anti-nessie fetish (_provisionally_)
the anti-TW fetish
the anti-Indymedia fetish
the anti-ANSWER fetish ( 'now apparently a neo-Nazi organization' )
the list goes on
and on and on to all good people of global justice honor ...
(Our sincerest apology if any person of such honor, integrity and distinction - or any such persons who wishes to _join_ this list - has been unintentionally omitted. Consider it with the same such honor as, before, Nixon's enemies list or, now, Daniel Pipes' McCarthyist CampusWatch list. Please feel free to _INSIST_ on joining this list.)
YAWWWN implies that I have a knee-jerk reaction to dozens of speakers and writers who have been critical of the State of Israel, but he has only proved that he has a knee-jerk reaction to ME.
Anyone who has followed my writings on the topic knows that I address specific issues, give my analysis and evidence, and often support some aspects of their platform where I can.
I support ANSWER in as far as they are organizing anti-war demonstrations against Bush's war in Iraq.
I agree that there were no WMD's, that Bush lied, and that he didn't have any kind of plan for the occupation of Iraq.
But I part company with ANSWER when they lump in what they call "Israel's illegal occupation of Palestinian lands" as if this is an agreed upon fact. It is not.
ANSWER could be addressing human rights concerns in Sudan. They aren't. They could be similarly critical of the Palestinian terrorists groups who are the main obstacle to peace. Where is ANSWER's protest of Hamas, Al Aqsa Martyrs Brigade, Islamic Jihad, Hizbullah, the PFLP, the PLO, honor killings of women, lynchings of "collaborators" with Israel without trial and in the public square? What does ANSWER have to say about the Palestinians burning down 26 synagogues? What does ANSWER have to say about the Palestinians destroying the donated greenhouses, making the chances of an economically viable Palestinian state remote? If ANSWER is going to lump in the Israeli/Palestinian conflict, they should be uniform in their calls for peace.
And the 9/11 conspiracy promoters at the SEPT . 24th rally in Santa Cruz (which I attended) were a questionable splinter group on an issue which had little to do with the war in Iraq. Why were they invited?
Does ANSWER intend to cater to only a tiny contingent of the increasingly unhappy American public who might have attended their rallies? This is obviously not a successful strategy.
The ANSWER rally on Feb 15 2003 drew 7,000 people in Santa Cruz. The Sept 24th rally in 2005 only drew 110 people!!
ANSWER needs to rethink its focus. Cut the Jew-bashing and the crazy 9/11 plots and focus on the war in Iraq.
Anyone who has followed my writings on the topic knows that I address specific issues, give my analysis and evidence, and often support some aspects of their platform where I can.
I support ANSWER in as far as they are organizing anti-war demonstrations against Bush's war in Iraq.
I agree that there were no WMD's, that Bush lied, and that he didn't have any kind of plan for the occupation of Iraq.
But I part company with ANSWER when they lump in what they call "Israel's illegal occupation of Palestinian lands" as if this is an agreed upon fact. It is not.
ANSWER could be addressing human rights concerns in Sudan. They aren't. They could be similarly critical of the Palestinian terrorists groups who are the main obstacle to peace. Where is ANSWER's protest of Hamas, Al Aqsa Martyrs Brigade, Islamic Jihad, Hizbullah, the PFLP, the PLO, honor killings of women, lynchings of "collaborators" with Israel without trial and in the public square? What does ANSWER have to say about the Palestinians burning down 26 synagogues? What does ANSWER have to say about the Palestinians destroying the donated greenhouses, making the chances of an economically viable Palestinian state remote? If ANSWER is going to lump in the Israeli/Palestinian conflict, they should be uniform in their calls for peace.
And the 9/11 conspiracy promoters at the SEPT . 24th rally in Santa Cruz (which I attended) were a questionable splinter group on an issue which had little to do with the war in Iraq. Why were they invited?
Does ANSWER intend to cater to only a tiny contingent of the increasingly unhappy American public who might have attended their rallies? This is obviously not a successful strategy.
The ANSWER rally on Feb 15 2003 drew 7,000 people in Santa Cruz. The Sept 24th rally in 2005 only drew 110 people!!
ANSWER needs to rethink its focus. Cut the Jew-bashing and the crazy 9/11 plots and focus on the war in Iraq.
You can start your OWN anti-war march and run it just the way you like.
What seems to be missing is constructive critcism. The anti-war movement in the U.S.A. is naisent and moving and contains the anti-fascist united front of the people. We ought to remember that the same contradictions with our enemies and our friends are resolved differently. They are not resolved the same, and this article is confusing the two issues. With our friends we resolve these contradictions with kindness and intelligent reasoning, with our enemies harsh words and meciless blows. Answer is needed amongst the peoples camp for its anti-fascist, anti-war ways of organizing successful marches against a very deadly fascistic-Imperialist foreign policy throughout the middle east and globally. What ever answers shortcommings are they can be resolved with constructive critcism that is intelligent and progressive. Not by completly negating them on every question and dismissing them as fools. That method of criticism is false and treats them as if they were enemies, that they are not. The peoples have supported International A.N.S.W.E.R. and that is good and just. Viva liberation.
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