DONT SHOP AT RALPHS, VONS, OR ALBERTSONS UNTIL THE STRIKE IS OVER!

Please help me understand what the hardship is in paying for your part of healthcare. The grocery employees have somehow been excluded from the rest of society by taking a free ride from their employers, Ralph's, Von's, and Albertson's. I noti

it's unfortunate that Cindy's post got cut off.
she was on her way to saying something really dumb and I wanted to read all of it.

Imagine working for a company for almost 10 years and having a great contract. Then when the contract is up they try and take away all they you have been working for. Imagine getting promised something for so long, staying with a company for that sole reason. Then they decide, we want more profit so SCREW YOU WORKERS......

The reason we are going against the companies we work for is because they want to take in more profit. That is why they are not helping us pay for medical.

Albertson's made over 19 billion last year and doesn't want to help workers. Why do we want to work for a company like that?

Do you need a high school/ college education to work at the supermarkets? ....I didn't think so...........so the ones who have that education should weep the benefits!

If the employees are not one of the reasons that brings me to my local grocery store, why should they now be a reason to stay away? I shop at my local store because I like the store, the products, the prices but most of all because it's LOCAL. I don't have any problems with the employees, their just not one of the reasons I shop there. So now one of the non factors in my decsion to shop there is trying to become a factor to not shop there? So I have to ask the question, what would be the benefit to myself or the community in supporting a strike?

Well i think she made a good point. It sucks that she got cut off. u just dont want to hear the truth. all these high school drop outs just want to take the easy way out. when all of us are going to college and paying our time. to get what we deserve. i know alot of people who have a more important job than bagging food and dont have free ride or a salary like u people. U are just like the companies getting greedy. and u dont appreciate what u do get. plus our econony is falling and ur luck u still have grocery stores to work at. in other states its common to order it on the internet and a guy delivers. do u think he gets 16.00 an hour and benefits? I think u need to educate ur self about whats going on in our country before u are out of a job. unions are good but for people who are really taken advantage of! Also, dont be having kids u cant afford albertsons shouldn't have to pay for ur mistakes.

It really is amazing the thought process of the uneducated and those of you Liberals who think you deserve everything on a silver platter without understanding what happens on a management level. Health care costs are out of control primarily because of the same liberal people who are for unions. They sue and receive unwarrented rewards which drives up insurances and costs to companies providing the health care. Obesity in this country costs health providers $98 Billion dollars annually to treat. But of course, Liberals think that obesity is society's fault, not theirs (Let's sue McDonald's, right?). So why is it the responsibility of the company to pay that?? I pay my own insurance. I pay over $500 a month for it and I do so gladly. I worked my way through college and through Grad school in order to start my own business. I earn my pay, and I choose to pay for healthcare without any help from unions or the government. To be asked to pay for $5 to $15 a week to cover health insurance should never be an issue. PAY IT AND SHUT UP. You deserve nothing from the company except your pay. Your job is extremely easy, your hours are flexible, and you complain that you derserve more. Do you wonder why companies are going off shore to conduct business? Get a clue, you Liberals. You're the reason the state of CA is in the situation it is, and the reason why the economy has tanked. If you don't like it, QUIT. No one is forcing you to work there.

With so many homeless people out there today, why are some people bitching about a dollar when there are so many people, vets, without a dime. There going through all this for a 5 dollar a week more increase for full medidcal??!! how stupid people are. I guess it just goes to show these people have no other skill in life and need a union to tell them how to think. Thank God I work for a non-union Albertsons in AZ. i make 15.08 an hour and pay 8.00 a week for full medical. No union need!!!!

blah blah, 5 dollars more a week, that is only 1/50 th of what they are trying to take a way, from chemotherapy to split shifts, people think that this strike is only about an extra 20 bucks a month is wrong. I am not trying to take the easy way out and just stay at albertsons uneducated. i am getting my education and probably after i graduate with my bachelor's i would still have better insurance with albertsons. Everybody who is against it is either not informed on the whole story or is jealous because they don't have we got, and are soon to get back

This isn't just about $5 a week or even $15 a week to pay for your medical benefits.
It's about employers taking care of their employees. the ones who help them earn their millions and billions of dollars of profit.
And because unoin employees do make a fair wage they are able to help the economy in your local area and state. they are able to eat in your restraunts, buy your products and services and in general help the local economy.
where companies like walmart actually do harm to the economy because they do not pay a decent wage to their employees. they take the profits and run.
if they were to pay union scale and benefits then this would help the economy greatly.

and working in a grocery store may seems easy till you do it. But, try standing up all day. and putting up with all the different kinds of customers for 8 hours.
plus, constantly being watched and evaluated to see that you are indeed working fast enough. which according to management no one is ever fast enough.
ever.

and no one seems to mention the two tier system they want also.
this is just a way for the owners to slowly force the higher waged expierenced people out of their jobs.

so this issue infact is more of a concern than just the pay something for your health care issue.

this alone is enough to say no way and strike till this issue is pulled from the contract.

how would you like to work for someone who makes millions of dollars of profit a year and then tells you he can't pay for your medical benefits. And that he will only be able to pay you a raise of say 25 cents a year.
but then you will have to pay more than the raise he gave you to cover your medical benefits.
so, with inflation and now paying for your own medical
benefits you are actually bring home less dollars now than you did before.

It is also about principals. about taking care of your people that actually helped you make all this money.
And the fact that you can be fair to them while still making a profit for yourself.

but, when greed becomes the only motive and at the cost of the people who helped you make it; well, this isn't fair/nice/polite/ or the the right thing to do.

And it is bad in the long run for all concerned.
and it hurts everyone by being bad for the economy of the local area and the state too.

when people have money to spend on food, clothing, housing and some for extras it helps create jobs and puts tax dollars into the general fund to come back and help everyone in the area.

so you see it is about more than just paying for mediacl benefits.

it's about being fair and smart and doing what is good for all and not just being greedy or concerned about how you can make more money at everyone elses expense.


and just because one person or company or chain does something doesn't mean it's right or that you need to do it too.

if all the companies went union and paid fair wages and medical and pensions to their employees then the whole economy would be better off.

and the companies would actually make more money because more people would be working and making enough to spend more.

and if you are not working or not making as much as a
clerk at the stores then i do feel this would help you out too.
for if all the chains were union and and paid a fair scale to their employees plus, their medical and pensions then their business would increase. and they would have to hire more employees.
maybe, even build more stores. or increase the size of the stores they now have.
this would create more jobs all around. and you could eventually get a job say at one of the chains and make more yourself. plus, you'd get medical and pension too.

with all this money going around the employers would make millions more , the employees would make more, and the other businesses would make more as the employees spend more, and more taxes would be collected to go into the general funds to pay for the scholos and roads and such.

so everyone would win.

rather than the current case happening now.
the employers make more by cutting wages and getting rid of their most valuable expierenced employees.
these now former employees must now get help from the state. they actually take money from the general funds. there are fewer jobs . and thus less peolpe spending money and fewer taxes being collected and more money being paid out instead.

so yes the employers make more money but at everyone elses expense.
so a few make a lot more money while the majority suffer because of it.

so you can see that unions actually help everyone in the long run.

think about it.

Why does everybody think that health benefits is the only reason we are on stike? When it's time to renew a contract, both sides need to realize that a compromise is going to be needed from BOTH SIDES!
Besides our bevefits being cut by 50%, they want a wage freeze of 2/3 years, and they want to freeze our pensions!
To add to all of this, they want to instill in a two tier contract, meaning an entirley different contract for new hires. that means lower wages for them and even lower health beneifts for them. Essentially, Vons will turn into another local WAL-MART, min. wage, no benefits, without your prices going down!
WE ARE WILLING TO COMPROMISE! But they arent. they're attitude is TAKE IT OR LEAVE IT!
Have you heard of CORPORATE GREED?

This isn't just about $5 a week or even $15 a week to pay for your medical benefits.
It's about employers taking care of their employees. the ones who help them earn their millions and billions of dollars of profit.
And because unoin employees do make a fair wage they are able to help the economy in your local area and state. they are able to eat in your restraunts, buy your products and services and in general help the local economy.
where companies like walmart actually do harm to the economy because they do not pay a decent wage to their employees. they take the profits and run.
if they were to pay union scale and benefits then this would help the economy greatly.

and working in a grocery store may seems easy till you do it. But, try standing up all day. and putting up with all the different kinds of customers for 8 hours.
plus, constantly being watched and evaluated to see that you are indeed working fast enough. which according to management no one is ever fast enough.
ever.

and no one seems to mention the two tier system they want also.
this is just a way for the owners to slowly force the higher waged expierenced people out of their jobs.

so this issue infact is more of a concern than just the pay something for your health care issue.

this alone is enough to say no way and strike till this issue is pulled from the contract.

how would you like to work for someone who makes millions of dollars of profit a year and then tells you he can't pay for your medical benefits. And that he will only be able to pay you a raise of say 25 cents a year.
but then you will have to pay more than the raise he gave you to cover your medical benefits.
so, with inflation and now paying for your own medical
benefits you are actually bring home less dollars now than you did before.

It is also about principals. about taking care of your people that actually helped you make all this money.
And the fact that you can be fair to them while still making a profit for yourself.

but, when greed becomes the only motive and at the cost of the people who helped you make it; well, this isn't fair/nice/polite/ or the the right thing to do.

And it is bad in the long run for all concerned.
and it hurts everyone by being bad for the economy of the local area and the state too.

when people have money to spend on food, clothing, housing and some for extras it helps create jobs and puts tax dollars into the general fund to come back and help everyone in the area.

so you see it is about more than just paying for mediacl benefits.

it's about being fair and smart and doing what is good for all and not just being greedy or concerned about how you can make more money at everyone elses expense.


and just because one person or company or chain does something doesn't mean it's right or that you need to do it too.

if all the companies went union and paid fair wages and medical and pensions to their employees then the whole economy would be better off.

and the companies would actually make more money because more people would be working and making enough to spend more.

and if you are not working or not making as much as a
clerk at the stores then i do feel this would help you out too.
for if all the chains were union and and paid a fair scale to their employees plus, their medical and pensions then their business would increase. and they would have to hire more employees.
maybe, even build more stores. or increase the size of the stores they now have.
this would create more jobs all around. and you could eventually get a job say at one of the chains and make more yourself. plus, you'd get medical and pension too.

with all this money going around the employers would make millions more , the employees would make more, and the other businesses would make more as the employees spend more, and more taxes would be collected to go into the general funds to pay for the scholos and roads and such.

so everyone would win.

rather than the current case happening now.
the employers make more by cutting wages and getting rid of their most valuable expierenced employees.
these now former employees must now get help from the state. they actually take money from the general funds. there are fewer jobs . and thus less peolpe spending money and fewer taxes being collected and more money being paid out instead.

so yes the employers make more money but at everyone elses expense.
so a few make a lot more money while the majority suffer because of it.

so you can see that unions actually help everyone in the long run.

think about it.

I believe this strike has gone out of control. Grocery store workers get paid well anyway and of course since you are working for a Union they won't take away all of your benefits. If you need something, just ask God and he will answer.

I have been walking right through the picket lines to get food. I think this is crazy and selfish. Last night, i went down the street to get milk for my daughter and people shoving signs in my face because you all want more money and better healthcare. I think everyone needs to get in touch with the Lord.

Also, i know a lot of people that aren't with a Union and has already had their health benefits cut already and you don't see them whining about it.

Many workers have to pay some of the cost of their health benefits. At my job, employees generally pay around $38 a month for their health insurance. Considering health insurance ranges in the hundreds per month, you are getting a great deal. $20 per month is not that unreasonable, and full time workers are losing at least $480 per week at $12 an hour during this strike. One week of not working will pay for 2 years of health coverage at the current rate.

This is another example of a union forcing employees to lose more money than they stand to gain.

> Albertson's made over 19 billion last year and doesn't want to help workers.

False. In FY2002, Albertson's made $485 million. Compare this to net earnings of $801 million in FY1998.


> Many workers have to pay some of the cost of their health benefits.

True. 90% of working Americans pay some portion of their health benefits premiums.

I think that the strike is pointless. Everything is life is not free get over it! I pay a percentage of my health insurance and I expect to do so. Running a business is expensive and I can see things from a corporate standpoint if the grocery stores don't buckle down and tighten their belts then some of them will eventually end up going out of business because of being incapable to compete with pricing and so on. People don't want to put things into perspective and see the reality of it all with 70,000 employess and employers paying about $400-$600 per month per employee for health coverage it runs about $336,000,000 .. Now really that is a lot of money! I just think that this whole thing is exaggerated because working at a grocery store is not hard I know because I am doing it. I am a scab and sure it is laborous work, but so is any other job. I am there because I can make $17 an hour while the employees are outside in the cold crying about paying a small percentage of their health insurance which is something that they should be taking care of in the first place. Thanks for the spare cash $$$

No vote, no support! It's that simple. We could talk forever about the issues, and how much is to much or who's being greedy but no argument from either side matters. Neither myself nor was my community given the opportunity to vote on something that could impact our daily lives like a grocery strike could. Yet you ask, no you stand in front of the stores and demand, our support? To myself and the other non striking people in my community, those on the picket lines are seen, with growing animosity, as a group of thugs harassing people. We want to call the police and have them removed just as if it were any other day and a group of people were trying to prevent us from going into "our" grocery store. If you can understand all of this, you might understand how we feel, especially about the outrageous idea of lending our support!

Walmart, a non-union corporation and other like it, are a major reason why the management of the chains being struck are pressuring employees whith these roll-backs in pay and benefits!

BOYCOTT WALMART AND OTHER NON-UNION SUPERMARKETS!

Picketers are violent, rude and utterly ridiculuos! If you want to make a point, do so in an educated manner not harrassing the customers and calling the replacement workers "scabs"!!!! Note: one of the replacement workers was attacked at the Jurupa valley Albertsons by the picketers!

I am so disappointed in the people and comments I have read about his article. People have become so insensitive and selfish. Working for a grocery store is not a "cushy" job where you get rich quick without working for it. My husband works extremly hard (night crew) and earns every penny he makes. One reason he kept this job is because of the health benefits for our three children. We are willing to put some money toward the health benefits but we must trust the union when it comes to how much. We don't have all of the details and we don't have a choice as to how to handle the situation. What I do know is this is hurting our family tremendously. We have been working very hard for many years to buy a home and our loan is supposed to fund tomorrow. However, I got a call tonight telling us it probably won't fund because my husband is on strike! It won't hurt people to buy their groceries elsewhere until this is resolved. Please look beyond your own convenience and support the collective group. You may need to ask for help one day and one way to ensure you receive it is to be here for us now. Thank you.

500 million profit in year 2002,thanks to union sweat!you need to wake up to reality.what these people want to keep is a drop in the bucket compared to what these corporate leeches make in one year!

"a drop in the bucket compared to what these corporate leeches make in one year"

These "corporate leeches" (I imagine you are speaking about the owners and the managers) are the reason these business exist -- literally. The striking union workers are simply cogs in the machine created by the management. The fact that replacement workers can come in and train in such short time is a reminder of the low-skill nature of this work.

Re: "I am so disappointed in the people and comments I have read about his article. "

Why? The biggest weakness of honest liberals is their faith that they can ultimately awaken the conscience of bigots and oligarchs. They are convinced that everyone has a good heart, that injustices in society derive from misunderstanding, and that they must always strive for consensus with those who simply want to rule and exploit others. That's simply not true. There are people in society who have no conscience, and who delight in the misery of others if they think it contributes one iota to their own comforts. Face the truth and get over it. Stop thinking that you have to get such people to "understand"; stop thinking that you have any common bond or common ground with these scum. They don't have any with you. They are your enemy. They hate you. They hate you because you are a worker and they fear you. They see their own fortunes in life as inexticably tied to the immiseration of workers, and so they develop an unbridled contempt for workers while at the same time constantly fearing the prospect of workers organizing and fighting back. So stop worrying about what they think. Fight back.

I'm encouraged. It's nice to see some unions getting off their knees and fighting back for a change. The rank and file members need to keep a fire under the union leaders and not let them sell out the struggle. You cannot waiver. You have to win this strike.

Don't get discouraged at right-wing chauvinists who lash out with anti-worker hate speech. Shut down their businesses. Shut down their mass transit. If the workers are united and geunuinely fight to win, they can defeat their enemies. And a fighting labor movement that starts beating back the assault on workers will win new allies to its cause. So let the pathetic wannabe attack dogs of the oligarchy scream and whine. It's a sign they are scared, and that is plenty of reason to be encouraged.

We have upstanding young men overseas risking their lives on a daily basis earning less than grocery store employees,simply to protect your right to be an idiot.Your mob-oh,sorry,the line between the mob[yes,organized crime]and the union has become blurred......
Really,now,the job you do is worth only what someone will pay you for it.I would rather know that I can be proud of my accomplishments in the world because I deserve to be,not that I am getting more benefits than I deserve[and than most other Americans get]because someone is strong-arming my employer.That flies directly in the face of every principle this country was founded on.........
I hope the markets get the hint.There are a lot of people out there ECSTATIC to get a job for $12 an hour[I believe thats what the non-union employees are making] even without benefits,like most of the rest of us,and I hope they remain.All you union people should do the upstanding thing.If you don't like the terms of your employment,type up a resume like the rest of us and hit the pavement!

<<These "corporate leeches" (I imagine you are speaking about the owners and the managers) are the reason these business exist -- literally.>>

without the bourgeosie there is no proletariat; without the proletariat there is no bourgeosie. they exist in a dialectical relationship, both forging and forged by capitalist social relations.

the negation of capitalism is the negation of both the proletariat and the bourgeosie.

once that 's accomplished, we'll never again hear that a grocery store can't exist without exploiters and parasites.

I can't believe all these comments from people saying "What's the big deal to pay $5 for health benefits". They need to get all the facts before they start shooting off their big mouths. I would love to see the the proposed contract from the Big Greedy companies to the union members publised in the newspaper so people can get the facts straight and see what the Greddy Companies really want to take away. We need to fight for what we have worked hard for. For those people who have never worked in a grocery store or a grocery distribution center should walk in our shoes just for one shift and I can guarantee you will never say again that it is a "no brainer job". I doubt that you would even last a shift. All we are asking is for support you don't want to give it that is your right . Don't put us down till you do the job. I don't think you would appreciate it if I put doen the job you work hard at. The new contract proposed by the The Big Greedy companies decreases my salary significantly. If you would like to see the proposed contract, use your search engine if you know what that is and search U.F.C.W. Southern California and many different locals will come up and the click on any one of them. The proposed contract has been posted on all UF.C.W. websites and see the facts. If you want to state how you feel about the strike that is fine but do not make comments about how much the companies are asking us to contribute until you know the facts. You only show how ignorant you are .

you said "For those people who have never worked in a grocery store or a grocery distribution center should walk in our shoes just for one shift and I can guarantee you will never say again that it is a "no brainer job". I doubt that you would even last a shift."

I say - from the quality of your grammar and spelling (including your name!) it is quite evident that you fit the "no brainer" stereotype. The average grocery store grunt is quite young and immature and inexperienced. You proved it for us. Go back to school and pay attention next time. Good grief, I have noticed that as I walked past you in the picket line and gone into the store that the efficiency is improved! reality sucks huh?!

<<Good grief, I have noticed that as I walked past you in the picket line and gone into the store that the efficiency is improved!>>

You meant to say:

Good grief, when I walked past you in the picket line I noticed that the store's efficiency has improved!

(It's still a stupid and poorly-conceived comment, but improved considerably.)

So, "bc," what was that you were saying about education?

sorry that I didn't spend the hours requisite reading all the boring postings, but hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmaaron aarons, couldn't you have posted something more of substance. and for those of you in solidarity with the grocer's union comrades, please don't scab and cross those lines.

an old berkeley tactic is too actually go into the store, stock your basket until it's overflowing and get to the scab checker and say "Oh gosh, I left my wallet in the car" and walk out and don't come back until at least a half hour later. just one old tactic. not crossing the picket line is better, but with so many scumbags doing so, creating gridlock at the checkout line is just as relevant.

remember joe hill:

AN INJURY TO ONE IS AN INJURY TO ALL

fuck, was it just joe who said that--or every wob?

DON'T CROSS PICKETS--OR ELSE GREVIOUS BODILY HARM.

Guy

I have spent several summers working grocery jobs. I do not need health benefits, as I am a full-time student living at home.

Grocery store jobs are not meant to be able to support a family.

If liberals support American workers, stop immigration. What do we expect corporations to do when their competitors are hiring cheaper employees? Do you think they will charge more for their product so they can give their bag boy a pension plan? Why should American families who buy groceries support this untenable scenario the union seeks?

grocery jobs aren't meant to support a family? How did you derive that? The people discussing this here are off their rocker. Have you ever heard that only 25% of adults get a college degree, and a large fraction of them still won't find a job that requires a degree, because most 'work' involves making something or doing a service, and not being boss or using a graduate degree in specialized service. You only want lawyers to be able to have children.

Here is the question you all should be asking yourself: how come my grandfather who graduated with a bachelor's in 1916 Nebraska was able to have a 3 storey house, five kids with good clothes, a maid, stay at home mom, car etc. during the Great Depression, as he worked as a traveling paper products salesman at drug stores and department stores.
Now, after years and years of technological productivity boosts like electricity, computers, machines that do lots of our work, and, many more people have college degrees, people definitely live in smaller houses, have fewer kids, perhaps 2 cars, and *two earners per household* (which you think would double the productivity and standard of living), and lots of people can barely afford to buy a house in California (top 20% can afford median house in San Fran), lots of people can't afford health insurance, and we feel like everything is constantly getting more and more expensive.
And the people in this thread act like grocery workers who want to stay at the same level of earnings are 'greedy', even though agriculture has especially had lots of productivity and mechanization boosts. How come the farmers and the lower level sales employees don't benefit when it is much cheaper to make food and to transport, package and sell it now? The prices at my local grocery store certainly are as high as ever, and if consumers, farmers and store workers aren't making this money, that $$ gap between the cost of production and sales is going somewhere.

Here is the reason why the United States has had so many technological productivity increases and women are in the work force, but many things like rent and basic healthcare for a healthy person seem to be getting more and more expensive, and the major lifestyle increases over the past 60 years have mainly been the dozen consumer electronics that you use around the house, having fruit shipped in from Chile and Hawaii during the winter, and getting new cars more often - (even though productivity has more than doubled).

In ecology, there is a paradox called the 'green world' question. All herbivores, such as insects, rabbits, deer, mice etc. are able to reproduce very quickly, if they have unlimited resources. Yet in very few natural areas- grasslands, forests, marshes etc. do you see a situation where all the plants have been chewed down due to huge numbers of herbivores. In fact, plants are not controlled or limited from the top by herbivores- they are usually limited from the bottom by lack of space or of a nutrient in the soil.

Why don't herbivores explode, in natural situations? They are controlled from the top-down by predators. When aphids reproduce, ladybugs reproduce and eat lots of aphids. Mountain lions eat excess deer, so in real natural situations, it is rare to see a deer.

In agricultural areas, the amount of plant life lost to herbivores can *far exceed* that of natural situations because the mountain lion will be removed so deer can eat everything, and bird predators on insects are often driven away because they would take some of the crop too, and pesticides can kill the bugs that eat the herbivore aphids. The herbivores get a 'release' from the predator, and so they can be far more 'productive', in terms of gathering and keeping as much energy from plants as they can. When the predator is added to the situation, the increase in productivity from the plant level always filters up to the predator.

Compare this to people. The grocery store workers and farmers are the herbivores. They are doing the work, being the actual productive part of the equation.

When the grocery store workers use a machine or work harder and are more productive, if the owner doesn't pay more, the owner gets to keep the increased profit. If workers get an increase in wages (picture San Fran during the dot.com boom), the landlords at the top will start asking for and getting higher rents, so the increase profit goes to the landlord, while the employee still keeps the same small paycheck at the end of the month.

this is how things work. for every increase by workers, the higher class is able to take it away from them until the point where many workers would start to reach collapse such as homelessness or inability to be efficient at work any further due to health.

Perhaps "Greenworld would be a little less cynical if he used some of the herbs he speaks of!

Let's see...$5 per week times 4 weeks is basically $20 per month. A full month is 172 hours. At $15 per hour, a full-time worker would pay less than 1% for individual healthcare. At $15 per week times 4 weeks the amount rises to $60 and is about 2.3% for a family. If the worker is employed a minimum of 24 hours (60% of full time) the percentages become 1.3% and 3.9%, respectively. With a bachelors degree and a masters degree, I pay 5% for individual coverage and would pay 14% for my family, if I could afford to pay it. - signed: A working mom and sole support

Encouraged, you said... " Stop thinking that you have to get such people to "understand"; stop thinking that you have any common bond or common ground with these scum. They don't have any with you. They are your enemy. They hate you. " ... and ... "Don't get discouraged at right-wing chauvinists who lash out with anti-worker hate speech. Shut down their businesses."

This is exactly the kind of destructive, insulting, class warfare mentality that will keep Unions and Leftists in general out of serious discussion about labor issues and other problems. When union employees view their employer as 'the enemy' they achieve nothing other than to lay the foundation for future problems. Get over your victim mentality and grow up.

Further, simply because some people disagree with the stiking workers doesn't mean they hate workers.

Your name calling does no work for you either.

Grow up.

Your Word Perfect is on the blink! Was that striking workers or stinking workers?

Bosses are parasites

The worker-owned, worker-self managed workplace is the wave of the future. Work to make it happen sooner or get the hell out of the way.

Then start your own company.Don't bully -that's right,I said BULLY someone who is already succesful so you can take over theirs!

As a matter of fact, some of us have already done that.

See:

http://www.sfbg.com/nessie/38.html

http://www.indybay.org/news/2002/06/135212.php

Personally, I think wage slavery should be left where it deserves to be, on the trash heap of history. In the meantime, wages should reflect reality. No one who works should have to live like they don't.

I’m 55. When I was twenty, I had an entry level job, file clerk, that paid 5% over minimum wage. I worked sixty hours a week. I could afford a modest one bedroom apartment on Manhattan. My wife stayed home with our baby. We ate out a couple nights a week. On Saturday we’d hire a sitter and go to a show. We still managed to save up enough to buy a car.

Try that today. Today it takes most families two to three jobs to break even. On 5% over minimum wage, you can’t afford to move out of your momma’s house. What changed? Union membership declined, the working class became weaker and, predictably, the the ruling class screwed us over.

What needs to change, is the class nature of society.

I think that is awful because "scabs" need to make a living too they (we) are not trying to harm anyone just make money for ourselves. I really need the money personally otherwise I would not be a so-called "scab"

you wouldn't have a job offer if it weren't for the fact that other workers are putting their neck on the line to fight for better conditions--so spare us the sanctimonious crap about needing to make a living. by strike-breaking you are undermining worker's greatest source of leverage against the bosses--our abiltiy to collectively withhold our labor.

the bosses you assist today don't give a shit about you, don't respect you (why should they?), and will fuck you over the minute they deem it in their interest to do so.

as to the living standard's of american workers:
with the exception of the 1995-2000 speculative boom years (which saw only small aggregate wage increases), american real wages have been declining for almost thirty years now: the working class is more indebted then ever; housing, health, child care, and education eat up a much greater percentage of our wages than in the 70's, fewer have real pension plans, social programs have been hacked apart, and the average work week is longer than it's been in decades.

so, to all of you boot-licking workers who like to absorb these attacks without EVER fighting back, all I have to say is: GET THE FUCK OUT OF THE WAY.

The way to market yourself as a valuable employee is to be skilled enough to have a valuable position with a company.Obviously people like you need to band together and intimidate employers because you have no real marketable skills-hence the trash mouth you think gets your point across.With a mouth like yours you are not an asset to any company.If I were you,I would stick with the union,because without them you would be unemployed.Something else to consider-if you were educated and skilled,you would get your point across to a much more sympathetic audience articulately,so people could understand you and would want to understand you.Until then,since you obviously are a complete moron,stick with the union-hopefully you won't starve.

You people are IDIOTS! Take a long look at what is bieng offered by the company and take a longer look at what your so called union is offering. Are they looking after you or themselves. While personally I don't like unions.I feel that if I can't excell and maintian a position on my own, I dont need to have that position. There are those that need the union to better themselves. I am not harshing on anyone for what is going on but I think with an extra 5 to 15 dollars a week taken out of your check is not near the almost 800 dollars a month it takes to be insured. if you want to see where all the money is and who has it in the union, take a look at what your union reps and higher ups drive. Then you'll know!

People are so self serving and selfish. I am tired of hearing, "I have to pay for my health insurance so you should too." It's like a bunch of kids not wanting other kids to have what they don't. So... the health insurance is the great part of the job - there is nothing wrong with that. These people work hard and deserve it! Stop thinking about yourself and your convenience for a moment and support the people.

Re: "This is exactly the kind of destructive, insulting, class warfare mentality that will keep Unions and Leftists in general out of serious discussion about labor issues and other problems."

Oh, this is rich. Clearly, "Reality Check" needs a reality check. You might want to pull your head out of your ass and take a hard look at reality. The unions and leftists are today completely shut out of "serious discussion" precisely because of how surrender monkeys like you have sabotaged the left for decades. The labor unions were built by militant class struggle, not the sort of craven liberal treachery you peddle. The fact is there is a class war going on in society, but its one-sided because the labor unions are beholden to liberal bureaucrats more interested in protecting their own cushy salaries and stumping for votes for the Democrats then in fighting for their own union members.

You show your true colors by having nothing to say about the hate-spewing worker-bashing, but are so deeply offended by someone who sticks up for workers. You are not fooling anyone. We know what side you are really on. Your liberalism has delivered a world where there is an unrelenting assault on workers, and an unbridled militaristic juggernaut sending soldiers abroad to die for a global dictatorship of Capital.

People like you are just dogs of the oligarchy. To the degree that you push "leftist" reforms, you are like a dog tugging at the leash of its master. You get the master to yield a bit and take a few steps, and you hail your "victory". But when the master steps back, yanks the leash and says "Heal!", you dutifully heal, salute your "command in chief" and rail against the "class warfare" leftists, being the good attack dog of the oligarchy that you are. Those who refuse to be dogs and insist on standing up for their own rights and interests rather than those of the oligarchy draw your ire far more than the bosses, because when it comes right down to it, you are really on the bosses' side.

The workers didn't start the class war, but there is only one way to end it. Not by surrendering as fake-left traitors like you preach, but by fighting back and winning it.

Re: "This is exactly the kind of destructive, insulting, class warfare mentality that will keep Unions and Leftists in general out of serious discussion about labor issues and other problems."

Oh, this is rich. Clearly, "Reality Check" needs a reality check. You might want to pull your head out of your ass and take a hard look at reality. The unions and leftists are today completely shut out of "serious discussion" precisely because of how surrender monkeys like you have sabotaged the left for decades. The labor unions were built by militant class struggle, not the sort of craven liberal treachery you peddle. The fact is there is a class war going on in society, but its one-sided because the labor unions are beholden to liberal bureaucrats more interested in protecting their own cushy salaries and stumping for votes for the Democrats then in fighting for their own union members.

You show your true colors by having nothing to say about the hate-spewing worker-bashing, but are so deeply offended by someone who sticks up for workers. You are not fooling anyone. We know what side you are really on. Your liberalism has delivered a world where there is an unrelenting assault on workers, and an unbridled militaristic juggernaut sending soldiers abroad to die for a global dictatorship of Capital.

People like you are just dogs of the oligarchy. To the degree that you push "leftist" reforms, you are like a dog tugging at the leash of its master. You get the master to yield a bit and take a few steps, and you hail your "victory". But when the master steps back, yanks the leash and says "Heal!", you dutifully heal, salute your "command in chief" and rail against the "class warfare" leftists, being the good attack dog of the oligarchy that you are. Those who refuse to be dogs and insist on standing up for their own rights and interests rather than those of the oligarchy draw your ire far more than the bosses, because when it comes right down to it, you are really on the bosses' side.

The workers didn't start the class war, but there is only one way to end it. Not by surrendering as fake-left traitors like you preach, but by fighting back and winning it.

Just so you know, I am a conservative. And just so you know, Thanks for proving my point.

I don't have to pay for my health insurance, so neither should you.

i note that not one "conservative" has refuted the *content* of my earlier post which spoke to the fundamental issues surrounding the Albertson's strike:

"with the exception of the 1995-2000 speculative boom years (which saw only small aggregate wage increases), american real wages have been declining for almost thirty years now: the working class is more indebted then ever; housing, health, child care, and education eat up a much greater percentage of our wages than in the 70's, fewer have real pension plans, social programs have been hacked apart, and the average work week is longer than it's been in decades."
$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

another thought:

to argue that because most grocery store workers don't have an advanced degree they shouldn't complain about the conditions they face is the exactly the same thing as arguing that 75% of the American adult population (the % of the US adult pop. without advanced degrees) should accept any and all demands the bosses place upon them.

it's precisely *because* grocery work doesn't require an advanced degree--most work doesn't, truth be told--that the question of a diploma is a moot issue. the only fact that matters is that the owners of grocery stores absolutely NEED workers to make the grocery store run. no grocery store workers, no grocery store. period.

what makes this "argument" even more asinine is that, as we speak, thousands and thousands of people with PhD's are UNEMPLOYED. of course, these clowns making this brain-dead argument are disingenous toads: they wouldn't support workers however much education they have under their belt (were you asswipes out on the picket line with the graduate students at UC last year?).

Ok people, you are ALL missing something. How come people aren't looking at the issue of why health care costs are rising? Inflation? I don't think so! The entire health care system is a friggin' mess, prices that drug companies, hospitals, doctors, etc charge to insurance companies are insane! Why isn't anyone pissed off about this? If health care insurance costs weren't rising, this entire thing would be a non-issue.

On another point, I despise the entire process of contract negotiations between unions and companies. It seems just like what happens when you go to a dealership to buy a new car. One side comes in with a low-ball offer, the other side has a ridiculously inflated price. Eventually after LOTS and LOTS of going around and around, they meet in the middle. It's unfortunate but important to note that regarding unions and management, BOTH sides play these games. Lots of propaganda comes from each side. I'm tired of hearing how grocery workers are the innocent victims here (c'mon, you guys have to admit you have it pretty darn good as it is for unskilled labor), and I'm tired of hearing about companies needing to reduce benefits to be competitive (why don't they look at cutting the executive salaries, getting rid of excess middle management, etc?)

That's my .02

while you fat laze americans are sitting with pickit sign out front of store, I can get a side job for a while.

this just the same as berkeley bowl, I tell manager that i work for 25% less than other workers and bingo!
I have new job, I also get brother hired in same deal
I drive a cab at night but if safeway strike comes here
brother will drive my cab and i get a job at safeway.
good deal! i love america!

Listen, "reality check," i could suffer a massive brain injury and still demolish you in debate. Got that?

The fact that you think 'erudite' is an impressive word, coupled with your chimp-like, cliched-ridden understanding of the present social/economic/political situation says alot about your level of erudition.

Anyway, enough doin' the dozens on a big zero...let's get down to bidness.

<<Your use of terms like "the bosses" reeks of 1930's resentment>>
i've never heard that before: "1930's resentment"--that's a good one.

<<(a time when it was actually justified).>>
oh, don't flatter yourself, "rc". you would have been as much of boot-licking cretin in the 30's as you are now in 00's.

<<Further, "the bosses" are people, such as your manager (in the very unlikely event you actually have a job)>>
the rightist's obligatory "get a job" comment.
you get an 'F' for originality, 'rc"

<<Does your manager know he/she is one of "the bosses"?>>
in a word: yes.

<<Have you told your "boss" that they "don't give a shit about you, don't respect you" ... ? Have you???>>
no, i'll leave that to the idle whiners.

<<Do you have the guts to live by your words?>>
well, i did help lead a five day wildcat strike back in 2000 (January 12-18) that won us an approximately 60% wage-hike, plus a lot of respect. (DMS Corp. was the victim)

<<The "working class" is more inbebt than ever because the 'working class' is SPENDING more than ever.>>
about two weeks ago a report came out by two business researchers (a mother-daughter team) who looked into the massive escalation of debt and found that not to be the case. by their own admission, they expected to find that the debt explosion was due to profligacy and frivolous shopping habits, but found, instead, that the combined force of housing, child care, health, education, and car costs were the real culprit. i'll try to dig up that report and post.

<<You also mention a litany of other financial woes for 'the working class' and offer no actual numbers, making it all to easy to dismiss your claims. You need to learn that when making claims about economics you'd better have some numbers on the table. >>
okay, here goes. these are just what i could bunch together after a quick search; it's just the tip of the iceberg, really.
since most of this data is at least a year old (indeed, a good portion of it is from the late 90s when the bubble economy was allegedly spreading the wealth around generously to everyone) it really doesn't reveal the extent of the present malaise. things are only getting worse, after all......

1. Between 1990 and 2002, average American household
credit-card debt increased from $2,985 and $8,562,
according to the National Foundation for Credit
Counseling.
(Seattle Times, “Steeped in debt: Good times end;
spending doesn’t,” 10/13/02)

2. The share of American workers with company pension
plans has progressively slipped in each decade--from
almost 40% at the beginning of 1980 to about 20% now.
(Fortune, “Bye-Bye Pension: Soon hundreds of
corporations may slash pensions by as much as half,”
3/3/03)

3. After adjusting for inflation, the average tuition
at a four-year public university increased 117%
between 1981 and 2001. The rise at private
universities was 123%.
(Wall Street Journal, “Economic Squeeze Has More
Students Working Overtime,” 11/5/02)

4. Eighty-two percent of employers expect to raise
retirees' contributions to health insurance premiums
over the next three years, and 22 percent say they are
likely to drop coverage for future retirees, according
to a survey of large employers.
(Chicago Sun-Times, “82% to raise retirees’ costs for
health care,” 12/6/02)

5. Home prices rose 45 to 52 percent between 1991-2001
in the United States.
(CNNMoney, “Homes out of reach,” 5/20/02)

6. “Health care costs are rising while the economy is
sputtering, and it looks like workers are going to pay
the price” -- Drew Altman, Kaiser Foundation

7. Requests for emergency shelter by families with
children in 25 US cities increased by an average of
17% between 99-00. 27% of request for shelter by
homeless families were denied due to lack of
resources. Families with children account for 36% of
the homeless population. (US Conference of Mayors,
2000)

8. The number of people officially classified as poor
increased 41% between 1979-90 (US House of
Representatives, 1992)

9. Between 1970 and 1994, the typical state’s AFDC
benefits for a family of three fell 47%, after
adjusting for inflation AFDC was repealed and
replaced by Temporary Assistance to Needy Families.
TANF benefits and food stamps combined are below the
poverty rate in every state. (Greenberg and Baumohl,
1996).

10. With the end of AFDC -- 675,000 people have lost
health insurance in 97, including 400,000 children.
(Families USA, 1999)

11. Subsidized housing is so limited that fewer than one
in four TANF families nationwide lives in public
housing or receives a housing voucher. (Families USA,
1999)

12. New York Times, 8/30/01, “Boom of the 1990’s Missed
Many in Middle Class, Data Suggests”
Census analysis conducted by the NYT shows that median
family income between 90-00 clearly declined in NY,
CA, Conn, and Washington DC. In NY -- declined to an
estimated $52,313, down $2,876; California declined to
$53,037, down $3,288; Conn -- declined to $64,502,
down $3,821; Wash DC -- declined to $45,943, down
$4,406.

13. San Francisco Chronicle, 6/25/02, “Cost of Bay Area
homes still rising”, pp B1
The most expensive was Marin at a median sale price of
$588K and SF second most expensive $571K, San Mateo
$532K, Santa Clara $461K, Alameda $391K.

there are no lines. there are no delays. discounts galore. and the best thing? there are no checkers with snotty attitudes. i once waited in line while a checker chatted in spanish with a customer when she was leaving, but then i walked out on the checker and went to costco. after this strike is over, i will treat vons and ralphs like the MLB strike. i will choose other areas of interest. i will shop at non union markets. why pay a checker 19 dollars an hour when a 7-11 clerk gets 8? do the math. you strikers need to get a real job. the markets gave no promise to supportyou forever. disolve the pensions and send the savings to the real important people, the shoppers.

I am sympathetic to the striking employees and have not shopped at Ralphs this week, which I am normally in 3-4 times a week. However, I am unwilling to rearrange my life around where I can buy a gallon of milk for much longer, especially considering they aren't even negotiating at this point.

so among the 70 percent working part-time they are asking them to pay $5 a week for health care?

you work part time you get health care and you are complaining?

really people you live in CALIFORNIA how about joining the rest of the state, WE ALL PAY UP THE ##S FOR EVERYTHING

so get back to work I need someone to push my cart back up to the front of the stoor and mop up the jar of pickles I dropped in isle 2b, thanks gbye

Aaron,you are a worthless,vulgar,skanky, hostile,angry ,scummy,foul-mouthed poor excuse for a human being. I feel sorry for all the people who have to come across you in the course of a day. Well,at least you had the decency to show your true colors......now go find a job cleaning toilets where you belong. It will give you time to think about what happened in your life to make you so hateful.

LONG LIVE THE UNION ! ! !

Okay, lets say for a second that I support the strike. Where should I shop? Are they Union? Do they have health care and high wages? No? So you are saying that you aren't against the situation; you just want more money for yourself? Hey, I can't argue with that! That is why I am proud to be shopping at Von's... so I can do my part to force the Union out and get more money for myself by paying less for groceries. Can you blame ME?

Please do not misunderstand me. Unions have and do a lot of good. They also can be hurtful by putting personal interests ahead of the companies. Von's has three choices right now:

1. Not turn a profit. (this will end up eliminating all jobs)
2. Cut jobs.
3. Cut benefits.

Basically guys, I wish you would get back to work. Things suck all over right now. The economy is crap. We are all suffering. Deal with it.

Your unskilled job of standing up part time and scanning items past a computer eye is not meant as a career. Your union got you in a position where you made more than you are worth and didn't have to join the rest of society in paying for your healthcare. Now it is time to put up or move on. Aim a little higher and get off the gravy train if you don't like it, and by the way Albertsons only nets 7 cents of every dollar it grossed last year, which you would understand if you took some college business classes in some of your plentiful off hours.

Alright, they get 15 an hour on weekdays, 25 an hour on weekends and something around 50 an hour on holidays. I get 10 an hour on weekdays, 10 an hour on weekends and 10 an hour on holidays. I do not get any benifits! Paying twenty dollars a month for health insurance is a bargan. What their employer is offering is sweet as plum. Yeah, poor exploited union.

Hey all you striker dipshits, you can call me a scab all you like and tell me to get a job, but the fact is that I got your job. And I gots to get paid. If you think albertsons gives a fuck about you standing out in front with a sign, you are really wrong. Perhaps Albertsons will lose a little money in the next 6 months because of new workers. But after 6 months, those new workers will be as trained and experienced as you are. And Albertsons will be right back to where they were, making more money because they don't have to put up with your communist shit.

You need to face it. You've all lost your jobs because you are no longer competitive in the free market. This is called capitalism. If you don't like it, move to China. If anything you should be upset at and picketing, it's the illegal immigrants and immigrants coming to the USA driving up housing costs and driving down wages. It's these immigrants that have cost you your jobs, but you refuse to acknowledge this and pretend that you can keep on living the same despite the fact that Manuel and his 25 roomates has moved into your neighborhood and will do your job for 1/4 of what you demand for it.

Timmy--

Get back to logic class--quickly!

Lots of emotion,but vey little else.

Unless grocery clerks have been spirited from Ireland as indentured servants, the decision to seek and remain in their positions, is theirs.

I have seen my insurance premium contributions raised consistantly over the past several years. My contribution for medical-dental is now about $325.00 a month. I have also seen my employer's contribution to retirement shrink significantly. I left a more prestigious and better paying position for the one I now have,
because I enjoy what I do and the flexibility it offers me.

Companies have left the state in droves because of the high cost of doing business here. Before the Teamsters are looked upon as the great protector, one should cast one's eyes to Detroit, to Pittsburg, and of late, Sacramento. The unions are businesses, just like politics, and just like politicians, the first goal of any union is its survival, not the well being of its members.

Corporations are responsible to their stock holders, not their employees, pure and simple, so the rhetoric regarding profits would no doubt have played better in the the old Soviet block than in the thinking mans free market society.

I'm sure the truth about actual management offers and union demands lies somewhere in the middle of what we've seen and heard, and I'm equally sure the grocery clerks should count their lucky stars that teir jobs can't be exported...but what out for those sell-scanners!

I'm sorry but I don't think I'm sympathetic with this striking issue. When the strikes first started. I didn't know much about it and I thought "Hey, the grocery stores must be trying to take advantage of these poor people" and I wouldn't cross the picket line but now that I've been enlightered about the issues, I think Vons, Albertson's, or Ralph's has a gallon of milk that is calling my name.

This country is under so much economic stress because of people from other countries and here you are adding to it because you don't want to pay a portion of your benefit costs? You don't have to like it but you either have to deal with it or find another job that will give it to you for free. No one made you take this job and no one is making you keep it either. You act like these people owe you. Why do they owe you? Just because you worked for a company for a length of time doesn't make you there family. They are a business just like anywhere else and it is there right to make any changes they see fit. From what I read, the contract was up. At this point, they can do anything they want. They don't owe you the same contract and terms as before. As for the fact of new people coming in and not getting paid as high, well I don't think the employers are going to lie to them and tell them they are going to get paid more that they are so they will know exactly what they are walking into.

Things change...Situations change and if companies do it within their rights then you either need to decide to take it or leave it. If your not happy with your job, then maybe it's time to learn a new one and move on. I'm sure there are many people out there that would be happy to make what you make or less for that matter and be able to have benefits for their children at a VERY affordable rate. Just to put things into perspective for you, I pay $220 a month for myself and my 3 children through my work and I'm not complaining. At least it's cheaper that have to pay for everything for a broken arm or god forbid surgery for one of my kids one day.

Insurance benefits are high and are only getting higher. So if you want to make a stand on something, why don't you try making a stand on the rising cost of benefits, not the fact that you actually have to pay a little for some now. I challenge each one of you to do some research and find out what the average cost of benefits for a family with at least 2 kids and see if you can find anything less that $60 a month either through a job (beside the freebies) or through a private party.

Well, I think I've said it all and now I got to go grocery shopping. I'll make sure to bring my pay stub so if anyone wants to try to stop me, I'll make sure to show them what an average person pays for the thing they are complaining about.

Sounds like they are getting a small taste of the real world, you make too much money so they find someone to do it for less, rising cost of insurance a very small portion passed on to the employee who get a decent raise every year who could afford it with ease. BLA, BLA, BLA.

What are you crying about?
I have 11 employees that work under me "3 of them for 8+years" and they make between $7-9.00 per hour paying $65.00 per month for their own insurance, and we work for the worlds 4th largest auto loan company, you know they have the money.

take a look @ reality boys and girls, it isnt so bad.

hope you get what you want, but I still dont understand why the crying.

The worker-owned, worker-self managed workplace is the wave of the future. Work to make it happen sooner or get the hell out of the way.

Plllllease tell me you are not so stupid as to realy believe this line of BS!!!
Labor is preformed by those who lack the skille to make it on their own. you employer supports you not the other way around. Left to your own devices you would starve!

Join a union. Get benefits.

the principles this country was founded on? you'll have to help me remeber what they are. I'm thinking they had something to do with throwing off oppression. there was an event called the boston tea party remeber that ? I think those albertsons employees that are being abused by thier employer should have one of those kinds of parties but..they probably have too much respect for polite civility than our founding fathers did. shame. now you know that albertsons tactics of hording up money is hurting the whole economy so why do you want those wokers to give up and lower there standard of living to go on down the pavement. what do you want , maybe in ten years to see shanty towns popping up all around your neighborhood full of sickness crime and poverty because all of the money is centralized by greedy corporations and whatever service economy lap dogs they have left to serve as a customer base. where do you go down that pavement when the greedy industrialists have left to exploit some other nation for cheap sweat? society has a lot of problems, crime drugs, racial tensions alienation hate apathy fear blah blah the list keeps going if a viewpoint like yours were given effect it would only make it worse. keep driving people down and making them unempowered, but eventually it all blows up in your face that's the lesson history really teaches and the principle this country was founded on.

to lau, if you speak english like you write it. I don't think you would get hired. not even for a scab. Go to school, learn to speak and write english. This way you wont sound so, un-american or foreign..there is another term that escapes me right now. Has something to do with dead from the neck up. Wayne

1. Genocide

2. Slavery

3. Avarice

4. Superior weapons technology

This is one of the most absurd strikes I have seen. Asking grocery workers to pay minimal additional health care costs. Most working citizens are paying above and beyond what they are asking. This will boil down to being replaced, for cheaper products, and cheaper labor. You will put yourselfs out of jobs. Quit sniveling, and get back to work, before you cost me any more tax dollars!!

That's because they aren't smart enough to unionize.

like the rest of your compatriots on the right, you're unable to refute my argument so you take shots at me personally.

personal shots ring hollow when not coupled with an intelligently articulated view-point.

capiche?

I am a highly educated person and work for a highly successful and profitable organization. I personally earn large amounts of profits for my organization. I pay in excess of $200 month for healthcare for my family and, no, it does not cover every single thing 100%. In fact, I have never had a job where all my healthcare was paid for and I have never had a part-time job that offers benefits. The unions are the reason that taxes are higher (most union workers are government employees) and prices are outrageous in union dominated industries. (Check the price between a Korean car and an American one.) I am not upset or concerned about this strike - - I make enough money that it won't impact me one way or the other. But I do hope that some of you poor union workers will get free of the propaganda your local has fed you. I wonder if the union bosses who orchestrated this strike are not getting paid while you are on strike or after your strike benefits run out. And I bet they make a lot more than $15 hr and I am sure that even if you go back to a job that makes you pay a bit more for healthcare, their insurance will remain unchanged. Think about it.

What a great nonanswer, Natalie.

"Oh poor me, Aaron hurt my feelings injecting reality into my delluded fantasies..."

*wah* *wah* *wah*

You can't refute a thing he has said, so you pull out the "hate" card. And this is after people here have been calling the strikers lazy bitches? Looks like YOU are the bitch, doesn't it?

this post is for all those workers of vons, albertsons, and ralphs that have been affected by this strike...

Hang in there guys, i know things are getting tough right now, and they may get even tougher, but our union is 70,000 strong and what these people fail to realize is that the reason we have such good pay and benefits now is because we have a strong union. I dont know where These selfish, greedy people have been getting there information but they are obviously misinformed. I cant help but to realize the incredible amount of underappreciation we have received from these vile and bitter people, they try to feed us all of these numbers, and figures to us like it is an excuse for these still extremely profitable businesses to take away everything we have worked so hard for! And YES! it is hard work! We make penny's compared to these corporate slobs who get paid an ungodly amount of money to sit in a private office and make unmoral greedy decisions to benefit themselves. These people already have 6 houses and to many cars to count on your hands and feet, and yet they have the nerve to put 70,000 people out of job just so they can have 3 turkey at the dinner table every night! I would love to see one of these businessmen put on a meat apron and go digging through the rancid meat buckets every day! You know what, im sick of wasting my time trying to convince these thick skulled people to show a little more respect for the working class! the bottom line is that there are some people who are born slightly less intelligent than the upper class, and this is no reason to deprive them of a decent life where they can raise a decent family! generally speaking we are not lazy, unmotivated people..... A food clerk used to be a good job where one could look forward to raising a family and retiring, now you either have to be of near genius intelligence or born into wealth to live a decent life. It's sad that these people cannot show a little more sympathy for the middle class

this post is for all those workers of vons, albertsons, and ralphs that have been affected by this strike...

Hang in there guys, i know things are getting tough right now, and they may get even tougher, but our union is 70,000 strong and what these people fail to realize is that the reason we have such good pay and benefits now is because we have a strong union. I dont know where These selfish, greedy people have been getting there information but they are obviously misinformed. I cant help but to realize the incredible amount of underappreciation we have received from these vile and bitter people, they try to feed us all of these numbers, and figures to us like it is an excuse for these still extremely profitable businesses to take away everything we have worked so hard for! And YES! it is hard work! We make penny's compared to these corporate slobs who get paid an ungodly amount of money to sit in a private office and make unmoral greedy decisions to benefit themselves. These people already have 6 houses and to many cars to count on your hands and feet, and yet they have the nerve to put 70,000 people out of job just so they can have 3 turkey at the dinner table every night! I would love to see one of these businessmen put on a meat apron and go digging through the rancid meat buckets every day! You know what, im sick of wasting my time trying to convince these thick skulled people to show a little more respect for the working class! the bottom line is that there are some people who are born slightly less intelligent than the upper class, and this is no reason to deprive them of a decent life where they can raise a decent family! generally speaking we are not lazy, unmotivated people..... A food clerk used to be a good job where one could look forward to raising a family and retiring, now you either have to be of near genius intelligence or born into wealth to live a decent life. It's sad that these people cannot show a little more sympathy for the middle class

The problem is that not only are the workers being asked to give more money for health care (they do not mind doing this), they are being given less coverage. They are being asked to pay half of all costs incurred for medical treatment. If a medicine is $500, they have to pay $250. If a hospitalization is $2500, then they have to pay $1250. If a worker is only making $300 a week, how will they pay their bills? I have also heard from the workers that Chemotherapy will not be covered at all (I have not confirmed this)......Think about it.

for one thing......the major issue isnt the health care...... those A-holes are trying to take away the the worker's PENSIONS that many have busted their butts to earn for the past 15 years. This is the biggest issue of all of em.

Health care is one of the issues..... they want the workers to pay half of their bennies. How many of you have like a 20 dollar co-pay now...? How would you like if the next time you went to the doctor they made you pay for half of the entire visit.?

there are half a dozen things at stake that workers are striking about and the media has only mentioned the health care.....?(how absolutely pathetic).... What has the media been bought off by Big Daddy? To down play the REAL issues and the Main issues .....for somethign that is lesser?

The media needs to cover the Whole story.... how absolutley abysmal. Figures.

Ex-president Bill Clinton gets a blow job and the media gets us every nasty detail they can.

When it comes to the CEO's of Vons/Safeway/ Ralphs/Kroger raping their faithful employees for pensions and other beniefits they were hired with and have worked their asses off for......they cant even get the facts they are reportign correct. Much less ALL of the facts. (duh)

for one thing......the major issue isnt the health care...... those A-holes are trying to take away the the worker's PENSIONS that many have busted their butts to earn for the past 15 years. This is the biggest issue of all of em.

Health care is one of the issues..... they want the workers to pay half of their bennies. How many of you have like a 20 dollar co-pay now...? How would you like if the next time you went to the doctor they made you pay for half of the entire visit.?

there are half a dozen things at stake that workers are striking about and the media has only mentioned the health care.....?(how absolutely pathetic).... What has the media been bought off by Big Daddy? To down play the REAL issues and the Main issues .....for somethign that is lesser?

The media needs to cover the Whole story.... how absolutley abysmal. Figures.

Ex-president Bill Clinton gets a blow job and the media gets us every nasty detail they can.

When it comes to the CEO's of Vons/Safeway/ Ralphs/Kroger raping their faithful employees for pensions and other beniefits they were hired with and have worked their asses off for......they cant even get the facts they are reportign correct. Much less ALL of the facts. (duh)

I don't get it? If a person strikes for more then a week or two and looses their salary for those weeks compared to paying up to $60 per month (Max $720 for the year), where do they see a gain even if they win?

I really think it is the insurance companies and what is happening in our medical system that should be infuriating all of us. First, many of illegal imigrants get all free medical attention, while at they should at least be doing some community service for all the babies born without working parents. Health care costs are outrageous and even nurses are paying alot more for their benefits now that they used to. I think we should get to the root of the problem and not blame the companies that are just trying to continue operating as they have been. I have not crossed the picket line, but I am seriously considering whether I agree with the strike. I think we should look at what is happening all over the country with the medical field and the way it is being handled.

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hope this fixes the scrolling crap

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oops maybe this will work

no you don't need an education to work in the grocery store however almost every single person working on their feet, throwing groceries, and pushing carts have health issues!!! consider that for a moment. neck, back, hand, and leg issues, not to mention high blood pressure. so please take these things into consideration before condeming

I cannot beleive you are crying over paying money out for medical, You should be so Lucky, I am making the same amount of money, and I pay 200.00 a month to cover my children and myself for medical, An HMO.
And they don't cover Everything. I just shelled out 5000. to pay for my child to have dental work needed, and she is a handicap child. So I think you should pay the money and go back to work.
Just remember there are people out the that would love to work, and can't because their to old, and the Homless.

"and working in a grocery store may seems easy till you do it. But, try standing up all day. and putting up with all the different kinds of customers for 8 hours.
plus, constantly being watched and evaluated to see that you are indeed working fast enough. which according to management no one is ever fast enough."

I pasted your quote above. Here is my response:
You knew when you filled out your application that the job required you stand on your feel all day. Fast food workers, beauticians, toll booth workers, etc also work standing on their feet. As far as putting up with customers, you knew that as well. If you don't like it, go look for another job!

"how would you like to work for someone who makes millions of dollars of profit a year and then tells you he can't pay for your medical benefits. And that he will only be able to pay you a raise of say 25 cents a year.
but then you will have to pay more than the raise he gave you to cover your medical benefits.
so, with inflation and now paying for your own medical
benefits you are actually bring home less dollars now than you did before"

It's called capitalism! If you don't like it, you can either move to a country where they have socialism or you can stay here and start your own business. Don't cry to me over how hard you have it. My job requires either a degree or minimum 5 years experience. Unless I work 40 hours per week, I am not entitled to ANY benefits. My current monthly medical premiums are almost $500 per month. I only receive overtime if I work over 8 hours per day or over 40 hours per week.... so cry me a river!

I am most concerned with the notion that only college graduates deserve jobs with good wages, benefits, and fair employers. I think there are a few lines in some very important US documents stating, "All men are created equal" and that we have the right to pursue "life, liberty, and...happiness." Are these workers not following that credo?

Clearly, the grocery store community is not "whining" about $20 a month. There are, in fact, other issues in dispute. I refuse to shop at these stores now out of principle. I don't think it's right to take advantage of workers. I implore the non-supporters to remember on whose backs profits are built. Certainly, a grocery store is nothing without the customer. However, who stocks the shelf (I know I'm not going to). Who rings up the groceries (again, I'm not going to do it myself). Finally, who bags them (once again, not me). These are hard-working Americans who deserve job security, benefits, and fair pay. These are people with families to support. I will not cross the line. Taking a stand by gauging into corporate's pocketbook is what the language they understand.

Additionally, if Von's, et al., succeed with this abysmal contract, what's next? What kind of an example does this set for the rest of corporate America? How secure is anyone's job?

Just food for thought (I purchased at Trader Joe's yesterday).

> I pay 200.00 a month to cover my children and myself for medical, An HMO.
And they don't cover Everything. I just shelled out 5000. to pay for my child to have dental work needed, and she is a handicap child. So I think you should pay the money and go back to work.


I think you should wise up, unionize, and get your fair share.

I dont understand why those of you on strike dont realize corporate america will win in the end. You've got to be kidding right? What are you going to do next, start asking for a pay that can sustain life adequately in this country? Not in this lifetime or this country. You think corporations are going to bend to satisfy the needs of their workers? Their corporations (i.e. blood sucking thieves) You can't possible say that you didn't know that when you were hired the company was going to take advantage of you. Give it a break. They're going to milk you for every penny you've got. This citizen, is our justified, free, and loving country America. Work for it, because without people to feed on, it wouldn't exist as it does. : ) Have a good day though.

I am somewhat shocked that anyone would be so arrogant and ignorant to think that all grocery store workers are high school drop outs and uneducated. I happen to know CEO's, COO's and VPs of large corporations that have no formal education. I also happen to know people in the grocery business who are working to put themselves and/or their children through college. I challenge anyone who sits behind a desk all day to try and keep up with any worker in a grocery store. They work hard for their wages under great amounts of stress. Most companies are operating with huge decreases in labor and the grocery businesss is no exception. Greater demands are asked of these workers everyday and everyday the rise to meet those demands only to have the rug pulled out from under them. I think the uneducated here are the ones who do not know what the real situatuation is. To further educate yourself you may want to visit UFCW.org to gain more information.









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FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE
October 10, 2003
CONTACT:

press [at] ufcw.org



CORPORATE GREED VS. HUMAN NEED

UFCW Statement on Southern California Retail Bargaining



Human Need Vs. Corporate Greed--Facts and Figures (pdf)
UFCW Members Vote to Authorize a Strike
Consumer Handbill
Over the past several days, Southern California supermarket workers have been voting on a contract offer from three of the largest supermarket operators in the country.

They have been confronted with a stark choice: give up health care benefits for not only themselves and their families, but also, for future generations of supermarket workers.

In unprecedented numbers, Southern California supermarket workers turned out to vote and sent a clear message: we will fight for affordable health care.

They delivered a mandate to their union that they will strike, if needed, to save health care for their families and strike to save health care coverage for the next generation of workers.

These workers are heroes. They are willing to make the sacrifice to take up the fight to save health care.

This is a fight for all Southern California workers. It is a fight for all supermarket workers—union and non-union—here and across the country because if these three supersize, super-profitable, supermarket chains can cut benefits here, then every worker is at risk.

The UFCW is announcing that on October 11, workers will strike one of the supermarket chains. We will limit our job action to a single chain, so we will limit the inconvenience to our customers.

We are asking the employers to also respect our customers and not to take retaliatory action against workers through a lock out. There should be no lock out.

After all, the customers are the ones that we depend on for our jobs and the companies for their profits.

Following today’s meeting with the companies and the federal mediator, we will announce the time and the target of the strike.

We will make an effort to avoid a strike but, workers will not give up on health care. We are not asking for more, we are asking to keep the benefits that we have.

There is information on this website about company profits and health care costs.

Employers’ profits have risen 10 times faster than their hourly contribution to worker health care.

Their profits overall have gone up 91% since 1998.

We have contained health cares cost. The increased costs for health care for these employers have been significantly below the national average.

This is a battle between corporate greed and human need and, we are asking our communities to stand with us. We are your friends and your neighbors. We serve you everyday in your local supermarket. We ask for your support.

If the supermarket giants win, Southern California loses. These companies would drain over 328 million dollars a year from Southern California because when they cut health care for workers, they rip off California.

###
The 1.4 million member United Food and Commercial Workers Union (UFCW) is America's neighborhood union representing workers in neighborhood grocery stores across the country. UFCW puts dinner on the table for America's families with members working in meatpacking and food processing. UFCW gives a voice to care with representation for nurses, medical technicians and nursing home workers.

Look guys, I am not unsympathetic to my favorite clerks and cashiers at the Vons I shop at and I feel for them being unable to work. BUT as I am very fond of looking at BOTH sides to every issue so as to keep from being ignorant, you must consider that healthcare is getting out of control and is almost TRIPLE the general consumer price index just in the last 4 years. I am self-employed and don't get free healthcare. For your consideration I submit this...
according to the Bureau of National Affairs . . . 96% of all employers now require some form of cost sharing . . . Of those, 89% require co-payments, 87% require deductibles, and 73% require premium contributions. (para. 4). In casual conversation with my neighbor, a Kaiser Permanente administrator, I learned that even she does not receive free health care coverage

Look guys, I am not unsympathetic to my favorite clerks and cashiers at the Vons I shop at and I feel for them being unable to work. BUT as I am very fond of looking at BOTH sides to every issue so as to keep from being ignorant, you must consider that healthcare is getting out of control and is almost TRIPLE the general consumer price index just in the last 4 years. I am self-employed and don't get free healthcare. For your consideration I submit this...
according to the Bureau of National Affairs . . . 96% of all employers now require some form of cost sharing . . . Of those, 89% require co-payments, 87% require deductibles, and 73% require premium contributions. (para. 4). In casual conversation with my neighbor, a Kaiser Permanente administrator, I learned that even she does not receive free health care coverage

Look guys, I am not unsympathetic to my favorite clerks and cashiers at the Vons I shop at and I feel for them being unable to work. BUT as I am very fond of looking at BOTH sides to every issue so as to keep from being ignorant, you must consider that healthcare is getting out of control and is almost TRIPLE the general consumer price index just in the last 4 years. I am self-employed and don't get free healthcare. For your consideration I submit this...
according to the Bureau of National Affairs . . . 96% of all employers now require some form of cost sharing . . . Of those, 89% require co-payments, 87% require deductibles, and 73% require premium contributions. (para. 4). In casual conversation with my neighbor, a Kaiser Permanente administrator, I learned that even she does not receive free health care coverage

If you don't like your job or are unhappy, then quit. Stop whining. There are plenty of people whom need jobs. I have friends in the military that are on welfare while the husbands are overseas getting shot at and dying. Get real! I don't think this is worth whining about. I have read about both sides. Give me a break. Everyone has to pay for healthcare now, ohh $15.00 every payday. WOW!

I worked at Krogers and didn't like it so I moved on got and education and a better job. Do the same if you are unhappy.

If you don't like your job or are unhappy, then quit. Stop whining. There are plenty of people whom need jobs. I have friends in the military that are on welfare while the husbands are overseas getting shot at and dying. Get real! I don't think this is worth whining about. I have read about both sides. Give me a break. Everyone has to pay for healthcare now, ohh $15.00 every payday. WOW!

I worked at Krogers and didn't like it so I moved on got and education and a better job. Do the same if you are unhappy.

the stores do want then to pay MORE for their benefits. They want to start paying for part of it. Right now the only thing they pay for is their union dues which is there to pay the union workers saleries. the stores are paying the full price of health care.

why pay a checker 19 dollars an hour when a 7-11 clerk gets 8? do the math.

at 7-11 you will have to the clerks can't do math! and most cannot read as well

but at Ralph's we can both read and write that is why we are paid more

I work for one of the grocery stores that are on strike.
I am not affected because I am non-union and on salary. The people on strike or striking for more then the so-called $15 per week insurance co-pay.
The new contract offered would freeze their wages for two years ( they have not had a raise since 2001).
Also, their health insurance would be cut by 50%.
They will also have to pay a $1,500.00 deductible for office visits and then pay a $40.00 co-pay. In other words a family of 4 would pay 100% for every visit if they are healthy because they would not meet the deductable. God forbid they are sick or need surgery because there is an annual cap of 10,000 per family. One emergency or surgery for one member and that's it. Anything else would be the employees responsibility. Then their is the issue of no dental or vision insurance, and a perscription deductible and co-pay that amounts to $25-40. I estimated with one worker who has a medical condition that it will cost her over $600.00 per month more. With no pay raise. She is part-time and I doubt she could find new insurance with her pre-existing condition. These so called no brain workers have dedicated 10-20 years to the companies they work for. They have been working toward their pension which the company also wants to freeze.
They also want to cut the already retired employees pension by $700.00 per month and cut their health care dramatically. These workers are drug tested and they are smart. We are like a family and I can't wait to have them back. Run a search on Steve Burd, Vons-Safeway CEO and see what his plans are for the future of the company. He wants to squeeze out the 15-20 year employees with buy-out packages so that he can replace them with the new two-tiered, lower wage, no benefits employees. The employees who earn the top scale of $17.90 have been with the company for more then 12 years and very few of them are full time. Not every one can get a college education, some have felt that they have missed that boat or simply can not afford it and what they can afford they are using it to send their children to school. If you also take the time and read the whole story it was Albertson's and Ralphs who locked out their employees. Vons was the targeted strike store. That is what the Union offered to lessen the inconvenience of shoppers, but Albertsons and Ralphs said no. So even if the workers wanted to lay down and quit so that they could make YOUR lives easier they can't because they are LOCKED OUT. I admire the strikers for fighting for a just cause. This is a tremendous hard ship on them and their families.
I also noticed posts where people said they should quit and get another job. Who is going to hire a 40+
person at the wage of $17.90 that took them over a decade to reach. They would also loose their pension.
Just so you know there are also many employees who are attending college part time or have graduated, but they cannot find work in their feild of study. These workers are fighting for themselves, their families, retired workers and new employees. If they don't you will see people earning less and less with no health benefits, and no money to go too college. For those of you who think the workers are lazy, I would like to see you marching and holding a heavy sign for 6-9 hours a day. I admire their will and their strength to fight for what they believe they have earned. I miss you guys and can't wait to have you back. As far as temporay workers , they will be let go the minute the strike is over. Also, these strikers cared so much about their stores that they actually trained the replacement workers so that the store would be in the best shape possible. They did not have to do this but they did it because they care. All I ask is before you post negative remarks, do some research see how much profit these stores make, look at the 2 million dollar bonuses the CEO's make. Please excuse the typos and fragments, but I have been working 14 hour days because these temporary workers are not the best of the bunch. Most of them drift from job to job and it is because of their lack of commitment that they are here. Most of them could'nt hold a job for more then 6 months. Be strong on the picket line, the local managers are behind you 100% and if it was up to us you would be back.

To: Strike

You claim to be a Christian. I doubt it.
Have you heard about compassion, or As I have Loved you Love One Another. Your the one that needs to soul search and pray. It is really easy to say you are a Christian but you sure don't sound like one. I also think not passing judgement on others is one of your Lords teachings. Unless you think you are God, because he is the one that is suppose to judge. Why don't you show a little charity and get your milk elsewhere. These people on the line are fighting for health care if they don't they will loose 50% of what they have and pay $250-1,000's of dollars a month.
Go to the Union web sites and get all the facts.
Be a good Samaritin and help instead of hurt.

To: Strike

You claim to be a Christian. I doubt it.
Have you heard about compassion, or As I have Loved you Love One Another. Your the one that needs to soul search and pray. It is really easy to say you are a Christian but you sure don't sound like one. I also think not passing judgement on others is one of your Lords teachings. Unless you think you are God, because he is the one that is suppose to judge. Why don't you show a little charity and get your milk elsewhere. These people on the line are fighting for health care if they don't they will loose 50% of what they have and pay $250-1,000's of dollars a month.
Go to the Union web sites and get all the facts.
Be a good Samaritin and help instead of hurt.

To: Strike

You claim to be a Christian. I doubt it.
Have you heard about compassion, or As I have Loved you Love One Another. Your the one that needs to soul search and pray. It is really easy to say you are a Christian but you sure don't sound like one. I also think not passing judgement on others is one of your Lords teachings. Unless you think you are God, because he is the one that is suppose to judge. Why don't you show a little charity and get your milk elsewhere. These people on the line are fighting for health care if they don't they will loose 50% of what they have and pay $250-1,000's of dollars a month.
Go to the Union web sites and get all the facts.
Be a good Samaritin and help instead of hurt.

To: Strike

You claim to be a Christian. I doubt it.
Have you heard about compassion, or As I have Loved you Love One Another. Your the one that needs to soul search and pray. It is really easy to say you are a Christian but you sure don't sound like one. I also think not passing judgement on others is one of your Lords teachings. Unless you think you are God, because he is the one that is suppose to judge. Why don't you show a little charity and get your milk elsewhere. These people on the line are fighting for health care if they don't they will loose 50% of what they have and pay $250-1,000's of dollars a month.
Go to the Union web sites and get all the facts.
Be a good Samaritin and help instead of hurt.

To: Strike

You claim to be a Christian. I doubt it.
Have you heard about compassion, or As I have Loved you Love One Another. Your the one that needs to soul search and pray. It is really easy to say you are a Christian but you sure don't sound like one. I also think not passing judgement on others is one of your Lords teachings. Unless you think you are God, because he is the one that is suppose to judge. Why don't you show a little charity and get your milk elsewhere. These people on the line are fighting for health care if they don't they will loose 50% of what they have and pay $250-1,000's of dollars a month.
Go to the Union web sites and get all the facts.
Be a good Samaritin and help instead of hurt.

To: Strike

You claim to be a Christian. I doubt it.
Have you heard about compassion, or As I have Loved you Love One Another. Your the one that needs to soul search and pray. It is really easy to say you are a Christian but you sure don't sound like one. I also think not passing judgement on others is one of your Lords teachings. Unless you think you are God, because he is the one that is suppose to judge. Why don't you show a little charity and get your milk elsewhere. These people on the line are fighting for health care if they don't they will loose 50% of what they have and pay $250-1,000's of dollars a month.
Go to the Union web sites and get all the facts.
Be a good Samaritin and help instead of hurt.

To: Strike

You claim to be a Christian. I doubt it.
Have you heard about compassion, or As I have Loved you Love One Another. Your the one that needs to soul search and pray. It is really easy to say you are a Christian but you sure don't sound like one. I also think not passing judgement on others is one of your Lords teachings. Unless you think you are God, because he is the one that is suppose to judge. Why don't you show a little charity and get your milk elsewhere. These people on the line are fighting for health care if they don't they will loose 50% of what they have and pay $250-1,000's of dollars a month.
Go to the Union web sites and get all the facts.
Be a good Samaritin and help instead of hurt.

To: Strike

You claim to be a Christian. I doubt it.
Have you heard about compassion, or As I have Loved you Love One Another. Your the one that needs to soul search and pray. It is really easy to say you are a Christian but you sure don't sound like one. I also think not passing judgement on others is one of your Lords teachings. Unless you think you are God, because he is the one that is suppose to judge. Why don't you show a little charity and get your milk elsewhere. These people on the line are fighting for health care if they don't they will loose 50% of what they have and pay $250-1,000's of dollars a month.
Go to the Union web sites and get all the facts.
Be a good Samaritin and help instead of hurt.

Istead of relying solely on the media's coverage, please do what we did, and go to the store you normally shop at, and TALK to the strikers. You'll be shocked to hear the REAL story of what they face losing. These good people, whom we see once a week, sometimes more, and know by name, stand losing a lot more than a 50 c a paycheck raise and higher copays for insurance- THEY ARE LOSING THE PENSIONS THEY'VE HAD FOR 30 YEARS, mgmt. won't agree to converting them to 401k's, instead of a pension, and they'll have to pay 50% of the cost of any operation they might need (God forbid they'd need a heart operation- do you think they can afford to fork over $30k?). That's no way to treat people who have worked for you for years, some as many as 30 years. So, we urge everyone to talk to these people (they are very nice folks- don't be scared!), and see what else you can do. In the meantime, don't shop at ANY of the stores owned by Safeway Corp- let's teach this greedy owner a lesson he needs to learn. After all, in the case of Vons, its unparalleled customer service is what keeps its customers coming back! If those people are replaced by scabs coming from outside that tradition, then the owners are shooting themselves in the proverbial feet, because they'll lose all their real customer base!

I disagree with this strike. The union is not giving you health care, The Supermarket is. I feel you guys are being ungreatful and should thank GOD and the Super Market for what you have, If I have a problem at my job and an sure no one in this picket line will support me.
You are all a bunch of selfish people who should go back to work and say I am sorry to everyone, Becouse you are hurting everyone.

I shopped in Vons tonight and was pleased to see so many new faces ... people grateful to be working. No entitlement issues, just gratitude. Too bad the greedy union members cannot share that same gratitude. The store was well stocked, lots of customers and I think they will do just fine for as long as it takes. And on the first day after 6 months have passed, BAM! All those striking union workers will get their pink slips. Can't happen soon enough to suit me.

this person needs a better education

Hey every one I work at Albertsons as a service deli clerk. I go to college and pay for food, clothes,car insurance, and any other expeses that might occur.my mother can't afford my health coverage so I chose to work at Albertsons to get those benifts they offer. I am a business major and I was offered a chance to work for Mryl Lynch as internship, but I had to turn it down, why you may ask. It is because I need my Health Care I have at albertsons. So Why is it right for a multi billion dollar company to cut benifits for new hires just becuase the economy and competition is rising. Some people have their needs but corporations need to stop directing their business plans based on their greed. Their profits have increased 91 ercent in the last 5 years. The CEO makes millions of dollars a year.You all know the people at the top those at the headquarters don't know anything about what goes down at our locaL STORES. Everyone don't listen to all the misleading information Albertsns is going to give, becasue are they the ones that lockout 24,000 of their employees wow do they care. Oh and another thing arent they the ones that told us we will not be getting unemployment, well there is another lie because my check is coming in the mail. It all about their GREED so someone has to fight for the ones that are after us and thats what we are going to do.

If you asked all union workers whether they would be willing to pay $5 a week for full health benefits, I'd be willing to bet that most, if not all, would agree that that's a great deal. The truth is that it's not that simple. While our employers are in fact offering health benefits for $5 dollars a week for a single person (and $10 for a family), they are also putting caps on certain things pertaining to health benefits. If they could have their way, there would be a limit to how many doctors visits per year they would pay for. For a family with children, putting a limit on doctors visits could end up costing much more than $10 a week. The most recent offer includes a cap on chemotherapy. The number of people being diagnosed with cancer each year is on the rise. The costs of paying for treatment are enormous and most people would not be able to pay for the treatments on their own. If a worker should get cancer, they do not need the added worry of whether they are over thier limit of chemotherapy treatments. In addition to limits on health care benefits, the emloyers want to expand the job duties of some workers so that they may do the work of more senior workers. This enables the employers to get the same work done but at a fraction of the cost. We have worked hard for years and have earned our wage increases. To have our jobs taken away simply because these company's realize that they aren't in any way able to compete with the likes of WalMart, is insane. I only wish the employees were consulted when the company's were making the financial blunders that have caused them to become so cheap. We have no say in what they do with their money, but we can and will fight them as they attempt to make up their financial shortfalls by shortchanging their employees.

I don't know why it is so hard for these company's to understand that if they expect their employees to treat their customers with the utmost respect and do whatever it takes to make them happy, they should set a proper example and treat their employees with the utmost respect and do whatever it takes, within reason, to make their employees happy. As I see it, these companies have done nothing to foster a relationship of respect with their employees. Why should we just except that we must take these pay cuts and benefit restrictions???? We shouldn't!!!! They owe us the respect we have earned for our years of hard work. Until they realize that they must give respect to get respect, I will fight them in their attempts to make us bow down to them. They simply aren't worthy of respect from the wonderful people that work for them.

There are plently of people who work for a grocery chain that have college educations. Just because it's a physically demanding job doesn't mean that educated people don't do it. I would love to work elsewhere, but right now, this is all that's available. So until you've worked in a grocery store, don't make snide comments about it.

I couldn't be more angry with Rocio, you have no idea! What is this about high school dropouts working at Ralphs. My dad has worked in the union since he was sixteen years old. My dad also graduated high school with a high grade point average. My dad ALSO graduated from a computer engineering college and can work in other fields. BUT, he choose to stay in the union BECAUSE of the benefits which are now being taken away from him. How is that fair??

Everyday I drive by the picket lines on my way to work. My wife and I both work and pay for health care. I have been in my job (which is union) for more then 15 years. may wife has been in her job fore more then 10. So when I go the store to buy whay my wife , son and/or daughter may need in out house I go to the nearest stor that has the best prices and best quality of food and such. I f a striker makes to block my or my wifes way or makes one threating action or work that person will go to jail. I will call the police and I will press charges. I will then press charges on the union leads for that store and civil suits on the persons and union personel thats part of that store. Before you say O ya , just call the ploice they take forever to get there . I am 6'2" 265. Makeing threats will get you in jail , trying to carry them out will get you hurt. If you push people , some will push back .

I busted my rear to get an engineering degree and I have to pay about half of my health care insurance. Why should grocery clerks have it any different?

I busted my rear to get an engineering degree and I have to pay about half of my health care insurance. Why should grocery clerks have it any different?

If you were smart enough to unionize, you'd get a better deal, too.

the majority of the educated Anarchist movement
have stood against unuinization becouse of the corruption and organized crime associated with them.
unions also stand for exploitation of poor laborers in support positions for union jobs (poor doing the real work - union workers making the money) this has been the history of the union experience in this country for over a century!

a true Anarchist would not consider supporting a union for any reason.

"the majority of the educated Anarchist movement "

Just because people dont trust large labor unions doesnt mean we cross picket lines. if an anarchist crosses a picket line or acts as a scab they are not an anarchist.

whether you want to face it or not the majority of you shmucks that are bad mouthing the strike are working class, in the long run if you support them it will most likely benefit you some day at your job, take it from an airline employee that has been hosed and abandoned by lack off support from society. don't forget what side your really on.

hey wolfmanwuss, there are plenty of other stores out there most of them have lower prices, why don't you try them and see, try using your mellon instead of that big tough guy (6'3" 265) body of yours, I'll bet that of that 265 not one ounce is brain.

No the union WON'T help regular workers in the long run and they never have. When a company goes out of business and lays off workers or lowers the pay scale for salary workers it doesn't help me. Go to college and get a real job, Stop your bitching. My brother is the manager of Vons and he doesn't get free benifits, he doesn't get overtime and he doesn't get triple or double time for holidays and sundays. His workers end up making better pay and benefits because they can unionize. Why should anyone help you strikers when we all pay for our benefits, Why should you get them free. Who made you so special that you should make free benefits. WORKING IS A PRIVELIDGE NOT A RIGHT. This is what we americans are forgetting. You have the right to say you don't accept that and you have the right to live in a cardboard box. I refuse to pay more for groceries so that someone can get free benefits while 90% of us pay. You people need to read the contracts before you back these strikers, when you do you'll be surprised. The strikers I know were and now they're paying for it because the union lied to them. Remember the unions began with the mafia.

I have been shopping at Stater Brothers during the strike so far. I do believe in the right to strike for better conditions or against unfair treatment. However, now that I see what the union workers are protesting, I disagree with this strike. The Supermarkets are not being unreasonable. Grocery store workers work as unskilled labor and are compensated far more than they deserve. Medical insurance is expensive, and the supermarkets are asking for them to aide in a fraction of the expense. Personal insurance would cost them, individually, hundreds of dollars. Five dollars per week seems fair. The union workers are acting like children, throwing a temper tantrum because they want it all. A strike is meant as a means of protesting an injustice, but if this institution is abused, it is more likely to inspire disgust than sympathy. This is like the baseball strike all over again. Who wants to be inconvenienced by some whinny overpaid cry babies?

"Medical insurance is expensive"

You bet it is. So if employers wont pay for insurance, how do people pay for healthcare?
Right now many people who cant afford health insurance rely on emergency rooms and the end cost is much higher than if either the state paid for universal healthcare or if it were paid for by employers.
Its a loss for everyone. If you look at the actual costs, the amount in taxes supermarkets have to pay that ends up going for the current healthcare mess is probably more than if they just gave their workers real health coverage.

As for people claiming they supported the strike until they found it was over healthcare, I cant quite buy that. Are you saying that unskilled workers somehow dont deserve to be able to take care of the medical needs of their children. You would have supported the strike if it was over pay but now that you have found out that people might waste the money on healthcare you oppose the strike?

Everyone deserves to be able to work at a job where they can support their basic needs. In most countries (even poorer countries) there are public health systems that takes care of many of the publics needs. Public health is a common good. New strains of TB that resist drugs emerged from people who did not continue taking their antibiotics (probably for monetary reasons). Diseases by their very nature spread and to not treat the poor seems more stupid than even greedy.

Ultimately healthcare should be paid for by the state. But until it is employers need to provide some level of basic coverage. With new strains of diseases emerging and the risks of bioterrorism becoming more well recognized, real healthcare for the entire population will be needed one way or another (if someone who didnt have healthcare was one fo the first people infected with smallpox the initial spread of the disease before detection at an emergency room would be a lot higher than if they were able to go in to a doctor earler on). If employers cant cover employee healthcare costs, thats the clearest proof I can see that a pure free market system doesnt work (countries with 1/5 the average income as the US manage to provide basic coverage to the entire population...).

Perhaps you should read my response rather than skimming it before you reply. I do not oppose the strike because it's over health care. I oppose the strike because the corporations are asking for them to make a small co-payment of 5 dollars per week. When my company started charging us approximately the same figure it didn't bother me in the slightest. Most companies pay the majority of an employees health care, they don't generally pay the whole amount. 5 dollars per week is a miniscule amount and not somehting that an unskilled overpayed person should complain about. They should be thankeful that they have it so good. I am all for unions, if they do not abuse the adversarial system, but compromise is not a sign of weakness. This is not a fight worth fighting.

I think the strikers are a bunch of crybabies. I have always contributed to the cost of my medical insurance and see no reason why they shouldn't.

I am currently retired and my co-insurance costs me much more than they are being asked to pay.

Their mentality may well be revealed in the many posts that I read her. I see numerous misspellings, wrong word usage, and grammatical errors.

If you think you have a reasonable cause to espouse, at least learn the proper spelling and grammar of the language you are using.

"5 dollars per week is a miniscule amount "

Ok so why shouldnt the employers pay if its such a small amount?

You diagree with a strike because the employees are demanding something too small and then somehow say that their demands will hurt employers? Thats contradictory.

"I have always contributed to the cost of my medical insurance "

So how much do you make and how much do many of those on strike make? Most people I know who work low paying jobs without health insurance end up having no health insurance. People could pay $100+ a month for individual health insurance but when you are struggling for rent... As employers move away from providing health insurance the main effect has been that the number of people nationwide with no health insurance has skyrocketed. You can blame poor people for not paying for insurance but you wont be laughing when you start getting sick more from the growing portion of the population that now prefers to try to wait out most illnesses since they cant afford treatment.

Let me explain. Five dollars a week is a minescule amount for one person but when you consider that you want someone to pay it for thousands of people, it amount to something. Like Barry said, a million here and a million there, finally we're talking about real money.
You must not ignore the multiples when you argue a point. Consider this. You could likely afford to pay the $5 per week but i doubt you would be able to do it for all your union brothers. When you add it all up, it's big bucks.

Sure it adds up for both the workers and the employers. $5 a week is a good amount a year, probably not enough to strike over but if the principle of the strike is to keep a hard line against future healthcare cuts, every dollar counts. The number of employers covering employee healthcare has been going down for awhile (even when the economy was doing well), while $5 a week may not seem like a lot its good to know someone is starting to fight back.

Smart unions know the employers costs since businesses going under put unions out of business too. I trust the unions know what they are doing and the employers attempts to badmouth the unions are also out of principle (rather than over an amount that could actually hurt the ability of the grocery stores to run). I saw a study a few years ago in Scientific American over business profits when businesses unionized (I'll try to find a link if its online). Interestingly they went up. Empowering workers and having formal rules for pay scales and promotions prevents favoritism that often impacts the bottom line as well as employee morale.

Yes, but they're fighting the wrong dragon. The real enemy may well be the malpractice lawyer or the insurance company that pays off to avoid a fight. The result is skyrocketing medical costs. The doctors are caught in the middle and nobody represents the real important person in the issue, the working man that has the responsibility of providing health care for his family.

It may well all be the fault of the legal system. That rests with the judicial appointments made by the residing President of our country.

So, let's not blame management nor try to make them liable for what the politicians have created. Let's rally behind reform and push for some reasonable caps on punitive damages and a new assement of personal responsibility.
It may be amusing to read about how someone has received a millon dollars for dumping a hot cup of coffee in their lap but remember, that cost will be reflected in the Big Mac we buy so we'll all hurt in the end. (No pun intended)
Anyway, let's encourage the grocery workers to get back to work and quit crying about paying what the rest of us have been paying for years.

Quote:

You can blame poor people for not paying for insurance but you wont be laughing when you start getting sick more from the growing portion of the population that now prefers to try to wait out most illnesses since they cant afford treatment.

end quote.

This is a separate problem and not related to the grocery strike. The problem you portray is caused by the influx of illegal aliens who bring the diseases with them and expect to get free treatment in the good old U.S.A.
We can't even afford to provide treatment to our legal citizens so why would they think we should bend over and ...well, you know.
Bottom line..keep them out of here and let them petition their native government for relief.

Rose, what do you do for a living? Why do you assume that working in a grocery store (or one assumes in retail in general) means that you have little education, and no "real" job skills.

Can you offload a truck, Rose? Can you operate a forklift, or scan in merchandise? Do you know how to stock groceries or build displays and fixtures? Can you cut meat, bake, cook, operate a computer or a cash register? Are these not real job skills to you Rose? What do you consider to be "real" job skills, Rose?

Why do you, and so many others seem to believe that retail/grocery store workers aren't "worthy" of making a living wage, because they aren't as educated? Why are you so hostile to the concept of unions, something that's as much a part of (US) history as the Civil War, or the Revolutionary War for that matter?

Unions are necessary.

Unions are part of the reason why there are health codes and safety regulations. People fought for better healthcare, fought for fair wages, pay, and hours. Fought for safety in the workplace, fought for all of these things, so others could benefit from them, even you. Yes even you, Rose, even though you spit at their efforts, even though you have no thought or caring for their struggles, or even the slightest clue of why those battles were and are necessary.

Rena-
The reason I assume, as you say so many do, that grocery store work is not highly skilled labor is for several reasons. First of all, no higher education is required for this type of work. Second af all, I have a friend who took advantage of the opportunity to get herself a job while all of you others are on strike. The whole entire training process encompassed a total of four hours,and,truth be known, she checks me out just as quickly and efficiently as the girls that have been doing it for years.
As far as your question regarding what I am capable of, I can scan merchandise. I can bake. And cook, too. I do know how to stock shelves, inventory merchandise, even drive a truck. I can cut meat, I use a computer daily- and I can operate a cash register and balance to the penny. I have years of experience in management. As far as off-loading a truck or driving a forklift, these are jobs that require strength, however, no formal education or training whatsoever. How do I know this? My husband can do both, and he never went to school to learn how! Amazing,isn't it!
I think you misunderstand me. I think you are worth whatever the market will pay you. If that is $8.00 an hour or if that is $80.00 an hour. That is not the issue. The issue is the fact that you are trying to get your way by strong-arming your employer and threatening instead of marketing your skills. You are banding together like the mob, or like street thugs, to intimidate the company that was kind enough to give you a job into bending over for your demands. I don't disagree that on an individual basis some MIGHT deserve what you are asking. But I don't think there is anything about what you do that makes you irreplaceable,gives you the right to threaten your employer,gives you the right to stand outside and intimidate customers, or how about this! I will even go one step further. I think that you hide behind the union and do a half-assed job, thinking the union will make sure you don't get fired!!! Is that the kind of employee that deserves rewards for accomplishments and company loyalty? I don't think so!!! As far as retaining the benefits you already have, as far as I am concerned, you have so much more than most you should sit back and count your blessings. When you were given those health benefits, the cost to your employer was about one-third of what it is now. It is fair for them to ask you to absorb some of the increase.....
As far as your comment on why I hate unions when they are a part of U.S. history- I think that was a ridiculous comment. Other things that are a part of U.S. history
Vietnam War
Charles Manson
Ted Bundy
Slavery
etc.........

I could go on and on, but I think I made my point. California is an "AT Will" employment state. That means that your employer can fire you or change the terms of your employment for any reason other than prejudice or discrimination AT ANY TIME. I think that if you didn't have a union you would all be working harder to prove your worth instead of the half-assed job because you think you can't get fired. Then maybe the good ones would get paid even more than they're asking- but because they're WORTH it, not because they threaten their bosses. And, by the way, the legal system is also a part of our history. Of course, you can't win this one in court, because you are asking for something that most of you don't deserve and you don't have a legal leg to stand on. When you can explain to me what the difference is between you and organized crime................

Rena-
The reason I assume, as you say so many do, that grocery store work is not highly skilled labor is for several reasons. First of all, no higher education is required for this type of work. Second af all, I have a friend who took advantage of the opportunity to get herself a job while all of you others are on strike. The whole entire training process encompassed a total of four hours,and,truth be known, she checks me out just as quickly and efficiently as the girls that have been doing it for years.
As far as your question regarding what I am capable of, I can scan merchandise. I can bake. And cook, too. I do know how to stock shelves, inventory merchandise, even drive a truck. I can cut meat, I use a computer daily- and I can operate a cash register and balance to the penny. I have years of experience in management. As far as off-loading a truck or driving a forklift, these are jobs that require strength, however, no formal education or training whatsoever. How do I know this? My husband can do both, and he never went to school to learn how! Amazing,isn't it!
I think you misunderstand me. I think you are worth whatever the market will pay you. If that is $8.00 an hour or if that is $80.00 an hour. That is not the issue. The issue is the fact that you are trying to get your way by strong-arming your employer and threatening instead of marketing your skills. You are banding together like the mob, or like street thugs, to intimidate the company that was kind enough to give you a job into bending over for your demands. I don't disagree that on an individual basis some MIGHT deserve what you are asking. But I don't think there is anything about what you do that makes you irreplaceable,gives you the right to threaten your employer,gives you the right to stand outside and intimidate customers, or how about this! I will even go one step further. I think that you hide behind the union and do a half-assed job, thinking the union will make sure you don't get fired!!! Is that the kind of employee that deserves rewards for accomplishments and company loyalty? I don't think so!!! As far as retaining the benefits you already have, as far as I am concerned, you have so much more than most you should sit back and count your blessings. When you were given those health benefits, the cost to your employer was about one-third of what it is now. It is fair for them to ask you to absorb some of the increase.....
As far as your comment on why I hate unions when they are a part of U.S. history- I think that was a ridiculous comment. Other things that are a part of U.S. history
Vietnam War
Charles Manson
Ted Bundy
Slavery
etc.........

I could go on and on, but I think I made my point. California is an "AT Will" employment state. That means that your employer can fire you or change the terms of your employment for any reason other than prejudice or discrimination AT ANY TIME. I think that if you didn't have a union you would all be working harder to prove your worth instead of the half-assed job because you think you can't get fired. Then maybe the good ones would get paid even more than they're asking- but because they're WORTH it, not because they threaten their bosses. And, by the way, the legal system is also a part of our history. Of course, you can't win this one in court, because you are asking for something that most of you don't deserve and you don't have a legal leg to stand on. When you can explain to me what the difference is between you and organized crime................

Rose,

you're saying that the strikers are being like a mob, to unjustly try to get the owners to pay them more?

It's a fact, and not mere speculation that our economy is centrally controlled by the U.S. government and the associated Federal Reserve Bank in a way which benefits owners and investors, and works against low level employees.
If unemployment goes below 5%, Alan Greenspan of the Fed. will raise interest rates to drive unemployment back up again. He does this to keep wages down or "keep the economy from overheating" in his words. So there will always be this group of unemployed people fighting against the currently low-paid grocery store baggers, so they can never bargain up. The government also signs trade deals so that jobs are exported overseas, so workers have to compete with people being paid $5/day.
This is mob behavior.

A KucinichWatch Original UFCW Grocery Strike Rally Video 10-18-03 29 minutes RealDownload - QuickTime Virtual Attendance Video of a UFCW Grocery Strike Rally < Speech Only  12 min. > The Speech and an Endorsement
KucinichWatch.com

This strike is not about paying $15/week towards healthcare. That would be so easy and not an issue. It is about much more if you would only care to inform yourself. Healthcare will be cut overall 50% - that means if you have surgery you will pay 50% of the bill eventhough you are paying $15/week toward your benefits. Everyone's pension will be cut as well and will be a fraction of what it used to be. If this sounds so fair, please call your employer and tell him you would like a salary decrease effective immediately because you feel that getting paid less (since making more money pays for your benefits) is more American - like the great Walmart philosophy. Well, I disagree! And please inform yourself before voting. The likes of you have put George W. in office and you are destroying the world. Please move to another country - I don't want to share this one with you. If I ever see you I will spit on you - you stupid, ignorant bitch!

So CP you oppose trade with foreign countries because they might produce stuff cheeper and you would run a boom/bust economy.
OK you could do that but keep in mind the effects on your country and other countries.
Hmm strikes dont seem to help either of these problems anyway.

What is wrong with you people? What happened to compassion and willing to fight for the underdog?

There is an even bigger problem if this union is broken. All those other unions out there better watch it if this one is broken. The unions for other laborers will get broken next. For example, ILWU for starters.

The other problem is would all of you "college" grads do these types of jobs for $8 an hour. I don't think so, because I bet you think it would be beneath you.

These individuals are just trying to get by. Which most Americans are doing now a days. All they are asking for are things to stay the same. Nothing more, nothing less. They are not lazy, they are not stupid, and they are definitely not deaf.

If any of you decided to fight for your rights as an employee, I'm pretty sure you would want support.

Like I said before, what ever happened to having a heart? Show these people that you care for them. Would it hurt you that much? Even if you don't agree, then keep you snide remarks to yourselves.

By NOT having you pay a more fair share of your OWN health insurance, you WILL lose jobs. DUH. Your employer does not OWE you health insurance for free, certainly not at a low payrate, high census operation like a grocery store.

If you do not like what your employer offers you, then get better educated and start higher up the ladder or switch to a company that has benefits that are more tailored to your needs/wants.

And if the area that you live in is too expensive for your pay rate, then it is up to YOU to fix that, not your employer.

These are not "snide" remarks. These are called "facts" and "personal responsibility". If you don't haev both those, then YOU LOSE!

So you say have a heart. I am all fine with having a heart. But if I may speak freely... These folks are reaching for something that will not happen. Times change. Jobs are hard to come by. 401k and Pension plans have lost money ... mine has lost $1000 just in this year. We all have to suck it up... It's called life.

I have served my county for 10 years for your FREEDOM... the Freedom of Choices .. I choose to shop anywhere I want to. As I walk in the store to get my food from WIC... I am called "Bitch, Respect the picket line..." That is all uncalled for and I hope that KARMA comes back to all of you that choose to say those kinds of things to the customers. In the End all of you will loose this battle... Good luck with your future endveours. Sorry ... thats life.

They spoke too kindly. Unly scum cross picket lines. Shame on you. Go hang your head.

Such anger , but you dont realize these people are willing to work they have fought and paid for theire health care . with blood of there predocessors . It says no where in the constitution of the united states A person must be educated to have health care , you pay for your insurance that is nice but that is also your choice as an individual .you should ask yourself if its healthy to be worried over other people who made a choice to join a field which they have something you dont .

For the same reason that if they went to your place of buisiness normally for reasons other then you , if you were on strike they would not go there because of you .

YOUR EDUCATION IS HIGHLY OVERRATED . Thank god the foundin fathers of this country understood that it says no where in the constitution that a person need an education to have a good job and MR. bc let me tell you I have a better job then you by far so quite your crying . as I leave for a 3 week vacation in europe my substantial southern california property porfolio will be in the good care of my high school educated gardener whom is payed better wages then your anti labor educated butt .
but im sure you will say oh blah blah blah but who cares go back to you cubicle or meeting kissing your bosses ass and maybe you'll be invited to the company x-mas party , go on then go on boy get out of here you self inflated ZERO .

its a sad day in this country when people are satisfied with no care of the status of their future but its all about well i dont have motivation to get a better job so screw some one else willing to acheive a goal . Poor attitude dude your bosses have you under there spell wake up befor your 65 with cat food for dinner .

why dont you stop scanning labels and start scanning the books college calls you my father has to pay half of his medical insurance and he dosent have a union for his company he works for and hes been working for a long time with out this benifit you always had for these many years and when i ask him if he is angry about his health deal he just tells me i got to deal with it. My family has to suffer because of his health cuts but what ever we go to do we got to do. My dad is a hardworking man and an oppertunity you guys had for a long time he never got it! he had to deal with it. i appreciate your wonderful services at local grocery stores but people if you are in a no win situation siting long hours doing nothing but stopping cars to make your self look powerful and strong willed makes you look ridiculous and imature. Some picketers have no choice and i appoligize to those who dont have a choice but to those who consistintaly harass consumers from entering their "comfort zone shoping places" is making them want to never go back. You are just making them go back because they are tired of your sober. Find a better job or do something that can benifit your self.
also when this strike somehow ends do you see yourself 20 years from now working there having the best benifits? The future holds many advances and some of those are already in procession take for example have you ever gone to KMART? have you seen those self checkout lines? sooner or later that will be in every grocery store so it reduces the time and many cashier jobs will be dropped. What will you do then. Many technology advances will take the job of simple tasks and jobs will be lost so if your thinking of staying where you are you might as well keep up with the times because they can be the next thing that will make life more easier. Stick to a job where you arnt rallying about your upsets and move on in life.

why don’t you stop scanning labels and start scanning the books college calls you my father has to pay half of his medical insurance and he doesn’t have a union for his company he works for and he’s been working for a long time with out this benefit you always had for these many years and when I ask him if he is angry about his health deal he just tells me I got to deal with it. My family has to suffer because of his health cuts but what ever we go to do we got to do. My dad is a hardworking man and an opportunity you guys had for a long time he never got it! he had to deal with it. I appreciate your wonderful services at local grocery stores but people if you are in a no win situation siting long hours doing nothing but stopping cars to make your self look powerful and strong willed makes you look ridiculous and immature. Some picketers have no choice and I apologize to those who don’t have a choice but to those who consistently harass consumers from entering their "comfort zone shopping places" is making them want to never go back. You are just making them go back because they are tired of your sober. Find a better job or do something that can benefit your self. also when this strike somehow ends do you see yourself 20 years from now working there having the best benefits? The future holds many advances and some of those are already in procession take for example have you ever gone to KMART? Have you seen those self checkout lines? sooner or later that will be in every grocery store so it reduces the time and many cashier jobs will be dropped. What will you do then. Many technology advances will take the job of simple tasks and jobs will be lost so if your thinking of staying where you are you might as well keep up with the times because they can be the next thing that will make life more easier. Stick to a job where you aren’t rallying about your upsets and move on in life.

Maybe no one has told you, but you have only learned a small portion of a union grocery clerk's job description. Not only do you only have to perform a fraction of the job duties, you are performing these duties for a small fraction of the customers and business these stores were doing before the strike. You have only been trained to do enough to keep the store afloat during the strike. I know the responsibilites of my husband's job and I have gone into the grocery stores and have witnessed what little the temporary workers know how to do and for how few customers they have to do it for, so I hope you don't really think you are doing the same job as the person you are temporarily replacing.

For those of you who think this is all about just $5 a week, maybe you should try talking to someone who's actually affected by this. Not only is Albertson's forcing they employees to pay for insurance now, they have also cut lower-management pay by over $150 a week. They've cut hours and refuse to allow higher-pay empoloyees to work more than 20-25 hours a week; instead they use minimum-wage employees. They are also in the process of doing away with many management positions. They are GREEDY and don't care at all who they have to walk over to make an extra buck for themselves. (and for the record, my husband is management and I am a former cashier and current grad student, so don't bother with the "uneducated" crap.)

We all need good health care - this is a basic human right.

It's Thanksgiving - the season to help your fellow human...

I suggest we ALL show solidarity with the Von's workers (and broaden the dialog) by making our own, general pro-health care signs, and show up at every local Von's, anytime on Weds., Nov 26th, the day before Thanksgiving. Go before work, after work, during a break, whatever.

We only have a couple of days, so if any activists out there see this, please post it everywhere. Let's get it going !

I think you should educate yourself about this unfairness. Abertsons and Ralphs workers were locked out. This means that we cant go back to work, because we were kicked out! Because of ignorant people like you, these companies are getting away with it. I love my job, but this is an issue that is really unfair. We all have to stick together. For the people who dont care...its okay. We dont need more ignorance in this world. and what goes around comes around, one day you will need the support of someone.

For the people that don't know what they are talking about....PLEASE SHUT UP!!

Right-winged republicans need to just fall off the face of the earth. It's really sad and embarrassing that we have people like you living in America. Your anger doesn't discourage me from what I believe in. I hope that when you need something one day, I will be the one to say "well, how does this affect me?" and kick you in the stomach while i'm at it.

Carol
for god's sake grow up, if you can't follow the issues then ask one of the more educated posters to explain the topic to you (off -list) so it doesnot interupt the flow of information

This is kind of off topic but I'm wondering how much money all three stores are losing, especially during the Holidays. The albertson's I usually go to and have gone to for around 8 years seems to be only about 1/4 to 1/3 full of their usual shoppers. I know these stores have deep pockets but they must be losing an awful lot of money right now. I'm wondering how long they can keep the workers locked out before it is not going to be worth it to them anymore. I respect the workers that are on strike and don't shop at these stores anymore, as for the workers high pay I don't see them able to make much headway in this high cost housing market.

Please find out the facts before commenting that they are only striking because they have to pay $5 extra a week. As stated before within a year they will probably be paying 50% of their health care. I don't know about any of you but that is something I can't afford either. But here are a couple of other issues that no one seems to know about. 1) Anyone hired in the grocery stores from now on would make $3 appox. less than the workers that are there now. Now guess who corporate will try their best to get rid of. Corporate will also pay less towards these new workers health care which means that the plan that is supporting the health care will have less money making all the employees pay more for their healthcare.. up to 50% of it. 2) The employer wants to allow the vendors to come into the stores and stock the shelves. Which means that the people who stock the shelves will no longer have that work, which means more people out of work and the company will benefit off of the vendors coming in and doing the work for free. These 3 Grocery companies make more money here in Southern California than any other area where they service. If the Companies would come to the talks with the attitude that we don't want to take away but we can't give any more believe me the strike would not be as it is now. Everyone knows the price of health care is rising and that we will have to pay bigger copayments etc. Why don't these companies go after the insurance companies with as much power as they have gone after the employees??? One answer is probably because a lot of them are on the boards for these insurance companies and if they went after them they themselves would lose money, oh God forbid if they made less than a million a year when MOST of the employees that are on that picket line make less than $20,000 a year. If the employees lose this fight everyone will be affected, not just union employees. Ask any management person that works for the grocery companies they know but are not allowed to say how they feel for fear of losing their jobs. I am a Teamster and I am now out on a Sympathy strike for the retail clerks. Our contract comes up in two years and if the clerks lose this fight we know that they will come after us too. In the words of a song my last comment is....."You got to stand for something, or YOU WILL FALL FOR ANYTHING"!!!

Hello Wake Up,
I work for Safeway Stores, Inc, proudly too, but when you say you gladly pay $500 per month for your health benefits, I wonder what is your monthly salary to afford this contribution to your benefits? You must make a considerable wage, or you're lying. I would have no problem contributing to my heatlh benefits as Safeway has proposed, but there is a discrepency in this offer, otherwise So. California would not be on strike. I am sure that my union brothers and sisters would have no problem with the $5-$15 a week contribution to health care to offset the company health care costs.

Hello Wake Up,
I work for Safeway Stores, Inc, proudly too, but when you say you gladly pay $500 per month for your health benefits, I wonder what is your monthly salary to afford this contribution to your benefits? You must make a considerable wage, or you're lying. I would have no problem contributing to my heatlh benefits as Safeway has proposed, but there is a discrepency in this offer, otherwise So. California would not be on strike. I am sure that my union brothers and sisters would have no problem with the $5-$15 a week contribution to health care to offset the company health care costs.

Hello Wake Up,
I work for Safeway Stores, Inc, proudly too, but when you say you gladly pay $500 per month for your health benefits, I wonder what is your monthly salary to afford this contribution to your benefits? You must make a considerable wage, or you're lying. I would have no problem contributing to my heatlh benefits as Safeway has proposed, but there is a discrepency in this offer, otherwise So. California would not be on strike. I am sure that my union brothers and sisters would have no problem with the $5-$15 a week contribution to health care to offset the company health care costs.

someone should educate the employees on strike, of why they are on strike in the first place. Having asked why they were on strike. They had no answer to give. They're ignorant for having going on strike in the first place. With the amount of money they were making. I would've gladly taken any of their positions. OH YEAH I have with no benefits and happy with it.

So you'd take their jobs. Begin at MINIMUM WAGE! So you'd really take it?

And with a little seniority--like several years--you might work up to the standard 25 hours a week. So even if you're making what approaches $20 an hour, it's similar to the amount of money as someone working 40 hours a week for minimum wage.

So Marquez-dipshit, what makes the job so appealing and so different from flipping burgers at McD's or working the counter at 7/11?

The difference is that you have basic healthcare, which EVERYONE is this society should have.

Learn the issues before you start having scabbing fantasies.

The Saint

1st get some meds for those lil' body parasites crawling all over you, then go to fucking Mickey D's and VOLUNTEER to work there without a wage. Shit, smart guy, why don't you collect bottles and cans and DONATE the proceeds to Mickey D's.

Yes, scabbie, slavery seems to be your choice. Enjoy!

Vince the Saint

Wht don't we just attach that little tidbit of idiocy and your disgustingly foul mouth and attitude to your resume and see if you can ever get a job in the real world. People like you aren't even good enough to clean McDonalds toilets! You should pay people to ignore you and let you live.

Wht don't we just attach that little tidbit of idiocy and your disgustingly foul mouth and attitude to your resume and see if you can ever get a job in the real world. People like you aren't even good enough to clean McDonalds toilets! You should pay people to ignore you and let you live.

Wht don't we just attach that little tidbit of idiocy and your disgustingly foul mouth and attitude to your resume and see if you can ever get a job in the real world. People like you aren't even good enough to clean McDonalds toilets! You should pay people to ignore you and let you live.

Wht don't we just attach that little tidbit of idiocy and your disgustingly foul mouth and attitude to your resume and see if you can ever get a job in the real world. People like you aren't even good enough to clean McDonalds toilets! You should pay people to ignore you and let you live.

To Saint,

I just found this side and it's getting pretty ugly on here. I'm a flight attendant for one of the largest airlines in the world. 3 years ago our pilot where up for a new contract. It was a nasty summer and we lost most of our business passengers, which make up for the majority of the airlines profit. Then 9/11 happened. Over 100.000 airline employees have lost there job. For us lucky once who put enough years in with the company times where changing fast. Our pilot's took a 25 %pay cut, we flight attendants took a 8% cut and also have to pay for medical insurance now.
We are glad to still have a job, a strike would have been unthinkable. The difference beetween a checker and a flight attendantant is that you guys are replaced in no time as your job takes no skills and anyone can do it.
Just for your references a clerk at Vons makes more money then some flight attendants do. Why in the world would anyone stay with a company as a clerk for a long time anyway? I was born in Germany and compared to Europe this is still the land of oportunity.
And it is not all about corporate greed, look at your union leaders that still make an average of $80.000 a year. They are only keeping there jobs as long as there is work for them, as longer the strike as better for them. Buy the way our union use to be very strong as well but with so many flight attendants without a job we just had to merge with another union because our union was broke. So tell me where do you the people who work as a checker see yourself in 5 or 10 years? Why don't take this time of strike to move on to better and bigger things in life?
I'm sure it is not that easy, the economy is bad, most of you have no education or are just getting one. Where in CA can you make $17.90 an hour without any skills?
Did you ever think what will happen once this strike is over? Vons lost so much business because of the strike it will take them a while to recover. Where will you be in the mean time? Don't you think the same thing will happen to you that happened to us airliners? There will be major lay offs for a while. But uhh maybe it's not too bad after all, at least then you can spend your time collecting unemployment and not walking up and down the parking lot anymore.
I think the smart people are the once who crossed the line to work for Vons during this strike to make some extra $. At least they are taking the opportunity this country offers to all of us.
Good luck.

And being a flight attendent requires a Phd.? in what, putting on lipstick and learning to serve that yummy food? or in wearing dorky clothes? or in the ever ready insincere smile?

I'm not being serious, you say? Then the brains to be a flight attendent is in remembering the emergency procedure announcement right before the flight. Right?

And AJ flygirl, maybe Germany doesn't have such a good education system after all, as demonstrated by your spelling, grammar and logic. You probably aren't intelligent enough to be a grocery store checker. Remember genius, there are lots more things in the store. But I guess that Phd. comes in handy when you have to ask:

"The chicken or the beef dinner, sir?" or "Would you like some peanuts?" or "What would you like to drink?"

Oh my, it must be so hard to remember what the passenger ordered. Even flight attendents with masters degrees have a tough time with that, right?

And if you know flight attendents who make less than grocery clerks, well logically shouldn't that quit such a mentally demanding job in the airline industry and take the easy job as a grocery clerk? Then if the strike does succeed, they'll have more pay for such easy work, decent health care and pensions and won't have to worry about all those onerously difficult duties on the plane--and for more money to boot.

Hey AJ--or can I just call you dipshit 2?--why don't you just quit such a hard job and show that you're NOT human and become a scab. And hopefully some righteous striker will give you the justice all scabs deserve--a good kneecapping!

The Saint

Maybe drawing and quartering or disembowling would be more appropriate for such a glorifier of scabs like "scabbie."

But if I was walking the picket and I saw his/her punk ass trying to cross it, she/he wouldn't live to regret it.

And anyone with similar proletarian class consciousness and a healthy dose of class hatred would do the same.

Vince the Saint

I think with your attitude..you need a labotomy... people all over have to pay for their health insurance or at least some part of it...I do have a question tho...how come the people at this stores get paid more than correctional officers??... they have to put up with shit getting thrown in their faces.. stabbings and in some cases death..... they are surrounded by thousands of criminals...and get less pay than the uneducated clerk and cashier AND have to pay for their insurance.......if they went on strike...the public would castrate them and hang them out to dry..... so maybe for you a kneecaping would help you.. then you can go to prison and find yourseslf a nice bubba as a cell mate.... and whimper and cry to him....... sounds like you need some cheese to go with all that WHINE

Bob...be careful about who you are calling a "uneducated liberal". I am without a doubt more educated than you will ever be!
I was locked out! Figure it out! This means that I can not work in the store even if I wanted to.
I was fine with the contract that we already had.
Lets face it, Corporations are not looking out for their employees nor the good of the shareholders. Look at Enron for just one example.

I have remained in the business as a result of the promise of a decent retirement and medical coverage.
I am also a sole proprietor. My guess is that you do not earn my $200 per hour for consulting.
I am a conservative! I do not always agree with what the Repblicans do. I am tired of losing friends in the Middle East. I have lost two friends already.
My neighbor was called to active duty the day after Christmas.
I want our people home. There will never be peace in that region! We already did what we needed to do, get our guys and gals home!

hope to meet the scab soon. maybe we could spend some time in the ring together. scabs are shit!

HEY FOOL ! I AM A CLERK WITH A UNIVERSITY EDUCATION. A B.S. IN BUSINESS WITH AN ACCOUNTANCY OPTION.
I WOULD LOVE TO GO TOE TO TOE WITH YOU ON VIRTUALLY ANY BUSINESS TOPIC.

OH YES, THERE ARE MANY OF US THAT ARE EDUCATED.

LOOK AT THOSE PEOPLE WORKING AS SCABS! DID YOU KNOW THAT THESE ARE PEOPLE THAT HAVE JUST RECENTLY BEEN RELEASED FROM OUR LOCAL JAILS? IT TAKES THREE OF THEM TO DO THE JOB OF ONE OF US.

I HAVE SEEN THESE FOOLS KICKED OUT OF THE STORE AFTER SPENDING TIME ON THE LIQUOR AISLE.

IF THIS IS THE TYPE OF SERVICE YOU WANT, GO AHEAD AND SHOP THERE. BE CAREFUL. MOST OF THEM PROBABLY HAVE AIDS FROM SPENDING TIME WITH BUTT BUDDIES IN JAIL. HOPE THEY HAVE NOT CUT THEMSELVES AND THEN STOCKED THE STUFF YOU PURCHASED!

SCABS AND THOSE THAT CROSS THE LINE...YOU WILL GET WHAT YOU DESERVE..KARMA.

LETS GET TO IT. I AM VERY EDUCATED...PROBABLY FAR MORE THAN YOU WILL EVER BE.

IF YOU WANT TO BRING IT...KNEE CAPPING...I SAY BRING IT. I WOULD LOVE TO SEE ONE OF YOU BOZOS EVEN TRY!

BRING A LUNCH!

HEY FLYGRL...AIRHEAD!
I AM QUITE SURE THAT I HAVE MUCH MORE EDUCATION THAN YOU . I CAN SAY THIS WITHOUT ANY DOUBT. I AM ALSO A CLERK! I SET UP THE COMPUTERS IN MANY OF THE STORES IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA.
I AM ALSO A CLERK....GEE WHIZ HOW CAN THIS BE?

MAYBE YOUR BRAIN WAS NOT DECOMPRESSED.

VENGENCE IS MINE SAITH THE LORD.

MAY HE BRING IT!

DEAR KITTY:

YOU SUCK! NO REALLY! LOVE TO HAVE YOU COME THROUGH MY LINE!

BEEEOOOOCCCHHHH

YOU ARE A DUMB ASS. THERE IS NOTHING ELSE TO ADD. YOU ARE JUST A DUMB ASS...GO BACK TO MEXICO.

With all this talk of the loss of sales, and the constant pressure of creating a pleasant shopping environment.

Were are the consensual sacrafices made by Management ??

Company Cars?

Private Jets for quick over views ?

Before the respect of the employees can be achieved, there must be some type of proof that over haul of management also happens.

An employee should not fear that they are not Perky enough to take the custumers CASH, SMILE, and ask for their VONS CARD!!!!!! !

I just want to say, go back to work. I mean really, I work for the largest chain pharmacy in america. I have to pay for medical insurance 100.00 per month,with 20.00 dollar md visits. It;s not your company,they can do what ever they want. If you dont like it move on. Get an education to make money. My wife works for albertson's. Yes she crossed the picket line. She is a License Pharmacy Technician like my self. We both went to school received and education. My wife stares down the strikers. They know best, not to touch my wife or the union will have one of the biggest lawsuits that ever hit them. My wife and I said that when this is over, we are going to give the workers a hard time when we shop there lol. Im going to walk in and get a basketful of merchandise and and have the checker ring it up then say,"you are the girl that gave me a hard time out there, never mind I dont want this!" lol. Im going to give hell to those workers when they go back.

that you are living scum. Don't think it wont come back on you, because it will. It's only a matter of time. We have a very long memory, and an even longer reach.

This site permits anti-labor propaganda, but not criticism:

http://sfbay.indymedia.org/news/hidden.php?id=1541239#1670891

YOUR OBVOIUSLY TALKING TO SOME SCAB WHO REALLY DOESN,T GIVE A SHIT ABOUT YOU OR YOUR SO CALLED SHIT MOUTH ASSUMPTION ON PEOPLE YOU KNOW NOTHING ABOUT ! SO IS THIS WHAT YOU HAVE AS YOUR DEFENSE ! DON,T QUIT YOUR DAY JOB! KEEP UP THE GOOD JOB ! THAT IS PICKING YOUR STINKY SELFISH ,NONSENSE PICKING STUPID ASS!!!!!!!

Well I can see that you where up at 1:35am writing a comment on here. Seems to me that you cant go to sleep. Why are people so worried about what Albertson's is paying? Food 4 Less pays their employees low wages,lower than any other supermarket and they are not crying. I work for the largest pharmacy chain around. I think my company is racists. But that is not my problem, my company will get theirs when they get sued. We are not union and we still get paid more than the Pharmacy Technicians at Albertson. I have been with with Albertsons before. I was told a racist remark. I told the union about it and they just said talk to management to take care of it. The union just wants my money and as for insurance. I would rather pay for some of insurance. I wont have to worry about strikes and crap like that. Oh dear, will we get a contract next month. Screew that, I have a life. What do you espect with no certification or degree? People are lucky to get what they are making now. That why your mom told you to stay in school get an education so you wont have to worry about this. Many people have lost their homes over this. What is wrong with you people. I would of left long time ago because I care about my family. But if albertsons is all you have then, Good luck, grab a chair instead. Hopefully for you it stops soon. Just tell your people to vote yes. This strike is for the lazy and the un-educated. Though I do not have a degree, I have my reasons why I didnt persue them. I did how ever go to a trade school. I dont expect to get 30.00 an hour for it. Im living satisfied. My point is, why fight about it? let GOD deal with it. When we all die we leave naked from this earth. You will not be able to take the "Contract" with you. Remeber to push education to your kids,your grandkids,kids on the street,and other parents. Be a positive role model. Strking, is (your) freedom of speech, just dont bring others into your world.

haha time to pay the fiddler....or in your case HEALTH INSURANCE.......which may help you out with the labotomy ..and a question....IF and i use the word loosely,, if you are of higher education..WHY are/were you a clerk in a store???

Well, for anyone still reading this thread, i'd like to update you all on the effects, as advertised, of the horrible contract we were forced to accept so you "educated" masses would stop complaining about us. The two tier wage system has destroyed any kind of control on turnover we once had. I've hired 12 people for my 3 person department since march. they show up, decide its not enough money for the work, and leave. (if you don't know what the two tier wage system is, and think the strike was over $5, go stick it in a blender.)
All i can say is, after months of trying to educate the snobish customer base in southern california, i'm having a hard time respecting my community, which found it all too easy to blame the pawns in this game instead of the generals. The union or the company.... fight them, don't fight me. the union gets the votes it wants to get, decides what it wants to decide, and will gladly stick it to all of its members to save itself. the company would also send every one of us to hell before seeing a profit loss of a hundredth of a percent.
And for everyone who bagged on us for being uneducated bananna scanners etc., i'm sorry my mommy and daddy couldn't pay to send me to college. i'm sorry when i moved out at 18 i had to fight for survival in this armpit of an economy. I'm doing the best i can to get by, so thanks for all the compassion.
so next time you are walking into a store and a worker is going home, remember that look in his eyes is dissapointment in his fellow man. you know, the ones he tries to serve all day long... the ones he won't let leave until they are happy. and i hope you are proud of yourself.

</font> fix the effing fonts man....

I am 18. I will be 19 soon. I am working at Ralphs 6 hours a day for 5 days a week. The thing about Ralphs that I learned is 1) How well the customers are treated and 2) That it is we (the employees) who make it so. I need more hours to help out around the house and I am one of those people whose parents can't pay for college for me. I'll soon be hitting Ralphs for about 50 hours a week. Don't judge. There are a lot of educated and arrogant people out there (they don't always go hand in hand), but if we "baggers" as you call us weren't there, your shopping experience would be most undesirable.
It is our job to stop whatever we are doing to assist you and I think we all do a good job. The customers at the Ralphs I work at seem genuinely friendly, but I wouldn't doubt that a lot of them feel superior. Oh well, people will always think that way.

sorry that the font problem was never fixed. I thought I fixed it over a year ago.

fixed now.

http://www.albertsons.com/abs_investorinformation/earningsfinancial/releases/2004q3.asp


If you look at albetsons site directly, you will see that total sales income was 8.7 billion.

I am working at albertsons, I have a BA in Computer Science and Technology with a minor in Electrical Eng and Communications.I have been unable to find a job in my field for 7 months after getting laid off.
So shut the hell up about stupid people working at Albertsons and us being lazy or not wanting to get educated.

Your an idiot with a child like mentality unable to think about anything outside of what effects you directly. Have a drink and go play in the street.

Demand a refund! Obviously you're education didn't pay off! Get to know your grocery workers. Some of us have AA degrees, B.A.'s ...Obviously you have a B.S. degree. Whatever happened to the good old fashion concept of a decent days wage for a decent days work plus benefits!! A lot of "educated" people have issues to such as getting their jobs outsourced. Are they not educated enough?!

Ask yourself a simple question: Do you think anyone would go on strike for 5 months over $5 and $15 a week? Get real and get the facts! What business do you own/run? I'd like to know so I cannot patronize it. Obviously your employees must be treated like uneducated individuals unworthy of benefits. Steve Burd loves you and the other "educated" people. Love to chat but I have to go to school tomorrow after working 40 hours at 5 a.m. and going to school 2 days a week. By the way do you sell product or provide a service? If you sell products are they all cheap imported crap? Now who's adding to our nations problems? Huh? I don't get it.

My church supports the grocery workers and all workers in general. Thank you Southern Ca. for sticking up for yours and others rights

Please bring home some contraceptives from your job because you and your wife shouldn't have kids! What's with this continual education talk. I am highly (some would say overly so) educated. I support the grocery workers. I've been there, done that and it's more than passing items across a scanner.

To Dumb Cashier and the rest of those who support the union position. Did you ever once stop to consider that it is because of the unions that we now have out-sourcing in this country? How can a company compete in this market if they're paying their employees union wages that are almost double of their non-union counterparts, paying 100% of their health benefits and contributing to their pension.

I will never understand why a union grocery worker is paid more than an employee who works for Target or any other non-union retailer. I can hear it now, the union supporters will say that the non-union retailer is entitled to the same pay and benefits they are. Think about it, if that happens, the retailer will have to inflate their prices in order to compensate for the higher pay and benefits.

Here's my major gripe. You go on strike because you're not happy with the new contract. You request the customer take their business to a non-union store. How does that make any sense? It's not consistant. You want us to only patronize your employer when you're satisfied with your contract but boycot them when you're unhappy? Union employees constantly complain about the unfair treatment of non-union employees, particularly at Walmart. But when you go on strike you ask the customer to patronize the very stores you complain about.

I've seen members of the UFCW picket non-union stores requesting the customer to shop at union stores. Then they go on strike and do the complete opposite and ask us to not support their employer, but support the non-union store. Prior to the strike, you didn't want us patronizing non union store, during the strike you wanted us to patronize non union stores. Now that the strike is over you want us to patronize union stores. Did you see the contradiction and how ridiculous this is?

Your gripe is with your employer NOT with the customer. Don't take it out on the customer and replacement workers. We all have gripes with our employers, whether it is what we contribute to our healthcare, how much sick time or vacation time we're entitled to and the sucky raise we received or didn't receive. Being non-union, we understand it is not the fault of those who patronize our employer. How selfish your thinking is. You're like spoiled little children who only have the ability of seeing their "horrible" situation. You want compassion and support from people who work just as hard or harder, from people who possibly do the same thing you do without the terrific pay and benefits, and from those who have also seen their pay, benefits and pension slashed. How self-centered can you be?

Thanks for all your compassion. Suddenly, as an employee you're directly affected by a new contract and you take it out on the customer. Did you ever stop to think that the people you are asking to support you during a strike may a worse situation than you do? Did you ever stop to think that some of the people who cross the picketline can barely make ends meet because of low wages, higher health costs, and their employer not being able to give them a decent raise in the past year or two? I think it is the union workers who lack compassion and only see how the economy is now affected THEM! For most of the customers who you're asking to support you, they have been feeling what you're just now feeling for the past decade. The customer is not the enemy. Don't treat us like we are.

"The customer is not the enemy."

Ordinarily, no.

But if you cross a picket-line and choose to interfere in workers' attempts to bargain with their employer, thereby ignoring the workers' pleas and taking the employer's side in the dispute, then, yes, you are making yourself an enemy of working people.

Yes, other people indeed have money issues and struggles with their employers -- people everywhere are standing up for themselves and should support eachothers' efforts for worker dignity not undermine them. Your attempts to pit working people against working people will ultimately fail. Most working people struggling for their own rights know better than to interfere in other workers' disputes with employers. In contrast, those, like you, who favor low prices over fair wages will stroll right past a picket line and then cry about how the picketers were loud or mean to you when by your act of ignoring their cause you already yourself declared them and their rights to decent wages the enemy.

<<In contrast, those, like you, who favor low prices over fair wages...>>

This suggests that the choice is between a good deal for consumers and decent wages for workers. The fact is that companies, such as Safeway, could maintain and expand upon *comparatively* decent wages and still make a profit without hiking prices. When pro-labor people imply that winning better working conditions will necessarily require that prices climb they're unwittingly doing managements' bidding.

I was merely addressing our anti-union friend's 2 comments above that set up that dichotomy

the costs do come from somewhere, and frankly I do not care from where they come, from corporate profits or higher prices -- working people deserve a living wage and affordable health benefits, etc.

I also think it does activists a disservice to pretend that companies will not pass on added labor costs rather than take a bite in profits. to try to pretend that we can have it all, low costs and decent wages, is a bit disingenuous as someone somewhere is bound to be disappointed. it's better to be honest and upfront about costs rather than to try to bury them, and to build the stronger case that the costs are worth it instead of arguing that improvements for workers are cost-free.

if anything unwittingly does management's bidding, it's buying into this whole Value-America, everything-at-a-discount mentality. it hurts workers. it hurts our environment. it hurts a whole host of things, except for prices at the check-out counter. activists should make the plain case that any extra costs for improvements in said areas are worth it, well worth it, in the real improvements in workers' and their families' lives.

of course, I would prefer that increased labor benefits come from corporate profits, but that, to me, is a side issue. the real issue is taking care of workers, not how much a company makes or charges for their products.

Corporations don't pass on increasing labor costs because they operate in competitive markets. If their goods cost too much, they can't attract customers and go out of business. This is all pretty basic Econ. 101, but what's more important is the class struggle and a critique of political economy.

Safeway actually does reward its hachett men quite well. If it's so fucking broke that they have to make the hard decision whether to cut back workers' wages and conditions to levels not seem since the Great Depression of the 1930s or increase prices--why then, did they give such a lucrative bonus to their CEO, Steve Burd? If they're having such a hard time, does this mean they'll have to increase prices because they gave him so much? The answer, of course, is "NO!"

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Read this from a news wireservice on April 13, 2005:

$19.5 million in 2004 for Safeway exec

Safeway Inc. Chairman Steven Burd's pay package totaled $19.5 million in 2004--a tumultuous year marked by a Southern California labor dispute that embittered the grocer's workers and alienated shoppers.

Burd generated $17.1 million of the windfall by cashing in 1.15 million of the stock options that he has accumulated since becoming Safeway's chief executive in 1993. He also received a $1.14 million salary and $1.15 million bonus, according to documents filed Tuesday.

The 2004 compensation package represented a 39 percent increase from 2003, when Burd pocketed $14 million, including $13 million from the redemption of stock options.

Safeway raised Burd's annual salary by 30% in July to $1.3 million, according to Tuesday's filing. His salary had been frozen at $1 million since 2000.

Safeway didn't give Burd any new stock options last year. He ended 2004 with 4.9 million vested stock options worth $37.4 million.

(from AP)

The customer is never the enemy. There is no way you can convince me otherwise. Your gripe is with your employer and if you ask the average person, you'll understand why the majority of customer is Southern California had no problem crossing the picketline.

The point is, as customers we have done our weekly shopping in the same store for years. The customers have their own horror stories, raise freezes, no pension and steadily seen the amount the contribute to their monthly healthcare increase for years. I bet you never knew their situation when they patronized your employer. You had no idea they hadn't received a raise in over 18 months and were paying hundreds of dollars per month for their healthcare.

When the grocery workers went on strike it was a bitter pill for them to swallow. They understood completely the situation you found yourselves in. The understood because they had been living it for years and you had no idea.

Where were you when my employer froze my wages a year ago. Where were you for the past 10 years when my monthly contribution to provide healthcare for my family steadily increased? Where were you then and are you now?

that much is for sure

if you weren't picketing then don't blame others trying to better their situation (or at least keeping it from getting worse)

"why the majority of customer is Southern California had no problem crossing the picketline."

This is wrong. I walked in solidarity on the picket lines 3 times during the strike. It was inspiring to see how many of the formerly loyal local customers stayed away. That really hit the markets where it hurt. And it was helped when the Teamsters honored the picket lines at distribution centers and NO products made it onto supermarket shelves.

Safeway, Ralphs and Albertsons still haven't returned to previous levels of local customer patronage. People found other places to shop--like neighborhood mom-and-pop ethnic markets, Trader Joes and upscale grocers--and haven't returned to the chain markets.

The previous poster says working people don't know how bad it's gotten for workers in other sectors--I say wrong again. Everyone I knows, including me, compains constantly how fucked up working conditions have been getting for the last 30 years. I don't know anyone who's blind to this.

The only way to reverse this and start fighting the class war on the offensive is to back up other working class people with solidarity. The IWW got it right: AN INJURY TO ONE IS AN INJURY TO ALL!

Gifford

But you did nothing until it was affecting you directly. And now that the strike is over, what exactly are you doing to change the situation your customers found themselves in for many years prior to the strike? Sorry, people have to eat. Everyone has their story and reason for making the decision they do. I don't blame the people who patronize my employer for how my benefits have been cut and raises have been frozen.

No matter how many times and how many different ways you try to explain, bottomline; it is not the fault of those who patronize your employer or mine. The only thing it does is create animosity from everyone involved; the union members, the employers and the customer.

Perhaps the union should devise a new strategy. You have to even admit the current strategy does not work.

"Safeway, Ralphs and Albertsons still haven't returned to previous levels of local customer patronage. People found other places to shop--like neighborhood mom-and-pop ethnic markets, Trader Joes and upscale grocers--and haven't returned to the chain markets."

You hit the nail on the head. Since the strike ended Safeway, Ralphs and Albertson's have lost a lot of their customer base. I happen to be one they have lost that has no intention of returning. We thank you, the strikers for showing us alternative stores to shop that have far superior customer service from employees who love their job, actually greet the customer with a smile and don't have a holier than now attitude. And they do it all and receive less money and worse benefits than you receive.

Your statement puzzles me. Are you telling me as a customer that your strategy worked because it's obvious the customer have not returned to the three major grocery chains that were on strike? Exactly how do you consider that a beneift? Ultimately, what you have done is furthered your chances for your hours, salary and benefits being further reduced.

The mere fact that this is still a topic of debate a full year after the strike is over and emotions on all sides are still high, only proves the point that picketing an employer is no longer a strategy that works to benefit the employee.

<<the costs do come from somewhere, and frankly I do not care from where they come, from corporate profits or higher prices>>

even though most of those raised prices will be incurred by workers?

all i can say to that is it's a really good message to telegraph to potential allies if your goal is not to have many.

what i think you're ignoring is that capitalists are always looking to raise prices. that's a constant. whether they do so is based on their perception of market conditions. safeway and alberton's workers could vote themselves large pay reductions and their bosses would try to jack prices, if they thought it would result in bigger profits.

Thoughts from a former scab.....

The whole strike was a very unfortunate event. We can argue it either way, really.

The fact is that the workers really got screwed. After the strike, I heard that all of the contracts that came up in other "divisions" (I don't know if that is the correct word), were renewed by the management without any changes--no second tier, no health care changes, nothing! The workers in So. Cal. lost a battle for themselves, but won it for others. That's got to be frustrating. And the upper management has screwed themselves because now it's difficult to find and keep good employees. Turnover is very high because wages are low; benefits don't kick in for quite a long time; and union dues are expensive.

On the other hand, I don't think the workers should have gone on strike in the first place. I really couldn't see how they thought they could win. It never made sense to me. So when they lost I wasn't surprised, although I did feel sorry for them because in my opinion they were really between a rock and a hard place.

I don't call it a free ride. Have you ever tried to support your family on a 24 hour a week paycheck. Most cleraks get from 16 to 24 hours a week. If it's the same as it was in 1985, a worker had to check the schedule on Friday to see what hours they were working the following week. How about this for a work schedule: Monday 5-10pm, Tuesday 8am-2pm, Wed OFF, Thurs 3-9pm, Friday OFF, Sat 5-10pm, Sun OFF. The schedule makes it impossible to try to work 2 jobs. I worked full-time for Safeway from 1977 to 1986, but every time I had worked a certain amount of hours (enough to make me eligible for a GUARANTEED 40 hour work week, my hours were cut to 32 hours. Why? So Safeway wouldn't have to guarantee me a 40 hour work week. I think the Retail clerks that have to try to survivie on a 16 or 24 hour work week deserves more than a clerk at Winco. Winco actually pays their people more in the long run (sister works there in bulk foods and loves it). She has a great profit sharing program, and the security in knowing that each paycheck she brings home will enable her to pay her rent, etc. Maybe this will make you see the other side of it.

Jat: I don't think the workers should have gone on strike in the first place. I really couldn't see how they thought they could win.

Jennifer: I know it may seem hard to believe that an employee that averages $ 15 an hour and works on average 24 hours a week would want raises and affordable health care! However, the insurance provided in the state I live and work in is substandard, it is better than nothing but not much! It is however what the union provides on what the Grocery Store I work for pays. I would have no problem paying for part of my health care if I got BETTER health insurance and I received said insurance after I retired. As it is now union retirees do not receive health insurance. While it is hard to win with Big Business where would we be as a race if we shirked from every challenge; quit because there is no way to win. Those employees had to stand up for themselves; win or loss, it was the principle!

"I know it may seem hard to believe that an employee that averages $ 15 an hour and works on average 24 hours a week would want raises and affordable health care!"

No, that's not hard to believe. I don't get the sarcasm here. You might want to go back and read my post. I'm not really hammering the workers, I just didn't agree with them. Big difference.

"I would have no problem paying for part of my health care if I got BETTER health insurance and I received said insurance after I retired. As it is now union retirees do not receive health insurance."

I understand. If I could have it that way, I'd want it that way too.

"While it is hard to win with Big Business where would we be as a race if we shirked from every challenge"

You are generalizing to make your point, and it doesn't work here. Sometimes it's better to retreat. The trick is knowing when.

"[We] quit because there is no way to win."

Hmmm, my view is that if the strikers had held out *until the next round of contract negotiations at another district*, they may have had some real bargaining power. The stores were losing money, no question. And the thought of another district also going on strike might have forced corporate to look at things differently. But, I'm certainly not a corporate CEO; these are just things I've wondered about.

"Those employees had to stand up for themselves; win or loss, it was the principle!"

While I now understand that you wanted to go on strike because of the principle, I still do not think it was a wise decision. My experience was that the strikers outside the store where I worked were not like you, they were not doing it based on principle. I listened to their chants, and called their union strike-update hotline. It was clear that they thought they could win - the union reps were telling them this over and over, that it would only take the stores six to eight weeks to give in. So while you were doing it for the principle, I suspect you were in the minority.

I think the union was WAY wrong to advise the strike. It cost the workers way too much in the long run.

I hope everybody stops in on this new strike. Americans a sick of union hacks. Fire all of them!

Ok so Albertsons and the venture company Cerebus have joined together and bought the Safeway corporation. The object is to phase out Vons/Safeway. Getting ride of these employees, reshuffle as they call it. Corporate suite are all greedy and snide, no care for the blue collar worker.
All I can say is...nothing, I'm saddened that such profitable corporations are in it for their pocket books and are phasing out the holidays
By the way, you smiling cashiers are here for your shopping needs till 9 pm on Thanksgiving.