(4/16) Shut-Down of Israeli Consulate

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No more wars for Israel. We should disarm Israel of its WMDs next. End the murderous occupation of Palestine!

PK

I couldn't agree more! Isael has every weapon known to modern man and more besides. The Palestinians have a handful of guns and homemade bombs. This certainly does not make a level playing field for Sharon's "war".

Couldn't Agree More in Canada

Canada:

Do you know how small is israel ?

Do you know hoe effective is a suicide bomber in killing civilians he targets ?

Thanks to the Jews who make their voices in the cause of justice audible.
Israel must immediately be disarmed of all weapons of mass destruction. And the Middle East must become free from such weapons.
A viable democratic Palestine next to Israel is the only way to achieve Peace in the region. This is a message to Sharon and his likes.

How can you call for Israel to disarm when they would surely be overrun if they did so? Israel is the sole democracy in the Middle East. Its Arab neighbors teach their shool kids anti-semetism. Palestinian suicide bombers target Israeli civilians.

In the face of this, Israel shows incredible restraint. Due to technological superiority, Israel could kill every Palestinian, but chooses not to do so.

If you cannot see that Israel has behaved in a more moral way than the Palestinian leaders, then you are ignorant.

I am well aware of how large (or small) Israel is.

I am also aware that it is getting larger daily with illegal settlements going up everywhere in land that belongs to the Palestinian peoples.

I am also aware of how effective a suicide bomber is, but I am equally aware of how effective the Israeli killing machine is when day after day after murderous day so called militants are being slaughtered by weapons of mass destruction, (let's not pretend that missles, bombs, tanks, etc., are harmless here), when children are being shot coming home from school, when young people from the US and UK are being killed as they try to protect Palestinian civilians. I am aware that almost 3000 Palestinians have been slaughtered over the past several months, together with over 700 Israelis.
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If you feel there is a difference between a suicide bomber and the slaughter of civilians by an army out of control, perhaps you can tell us what it is. I somehow don't believe that a two year old child can be classified as a suicide bomber, nor could her death be dismissed as the usual "self defence" excuse.

Murder is murder is murder. Perhaps if Israel returned to its borders that were set down in 1948 by the League of Nations, it would have no need to "defend" itself. All the other nations of the world have a right to defend themselves as well. This is not a right exclusive to Israel or anyone else.

However, I do not see anyone trying to help the Palestinians in their daily terror (a phrase that seems to exclude the Israeli army) because Israel has refused to allow peacekeepers from the international community to observe the goings on. Of course, that would destroy the "victim" myth , would it not?

So how would you feel if you were to get up tomorrow morning and face a tank or have a bulldozer destroy your home? Or if a member of your family is shot, and the ambulance is prevented from reaching him or her? Think about it.

Justice for all
Canada

Enlighten me oh League of Nations historian. How did Israel come to occupy the lands not within the 1948 boundaries?

How does Israel choose whose homes to bulldoze?

I'd be fascinated to learn about these things..

Man, you're slow. I guess it takes a long time to write your long posts which don't say much.

Israel occupies, as prescribed by international law, lands it seized during unresolved wars started by the neighboring Arabs. This land was held by Arab nations - not by Palestinians. An Egyptian named Arafat now claims to be a Palestinian and claims that Palestinians used to own the land. He fails to claim to be the world's leading terrorist, personally responsible for many Israeli and American deaths.

As for bulldozers. This is not a random act of violence. Rather, it is a practice used against families of the suicide bombers - the same families that used to get $25k checks from saddam. Israel had a hard time bringing the suicide bombers to justice for blowing up little Israeli school kids, so they did the next best thing in making these families pay for raising little murderers.

You're a fool if you think that giving back occupied territory is the sole solution, but I'll agree that it is a part of the solution. It's the first step. Once it occurs, and the terrorism by Palestinians continues, Israel will have more license to respond with effective force.

Man, you're slow. I guess it takes a long time to write your long posts which don't say much.

Israel occupies, as prescribed by international law, lands it seized during unresolved wars started by the neighboring Arabs. This land was held by Arab nations - not by Palestinians. An Egyptian named Arafat now claims to be a Palestinian and claims that Palestinians used to own the land. He fails to claim to be the world's leading terrorist, personally responsible for many Israeli and American deaths.

As for bulldozers. This is not a random act of violence. Rather, it is a practice used against families of the suicide bombers - the same families that used to get $25k checks from saddam. Israel had a hard time bringing the suicide bombers to justice for blowing up little Israeli school kids, so they did the next best thing in making these families pay for raising little murderers.

You're a fool if you think that giving back occupied territory is the sole solution, but I'll agree that it is a part of the solution. It's the first step. Once it occurs, and the terrorism by Palestinians continues, Israel will have more license to respond with effective force.

Now, now, now!

Sarcasm does not become us, Dave.

Drop by a library near you and study the situation. I am sure you will be as fascinated as I was. Horrified, yes, but fascinated!

With respect to which house should be demolished (I note you did not mention which child should be killed today) if what the Israeli government/military is to be believed (not) every hovel in the refugee camps in the West Bank and Gaza should be demolished because they all belong to - GASP - terrorists.

It would be interesting, would it not, if the international community had proof of this? Ah, but, again, no observers allowed!

Justice for All in Canada

Man, I can't believe you found a library that quickly.
Nothing slow about you, what? Quick! Tell me which version of history did you brush up on?

Little Israeli school children are no more important than little Palestinian school children, my friend. Whether they are killed by a suicide bomber or by the terrorist army of israel, the result is the same. They are dead, and there is no damn need for it.

As you are obviously a scholar of the Middle East history, I am sure my reminding you that Begin and Shamir were two of the leading terrorists in the forties and fifties is redundant. It is obvious that old terrorists in Israel never fade away. They go on to become Prime Ministers.

And lest we forget, there's good old Ariel, the war criminal whose only claim to fame is the slaughter of Palestinian civilizans dating back from 1954 to present. I am sure the families of the dead in the refugee camps of Sabra and Shatilla would love to hear your views on that little massacre. Nah, that didnt really happen, did it? Sharon and Begin would never be a party to such atrocities. Yeah, and the sky is falling.

Signing off on this issue. Good luck to you.

Justice for All in Canada

Sorry, Dave,

I missed your latest; had to eat supper.

Everyone has studied the situation. It is tragic.

I did not say that I defend "these people", my friend. I am simply saying that killing people anywhere is a horrific way to make a point regardless of who is doing the killing or who is being killed.

Everyone has a right to EXIST. That includes the Palestinians as well as the Israelis as well as you and I. Let's not quibble over it. Both sides are to blame, both sides are killing. and destroying. All it is doing is causing untold grief to so many. Unless we are part of it, we cannot know the grief, can we?

Happy Easter to you

Justice

Thank you for your work - especially now - while the world is busy watching Iraq.

Your work is SO important. I hope your Jewish brethren will join your ranks en masse, because that would really help.

How sad it is.

The minute someone criticizes the now terrorist state of Israel, there it is, the old anti-semitic character assassination. Yet these are the same people who will say anything and everything about any other nation or peoples of the world. This site is a perfect example of that characteristic.

People with more than half a brain are not intimidated by such garbage any more , so why don't you.give it a rest, hmm?

I do not believe that the real Jewish people are that vicious. A fringe element, maybe, but not real decent Jewish folk.

Certainly writer Israel Shamir is a shining example of honesty and truth. I suppose you would call him "anti-semitic" too, hmm?

Wondering

Dave whines in usual fashion that "the Arabs don't even recognize the right of Israel to exist..." Shut up Davey, the Palestinians recognize their right to exist, it is the Jews of Israel that refuse to recognize the right of Palestinians to exist in 22% of historic Palestine.

Disarm Israel now! The IDF behaves like Hitler's army reincarnated, they have proven themselves to be unreliable and maniacal with their bombs and weapons.

No more U.S. welfare for Israel. If that despotic nation which is being ruled by the Devil himself Sharon wants to kill innocent Palestinians let them do it with their own funds. I am sick and tired of subsidizing, feeding and arming that nation of free-loading murderers.

Israel is a racist theocracy.

Hey "Ridiculous",

Quite a shame that you are discounting the work of a very important group.

Perhaps, if Palestinians had real weapons instead of bottles and rocks they wouldn't have to blow themselves up.

I wonder why the U.S. sells (or simply provides) Israel, a true terrorist state, with weapons and leaves the Palestinians high, dry and unarmed. Oh, silly me: Hezbollah has NO influence in our government, though I would hardly call this group tantamount to Zionofascism.

ak

Do we know how tiny Israel is? What the HELL does that matter? in this case size is irrelevent..consider that Washington DC is lots smaller than Israel and is bordering on fascist with nukes....Just IMAGINE how much larger and freer the middle east could be if only that teensy tiny "democratic apartheid state" could be if they decided to stop DEMANDING a (democratic of course) JEWS ONLY state. Remove the phony religious/ethnic requirement for FIRST CLASS CITIZENSHIP --particularly from those who are INDIGENOUS, and remove the damn US paid for WALL have a true open society and lose those old South African-style racist attitudes. You may not then OWN all the land but will live in peace with your neighbors saving the future for the next generations. As it is now too much is spent for weapons and not enough for humanity. END APARTHEID NOW...END OCCUPATION NOW.....and skip the bullshit about that teeny democracy...After 50 years they STILL DO NOT have a CONSTITUTION.

'In the words of one protestor, "205 children have been murdered in Rafah, a city in the Gaza Strip, in the last two months alone."'

According to B'Tselem, The Israeli Information Center for Human Rights in the Occupied Territories, 14 children were killed by the IDF in the Gaza Strip in the last two months. In Rafah, 4 children were killed. Palestinians also killed 15 Israeli children inside the Green Line last month.

So don't lie. Don't make 5 into 205. People know you're lying, and your potential partners for peace won't trust you. That strengthens Sharon's hold on power and takes us further away from ending the occupation.

hey Canada -

What about Canada's dirty little APARTHEID secret?
Canada has oppressed its indigenous inhabitants for hundreds of years and even denied them the right to vote until 1961. "Canada the Good" that prides itself on giving women the vote during WWI...

Canada's Native people live in squalor in remote reserves or urban slums. unemployment is >75%. high school graduation rate <1%. homes are overcrowded. basic services are lacking. teenage pregnancy and suicide are rampant.

And this is a major improvement on the forced assimilation through residential schools that was attempted in the last generation! Canada will never give Native people back their lands or their resources and hasn't come even close to paying reparations.

But I will bet that you, like virtually all Canadians, when it really comes down to it, couldn't care less about Native people - but feel perfectly comfortable sticking your nose into a dispute halfway around the world.

700,000 plus Palestinian people were driven from their homes and forced to live in refugee camps in their own homeland.

We are not talking here about Canada or the US. We are talking about the terrorist state of Israel and its treatment of Palestinians.

Deflecting the subject matter is just another ploy to avoid the truth..

There were almost 800,000 Jews driven from their homes in Arab countries in 1948 and their assets stolen. Some had live there for a 1000 years. the differnce is that Israel assimilated them and did not allow them to live in squalor.

Our friend the ram-jet is devised like the old 'Greek Fire' weapons, which are ancient, and not the subject for us to visit as more than metaphor.

Ram-jets and Greek-Fire represent with 11/03/95 the moral bankruptcy of democracy as a diplomatic lever from the Middle East to the Koreas, in light of the assasination of Yitzhak Rabin, to enable the Democratic-Republican-Likud Axis to hostage us over Palestine. Ram-jets will be a prevalent form of propulsion, for weapons of the future. Nuff said, other than: DON'T BARK ABOUT HEMP SNACKS DURING PASSOVER AND SUPPRESS HEMP-ENERGY ISSUES, WHEN WE NEED LEGAL HEMP FOR 25,000 USES, including energy, so we can avert wars of greed, which the Media-Gov't. Axis disguise as wars of need! But that's what media trash artist Tim Castleman of fuelandfiber.com likes to spin!

It's called a 'hold-up,' for those of you who are idealists, born yesterday, or pretending to be that young. It uses suppression and disinformation, to abet the BIG LIE, when the petro and military anti-industries have time to beg this, of the MG Axis.

Stick 'em up, huh? Then Mr. investments gets to screw us into the ground, when he or his derivative dealers sell us weed that passes through Air-i-zone-uh.

What's this do for Israel, which enjoys Likud times, as Clinton, Bush, LIkud, Rumsfeld, Murdoch's minions, Jon Stewart, and the many jingoists try to heat up the war, to prevent surrenders and abet Coalition and non-combattent casualties, from media manipulation and control? Without the manipulator-controllers holding all the media high-ground, we could have peace.

But NOOOO. War is probably pre-determined, as per Nostradamus and other sincer prophets, who should be studied, this Passover. Heard of Greek Fire? By that time, the important folks all knew of petroleum in the Middle East. That means the Romans, British, Russians, Germans, French, Dutch, etc., anyone with an empire or aspirations, wanted to head down there by the Industrial Revolution, which also inspired Marxist idiocies.

Hey, you cannot make supply and demand and markets illegal, you can only re-direct these corruptly, with invasive, simply prohibitive, mindless regulation. But that's what Marxism and the unwinable drug war are both about. All and US economic policies are supply-side anti-service sectors, imposed just as cruelly, as was 'Reaganomics,' and all are MORALLY BANKRUPT AND PRACTICALLY IMPOSSIBLE.

We cannot keep peace, since the US burns its peacetime economy, and peacenik media is always manipulated by corporate media, for its proits. Then, the PACs work the movements, for donations. Got a clue why nobody against the war is for hemp legalization, FIRST? Because Earth and all that first just wants to FIGHT, to LOSE! The Green Party makes me sick. Nobody there is all about 6% of our farmland, for our energy needs. They want PAC money from their chump-change profile campaigns.

But special interest businesses and socialists like to play the uninformed, misinformed, manipulated factions against easch other, ad infinitum.

By the time Lord Byron was barking at the Turks over that miserable, bureaucratic church of ineffective control over special-interest socialism, which is 'DEMOCRACY,' the imperialists wanted in on Middle Eastern OIL. By 1882, the year after Bennie Disraeli croaked, the settlers were at it, to incite the Holocaust, with 'oh, yeah, we'll buy a bit and rule all, and no marriages but those by Orthodox clerics will be recognized as legal, in the Death Star State.'

The US guarantees its oil supply, and no Zionists are nice enought to cut OUR energy costs, with an effective hemp-energy media advocacy, which many could bring.

The Zionists have enjoyed international jingoist media leverage on the Middle East for a very long time. Israel is a provocative island in oil country, designed to incite WAR, where should be a Palestine, then a Kurdistan, and MAYBE, a lot less Israel than there is, today. The founding of the Death Star State is for the corrupt enjoyment of the various complexes. Got Arafat? We are LUCKY he is stll alive. That Fleishcher sure wants to trim him into a hill of pork chops; never mind who has to sort that out.

Tell ya, I sure hope that Fed-Troop (F at multiple choice exams, so far) intends to put a sock in Rummy's face. F-Troop, a TV sitcom with 65 epidodes spaning the BW era into color TV, was deja vu programming, sponsored by Quaker Oats. The players were brilliantly chosen. The episodes were the height of comic inspiration. Ah-CHOOOOO! eh?

And now, we see Rumsfeld, as comp character, Dobbs/Crazy Cat, Dubya as comp of Wilton/Wild Eagle, O'Rourke has to keep the blinders on, like Powell, Agarn is Ridge, Wrangler is a Jenna Bush/1st females comp, and watch out for VANDERBILT!

Trooper Vandy's a comp of Ari Fleischer and Energy Sec. Spencer Abraham, who will get us all dead, if they have their Greek-Fire holes all burning, to pollute the media airwaves, at once. They keep hemp out of the energy market, like O'Rourke with his secret Hekawi treaty, and when nuclear power gets constructed again, those will be targets of opportunity for enzyme weapons, nano-weapons, EMPs powered by batteries, 20th century WMDs, but wait, more effective, agile, larger, CRUISE MISSILES, which folks better get worrying about, since they can get more on target with less propulsion, than those now in service.

Just thought you'd like to know that the killers need the drug war, to keep Sharon's other war going, all night, until something comes in the night, that we'd better avert, if only the low-grade administration and its Sharonist allies would allow us. But the game here is to supply Israel with oil, while burning the intrigue, int WAR, since that will always happen, when democracy is ruled by the six-gun and diplomacy is from the bulldozer, the Apache, and the F-16.

May what Nostradamus foresaw, 20-30 years from now, pass over all of us. Won't be so lucky, from the FOX-Rummy-CIA Greek-Fire holes, who burned up troops and collaterals, to foist their propaganda, during the hot part of the latest, of many WARS OF GREED, which Sharon has enabled, like he's a fat version of Darth Vader's ugly daddy!

Know that Arnett and Geraldo sacrificed themselves, to defuse what Rummy-Murdoch-FOX Greek-Fire holes started BURNING, OUT OF CONTROL.

Israel always been and will continue to be the BIG BULLY in the middle east. They use USA as their BIG STICK.

Yes, and it will continue to be the Middle East bully until the US stops its aid either in funds and/or UN vetoes.

Freedom

I was ther at this rally. Not Protesting but as a patron off one of the company's in the building. It says in the article that they close down the building for over an hour, lie. Cops arrested them at 1023, and protesters arived at 945. Look. i sympathize w/ thier cause,but to lie on an article, especially when who claims to report truth is immoral and wrong. Buissness did not stop. I saw people just walking right over the protesters. I even saw a person come in to the building w/ a bike and hit a protester in the head with it, on accident a course. I myself entered and exited through other secure entrancess. If your going to report something tell the truth, don't exagerate or make it more then what it was. Or you'll be just like any other media outlet lieing to gain support for your paticular cause.

I just want to clarify that (even though I was there) "inhibit" does not mean "block". So, all they're saying is that there was a presence that prevented "business as usual" and that they couldn't be ignored...

This is a cesspool of shit, this website. People here are so backwards it's ridiculous. Arab nations have called for israel's destruction, acted on it repeatedly, and palestinians have been lead by people who have continued to do the same. Israel has tried everything, and nothing has worked, and fuck all of you history revisionists who claim that israel is the bad guy around there, implying that arafat, hamas, and the SHIT nations that surround them are the good guys.

You won't be happy until israel lays down and dies, and holocaust 2 occurs. that's what you want. Fuck all of you (except those of you who have some fucking info and common sense)

Whenever anyone has anything critical to say about Israel, out comes the despicable language. Is that the only way to discuss an issue? Certainly it must be.

In case you have forgotten Israel is responsible for Hamas being here in the first place. Remember that?

This entire thread is about Canada and the US. For example:

"JUSTICE FOR ALL IN CANADA"

Doesn't that mean 'justice for all Canadians?' You can't call yourself 'justice for all' when you don't give a shit about oppressing native people but cry your eyes out because 'a bunch of jews' are oppressing Arabs on the other side of the world.

"Deflecting the subject matter is just another ploy to avoid the truth.. "

- like claiming that the Israelis killed 205 children in Rafah last month? The Israelis, savage as they may be, probably haven't killed 205 children in Rafah since the Red Sea was parted.

Let me put it this way - if an Israeli told you that yes the occupation is horrible, but what's really horrible is the way the US killed 6 million native people (that's the actual number, BTW) and keeps them living in apartheid communities - I know that you would tell him to go clean his own backyard before digging in yours. So get some perspective and learn a little about the world and the horrors inflicted by your own country before you try to change someone else country.

At our anti-occupation seder here in nyc we gave a shout out for you all. I'm so proud to be a part of the growing Jewish opposition to Israeli state terror with you folks. Good luck and stay in touch!

BS"D

To those Jews who participated in the protest outside the Israeli Consulate on Pesach eve: how can you flagrently violate Jewish law and then proudly proclaim your Jewishness to all and sunder? Aren't you the least bit embarrassed? While some of you may be Jewish by blood, your behavior certainly is not.

BS"D

Those "Jews" who protest outside the Israeli Consulate are not Jewish at all. They may have one or more Jewish ancestors, but they have no ties to the Jewish religion or to the Jewish community. I have met a few of these sad, self-loathing people. Most of them are athiests, but a few are Buddhists. They believe that by publicly hating Israel, they will be more popular among their socialist friends. Most end up disappointed as they are still despised as Jews among their compatriots on the far left.

Please consider enlisting in the Zionist army. You sound as though you hate those wicked Palestinians as much as I do. You two would make great killing machines.

<Most end up disappointed as they are still despised as Jews among their compatriots on the far left.>

This is complete bullshit. Name these anti-semites on the "far left". Provide evidence. Criticism of Israel doesn't count.

Anyone who pays attention to these matters knows that some of the most virulent bigots in American society are (or were, when they were alive) hard-core supporters of the Israeli state. Billy Graham, Pat Robertson, and all the apocalypse Christians who see Jews as cannon-fodder in their pathetic end-of-the world scenarios come to mind. As does Richard Nixon (anti-semite par excellance), Michael Savage, Trent Lott...

<Why do you monstsers only demonstrate against Israel. Where is the outrage against the vast examples of arab atrocities.>

Yes, you're right. Criticism of US-CLIENT REGIMES in the Arab world such as Saudi Arabia, Pakistan, Jordan, Egypt, Morocco, Kuwait, Bahrain (etc etc) is definitely in order. When we're done we can talk about the Turkish gov't--how many hundreds of billions does it get from the US?--and its genocidal policies against the Kurds. Or we could talk about US policies in Iran--its overthrow of (the democratically elected) Mossadegh gov't in 53 and backing of the Shah. Or how about all that support the US threw to the Ba'athists and Saddam Hussein?

I'm sure discussion of Arab atrocities would quickly become rather uncomfortable for you, if, as I suspect is the case, you're real concern is deflecting criticism of the United States.

It is important for Jewish people to stand up against the right wing Zionist state of Israel, and their oppression of the Palestinians. The Zionists Jews are fundamentalist fanatics backed by Christian Zionists like Pat Robertson, Falwell, and other fanatics pushing Armageddon. Islam also has these 'end times' extremists, so these three religions are fighting til the end, dragging their mainstream followers along..

Years ago under Reaganazi, Israeli soldiers in full riot gear were beating Palestinian teenagers over the head with batons while they only had rocks to throw back. My ignorance did not enable me to draw a distinction between Jews and Zionists, they seemed one and the same. Only by further researching this, the information comes out that many Jewish people oppose Zionist racism and brutality. Our media does not show this distinction..

Politics of this region is confusing to say the least, but the main problem is religion. People can live in an arid habitat and share resources, but the delusional divide of organized religion/nationalism must end. As long as people are separated by delusional religious beliefs, they will not see one another as fellow Homo sapiens..

Regardless of religion/race/nationality, we all need water, air and food, not guns and tanks and grenades..

No we arent trying to defect critisism away from the USA. If the USA gets critisized thats ok with me but it should be in proportion to how bad it actually is.
It seems you are commiting the corresponding "crime" of trying to defect critisism ONTO the USA and israel for some reason...

seems you are self hating AND antisemitic.

Seems you are a simpleton.

The idea that ZIONISM = JEWISH NATIONALISM is a lie, perpetuated by the Zionists to stifle debate about different iterations of Jewish national liberation.

I am a Jewish ant-Zionist who opposes racism AND anti-semitism. Zionism is racism, predicated by Herzl and co. as the appropriation of lands OUTSIDE of Europe (by Ashkenazi Jews) as a Jewish state. If Zionist Jews cannot be honest about THIS historical reality, then I am afraid that conversations about how to get us (Jews) OUT of this predicament will fall short of viable solutions.

There are many, many Jews who oppose the Zionist project -- some on ecumenical grounds, others on political grounds. This opposition, alone, calls into question the validity of the claim that Zionism IS Jewish national liberation. And when one examines the religious and political reasonings of those Jews NOT in favor of Zionism, the Zionist monopoly on Jewish identity begins to weaken.

Wow. Now this nutcase thinks he has ESP. My, how delusional.

You look very nice in ballet slippers, Ms. Tooth Fairy.

If you dont think what you are talking about is israeli nationalism then FIND A DIFFERENT WORD. Stop trying to hijack "zionism"
because that is what zionism means.
I might as well say "Stefan = NAZI jewish trator" and then go.. "so what is your name?"

how do you explain the bombings that have taken place even as Palestine pretends to negotiate for peace.

Does it not bother you that Palestinians cheered like there was a cure for world starvation when they heard the news of 9/11?

If every day you were oppressed by American puppets with American arms, wouldn't you have cheered, too?

A Palestinian State with reasonalble border set back to the 1967 line is the best chance for peace.
Israel would still have its superior military and if a problem should occur which is not likely if the Palestinian were allowed a State with reasonable borders. The U.S. would be just in helping Israel if violence were to continue. The Arab community would then have to say (See the Palestinian got their state but they are still fighting). The way things are now:
Israel: We have to confiscate Palestinian land and demolish Palestinian homes because there are suicide bombers???
Palestine: We have to defend ourselves because Israel is slowly confiscating all our land and demolishing our homes, We have no military to defend ourselves and our land. If we do nothing, we will soon have nothing at all???
End the conflict by ending the cause of the conflict.
For details on a Possible Solution:
CLICK HERE > http://nyc.indymedia.org/front.php3?article_id=56156&group=webcast

It's not "The" Bible. It's your bible. The rest of us are not bound by what it says.

Whatever it was called the Palestinian People lived there and are still trying to live there if the Israelis would let them. Many of the Israelis came from Russia, Germany and other European Nations. But the Palestinians were living on that very land for hundreds of years whether under the Turks or the British Mandate.
For a Peaceful Solution where both sides win:
CLICK HERE > http://nyc.indymedia.org/front.php3?article_id=56156&group=webcast

Palestine (the country that does not exist) spreads violence.in hopes that it can steal land that does not belong to them. most residents came from the countries of Jordan, Syria, Egypt, Chad or Iran.

When people talk about Historic Palestine, what comes to mind?? West Bank, Gaza, all of Israel, Jordan??? The answer is the area of Jordan and Israel makes up Historic Palestine, a region that was ruled by the ottoman empire from 1500s to 1917. When people talk about establishing a palestinian state in the West Bank and Gaza, people do not understand that a palestinian state already exists in Jordan (80% of Historic Palestinie). Most of the citizens of Jordan are Palestinian. Jordan is a country ruled by the Hashemite royal family that come from Saudi Arabia, they were installed to the thrown of Jordan in 1921 by Great Britain. So here is my solution. Instead of creating a second palestinian state for the Arabs currently living in the West Bank and Gaza, the Jordanian government should extend the citizenship to them. That way, they can continue living in West Bank and Gaza, as Jordanian Citizens, and if they feel that it is better for them economically, they can move to Jordan. If they live peacefully in the West Bank and Gaza, they would be allowed to freely travel anywhere in Israel, as long as there is no violence. The government of Israel will annex the West Bank and Gaza and the Arabs with the Jordanian citizenship who live there will be residents of the State of ISrael. No political rights but all the civil rights that are entitle to anyone else who comes to Israel to visits, just like visitors in the US have all the civil rights accorded to them. I personally think that this is a very implementable solution, that does not involve "ethnic cleansing" or transfer or any forced exchange of population. Tell me what you think.

Not too shabby an idea.

Unfortunately, it's not good enough for those who want to ethnically cleanse the Jews from the Middle East.

Here are a few of its contradictions:

Should we kill?
Ex. 20:13 Thou shalt not commit murder.
Ex. 32:27 Thus saith the Lord God of Israel, put every man his sword by his side...and slay every man his brother...companion..neighbor.(See also 1 Sam. 6:19; 15:2,3; Num. 15:36)

Ex 20:5 "...for I, the Lord your God, am a jealous God..." (see also Ex 34:14, Deut 4:24, Josh 24:19, and Nah 1:2)
Gal 5:19-20 "Now the deeds of the flesh are evident, which are...jealousy..." (See also 2 Cor 12:20)

Should we tell lies?
Ex. 20:16 Thou shalt not bear false witness.(Prov. 12:22; Rev. 21:8)
1 Kings 22:23 The Lord hath put a lying spirit in the mouth of all these thy prophets, and the Lord hath spoken evil concerning thee. (II Thess. 2:11; Josh. 2:4-6 with James 2:25)

Should we steal?
Ex. 20:15 Thou shalt not steal. (Lev. 19:13)
Ex. 3:22. And ye shall spoil the Egyptians. (Ex. 12:35-36; Luke 19:29-33)

Shall we keep the Sabbath?
Ex. 20:8 Remember the Sabbath day to keep it holy. (Ex. 31:15; Num. 15:32,36)
Is. 1:13 The new moons and the Sabbaths, the calling of assemblies, I cannot away with; it is iniquity. (John 5:16; Matt. 12:1-5)

Shall we make Graven images?
Ex. 20:4. Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of anything that is in heaven...earth...water. (Lev. 26:1)
EX. 25:18 And thou shalt make two cherubims of gold, of beaten work shalt thou make them.

Are we "saved" through works?
Eph. 2:8,9 For by grace are ye saved through faith...not of works. (Rom. 3:20, 28; Gal. 2:16)
James 2:24 Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only.(Matt. 19:16-21)

Should good works be seen?
Matt. 5:16 Let your light so shine before men, that they may see your good works. (I Peter 2:12)
Matt. 6:1-4 Take heed that ye do not your alms before men, to be seen of them...that thine alms may be in secret. (Matt. 23:5)

Should we own slaves?
Lev. 25:45-46 Moreover of the children of the strangers that do sojourn among you, of them shall ye buy...and they shall be your posession...they shall be your bondmen forever. (Gen. 9:25; Ex. 21:2,7; Joel 3:8; Luke 12:47; Col. 3:22)
Is. 58:6 Undo the heavy burdens...break every yoke. (Matt. 23:10)

Does God change his mind?
Mal. 3:6. For I am the Lord; I change not. Num. 23:19 God is not a man, that he should lie; neither the son of man, that he should repent. (Ezek. 24:14; James 1:17)
Ex. 32:14. And the Lord repented of the evil which he had thought to do unto his people. (Gen. 6:6; Jonah 3:10; Sam. 2:30-31; II Kings 20:1-6; Num. 16:20-35)

Are we punished for our parent's sins?
Ex. 20:5 For I the Lord thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generations. (Ex. 34:7)
Ezek. 18:20 The son shall not bear the iniquity of the father.

Is God good or evil?
Psa. 145:9. The Lord is good to all. (Deut. 32:4; James 1:13)
Is. 45:7 I make peace and create evil. I the Lord do all these things. (Lam 3:38; Jer. 18:11; Ezek. 20:25)

Is God Peaceable?
John 14:27 Peace I leave with you, my peace I give unto you. (Luke 2:14; Acts 10:36)
Matt. 10:34 Think not that I am come to send peace on earth, I came not to send peace, but a sword. (Matt. 10:35-37; Luke 22:36)

Was Jesus trustworthy?
John 8:14 Though I bear record of myself, yet my record is true.
John 5:31 If I bear witness of myself, my witness is not true.

Shall we call people names?
Matt. 5:22 Whosoever shall say Thou fool, shall be in danger of hellfire.
Matt. 23:17 (Jesus said) Ye fools and blind.

Has anyone seen God?
John 1:18 No man hath seen God at anytime. (Ex 33:20; Tim. 6:16; John 6:46; I John 4:12)
Gen. 32:30 For I have seen god face to face. (Ex. 33:11, 23; Is. 6:1; Job 42:5)

How many gods are there?
Deut. 6:4 The Lord or God is one Lord.
Gen. 1:26 And God said, let us make man in our image.(Gen. 3:22; I John 5:7)

Are we all sinners?
Rom. 3:23 For all have sinned. (Rom. 3:10; Psa.14;3)
Job 1:1 There was a man... whose name was Job; and that man was perfect and upright. (Gen. 7:1; Luke 1:5-6)

When was Jesus crucified?
Mark 15:22 and it was the third hour, and they crucified him.
John 19:14-15 And about the sixth hour: and he saith unto the Jews, Behold your King! But they cried out...crucify him!"

Shall we obey the law?
I Peter 2:13 Submit yourself to every ordinance of man.
Acts 5:29 We ought to obey God rather than men.

Oh yes, and:

"Then he (Jesus) strictly charged the disciples to tell no one that he was the Christ." Matthew 16:20

Just to make the point
most of those contradictions are resolvable.

Should we tell lies?
--- just because it is there doesnt meant you should use it (or try to use it)


Are we "saved" through works?
justified may mean saved and made relevant or somthing along those lines (ie you should do works as well as have faith)


Should we own slaves?
- apears they were talking to the tribe to which they made the speach in person not to "you"

Shall we obey the law?
- obey god if it contradicts with men.

Oh yes, and:

"Then he (Jesus) strictly charged the disciples to tell no one that he was the Christ." Matthew 16:20

- you aren't his disciple I presume anyway these statments may have had an implied time limit.

etc etc

Lizzy, eyewitnesses in Jersey witnesed Jewish Israelis jumping and high fiving one another while video taping the events as they occured on 911.

Why could they have not saved the rest of us, the best sit in da house>>>