SFPD shoots, kills suspected car thief

Why was the cop standing behind the car? Seems to me that's not a very smart thing to do if you're trying to arrest someone...

will pedestrians and cyclists be allowed to defend themselvs with lethal force when confronted by murderous drivers trying to kill them with their automobiles?

This is symptomatic of what is going on all over the country. It is a police state. Cops have the right to shoot and kill anyone, a week suspension with pay, the usual "inquiry" or coverup, then back on the streets.

A certain mentality, and psychosexual need, draws people to a career as a cop.

Cops perceive any infraction of the law, as a personal affront to their "manhood" (authority) and they respond with brute force for simple reason: They can.

The Brotherhood of Blue,is probably one of the most powerful brotherhoods (unions) in the nation.
A cop is NEVER wrong.

In Seattle last year. A drunken cop, off duty, rolled his car and killed his passenger, another drunken cop.

Cop reaction: A vigil at the local hospital for the injured drunken cop that killed his cop passenger.

With unlimited power handed to them by Ashcroft, Congress and the misadminstration..... tread softly and look constantly over your shoulder.

So what's wrong with this?

The guy allegedly stole a car, and almost killed someone. This isn't a good person.

Cop or not, nobody deserves to get squished by a car.

Accident? Unlikely: it takes effort to turn on a car, shift it into geart, and hit the gas.

What were the other cops supposed to do? "Uh, excuse me sir, you just ran over my friend. He is seriously hurt and might die. Could you please pull forward a little bit?"

Pepper spray might work, or it might encourage the driver to crush the cop even more. Many people react violently when hit by pepper spray.

Approach the car and use your clubs? Maybe the thief has a gun, the cops can't tell.

No, you stop the driver as fast as possible using the quickest method at your disposal. Today, that involves guns. In the future, there might be non-lethal alternatives: Concussion grenades, stun guns, that sticky foam shit, etc. but today they use guns, and with this crazy driver, their use seems justified.

Change the scenario a little bit: If this was Critical Mass, and one of your friends was being crushed by an angry driver, what would you do?

The right wingers are attracted to threads about cops murdering people - they're trained by corporate media to respond instantly when they see destruction and death, to protect the murders.

The Oakland Riders got run out of town - 3 of the 4 cops that were sentenced took off out of the country.

Some pig force.

What are you trying to say here, that an inanimate object is worth more than a human life? Is that what you're saying? It sure sounds like it.

The key here is not that the driver tried to run down a cop, but that the cops claimed that he tried to run over a cop. These are two totally different scenarios.

On TV last night they interviewed witnesses. At first the police said 'we had reason to belive he was armed.' Then the witness said, they didn't even warn the driver to come out of the car with hands up etc. Then the cops said, 'oh well, he tried to run over one of us.'

Changing stories are usually a good indicator that someone is lying!

I've just heard too many cop lies to give them the benefit of the doubt, ever.

There are a lot of things that may have happened. Murder isn't right, cop or civilian. Cops do have a tendency to lie and cover their asses when they fuck up and kill someone... What's likely is that the car rolled and the pigs freaked. Or the cops, all wound up from the weekend, overreacted to a common situation. Some trigger-happy power hungry dude got too hyped up and pulled the trigger.
Big shock, eh?

That CJ grows a brain soon, so we don't have to read any more of his assinine crap on here.

Very true, the cops could be lying.

>>>On TV last night they interviewed witnesses. At first the police said 'we had reason to belive he was armed.' Then the witness said, they didn't even warn the driver to come out of the car with hands up etc. Then the cops said, 'oh well, he tried to run over one of us.'<<<

Those two cop statements aren't mutually exclusive. Cops ALWAYS fear that the person they just pulled over could be armed. If they think it's a car thief, that only heightens the fear, with good reason: Car thieves are armed more often then non-car-thieves.

Maybe the witness was wrong. In my experience with police actions like this, most witnesses don't pay enough close attention to be credible. They see the car and the cops, and then go about their business and quit paying attention. Then someone gets shot, and in the aftermath, the witness can't clearly remember what happened.

This is why people with cameras are good.

>>>I've just heard too many cop lies to give them the benefit of the doubt, ever.<<<

I give everyone the benefit of a doubt. I'm not going to doubt someone just because of their occupation, be it a Cop, student, McDonalds sales clerk, whatever.

You have the word of 3 cops vs some witnesses. I don't believe either side yet.

>>>The right wingers are attracted to threads about cops murdering people - they're trained by corporate media to respond instantly when they see destruction and death, to protect the murders.<<<

So if the driver killed the cop, I'd be trained to protect him?

The anti-cop bias at Indymedia is really bad. Your hatred for authority clouds your judgement.

If it was your friend who was hit by the car, wouln't you try to save your friend using any method at your disposal?

Just because someone disagrees with you does not mean that they are a right winger. Dissent is healthy, in any community.

>>>What's likely is that the car rolled and the pigs freaked. <<<

I have doubts.

A car has two brakes. If you don't want your car to roll, set the fucking brakes. It's easy, I do it all the time, and I have yet to hurt a single pedestrian in my 14 years of driving.

Too many clueless drivers out there, can't perform the basic functions required for driving.

Have you noticed that "CJ" didn't answer the question?

Is an inanimate object is worth more than a human life, yes or no?

If everyone has the same type of training in weapons, investigation, and access to weaponry, are you not in a round about way empowering those whom will do harm society with these tools?

It’s an old catch 22, do you empower a select group of people and hope to limit the number of abusers or do you empower everyone knowing that you are also empowering those whom will do harm to you?

"Abolish the police and the military."

you truly are the biggest idiot i have ever known of.

umm, good one wormstorm. your knack for making a point relevant to the actual conversation is stunning. no, really, it is. if you disagree, why didn't you respond with substance?

Wormstorm did. He called him an idiot which is what he is. That's overflowed with substance. Sometimes the only thing left is to shake your head, laugh at how stupid he is, and walk away. Only a fool responds to an idiot knowing they'll never understand.

The right wing is basically so terrified all the time that they'll believe anything cops or religious fanatical leaders like Asscroft tell them.

Sad really, to be going through life like mice, believing that if they asked a question they'd be stomped flat, so just attack anyone who asks a question. It's all a function of having made little or no deep relationships with other humans, and thus being terrified about most everything, having no morals by which to guide.

I even sort of wondered if the Chron's insanity today was to deflect attention away from this incident, so blatant But who knows, right?

Could'nt this all have been avoided if the suspect had done what the Officers ordered him to do rather than trying to kill the Officer?
You will know what I mean when the passengers testimony comes out....LOL

Well if you want to play the numbers game, I would say that are more bad people in society than there are bad cops.

As to Prohibition (and I’m assuming you mean the current list of illegal drugs), yes the overall crime/arrest rate would go down but in lifting Prohibition you would also have an increase in the number of drug addicts. Then the question of who will be responsible for taking care of the addicts must be asked? Is it a general lawsuit like those we have seen regarding Big Tobacco but this time it will be Big Marijuana, Big Cocaine, or Big Heroine? Is it society’s responsibility to care for them? Or do you move in stating that it’s the individual’s responsibility for their decisions? It’s an easy statement to make, but one must consider the trade offs…

If Capitalism falls, it’s hard to say whether crime would increase or decrease, it depends upon the economic systems you replace it with and the acceptance of that system within that society. If the society embraces, then yes I can see the fall in the crime rate, but if the society is against it, then I would say you would see a thousand fold increase in crime.

One can rephrase your statement of “their main power is not their arms or their training, but that most of their victims can't defend themselves” to say that it is because they are armed and trained that they are able to victimize people and if you give them better armament and training, that would make them better predators.

"more bad people in society"

Take social psychology 101 - people automatically consider other people to be 'bad people' before they consider that often good people are put into bad situations. It's essentially hard-wired for us to think badly of others when we have to think fast.

The distinction - the humanity - is revealed when people have more time and more info to consider what the real motivators are.

Sadly, your statement here is about as pavlovian as they come.

And natually, if you percieve society as made up of 'bad people,' you have some work to do.

Cops do make mistakes, and they're human. But apologies and investigations and increased training, potentially firing him, etc., etc., are what's in order here, not just trying to blame 'bad people' for everything and protecting cops as not being 'bad.'

Yes, there are more civilians than there are cops. So what? You're arguments are senseless.

Actually, the prisoner in the back of the police car stated that the cops were telling the truth. The knucklehead eyewitness , who saw, in his rearview mirror, the cops shoot the passenger, is obviously not a good witness. he may think he saw what he saw, but he probably wasn't close enough or had a good view in his rearview. I guess the prisoner has reason to love the cops and lie for them, huh?

Gee whiz editors, suck in your cop-hating bias a little bit.

The headline on the indybay frontpage this morning is:

"SF Cops continue derelict behavior, kill another unarmed man"

The following paragraph contains words like "trigger-happy", "murdered".

And you make no mention of the car rolling.

Gee whiz guys, take a step back and try to look at the situation without your bias. You weren't there, so how the fuck do you know that this man was innocent, "murdered" by "trigger-happy" cops? How do you know that the cops were lying? And don't give me some "I just don't trust the pigs" bullshit. Come up with a REAL reason. Do you know who THESE cops are? Are they liers or murderers? You know this for a fact?

If you misrepresent a newspaper article this way, it really shows your bias. It's like the Dan Rather of the left-wing.

hers how it works flarg, id be surprised if the corporate media ran the story at all and if they did portrayed the cops in an innocent fasion.. all media is biased.. except heres the motivation behind right wing fascist media MONEY AND POWER heres the motivation behind left wing INDEPENDANT media, SOCIAL JUSTICE.. indymedia is not edited unless those in the center decide that a story is so overtly racist, sexist, homophobic or classist..
now, this person allegedly stole a fucking car, a stupid machine that is way way overpriced and burns the fuel thats driving the stupid war on iraq.. okay this person was shot for doing this.. the officers life was not in danger, but they shot him anyways.. how do you know the car was stolen? maybe the driver pinned the officer by accident.. heres one.. you dont pull a gun, point it and pull the trigger several times in order to wound someone, those PIGS were shooting to kill, and guess what, thats murder.. let me guess.. the man in the car was probably black or hispanic decent.. or maybe middle eastern.. and the pigs were probably white..

*yay the police caught one of those horribly evil car theives and brought him to justice!!*

fuck off pigs

> ...Hothead Moll put the 4,600 lb car (oh,
>its just a little teenie weenie civic) in gear and
>attempted to ram the officer. The officer, with no way
>out, his back against the wall had only one option:
>Blow the fucking brains out of the fuckface who is
>trying to smash him with a 4,500 lb mass of steel.

Oh, that's intelligent. Apparently in this world, when the
"fuckface" has his brains blown out, the 4,500 lb mass
of steel suddenly disappears off the face of the planet
and is no longer a threat to the officer. Or somehow
comes to a schreeching halt just because its driver is
now dead. Wow. I guess all those theories about
conservation of momentum I learned in physics really
don't apply in the alternate universe of the police (and
their apologists). If I was in the position as described
in the article (and remember they're usually going
strictly on the word of the officers involved), my instincts
would be to **JUMP OUT OF THE WAY OF THE CAR!**
Then at least I'd have a chance to shoot out the tires,
which is a *MUCH BETTER* way to stop the threat of
being run over than to kill the driver(?!). The excuse of
"Well, there wasn't enough time!" is so pathetic, since
the officer apparently had enough time to aim his gun
and pull the trigger with enough accuracy to hit his
target. Anyone who simply takes the word of the
officers involved isn't dealing with reality. They have
even more reason to lie about what happened than
anyone else, since they'd be leaving their department
open to civil judgements of millions of dollars. And any
witness in custody would be about as likely to lie, since
the police would have them in the position of going
along with their story and getting a break on charges
against them, or going against their story and getting
"the book" thrown at them or (even worse) completely
fucked with in their jail cell. About the only thing anyone
should trust is videotape of the incident, which is rare.
But there are plenty of videotapes that come out *after*
the police give their version of events that show what a
pack of liars police generally are. An unsuspecting
public is the *LAST* thing we need.

Unarmed person eh..? What about the car? If someone was driving their car at you and you feared that you would be killed as a result, would you consider the car a weapon? Would you consider that person armed, then? No all dangerous weapons come in the shape of a knife or a gun - open your eyes to reality for a minute...

I notice one of the posters continued the assumptions and speculation by suggesting that the driver was black or hispanic...do youknow if that is true? Is there any basis for your assumption? Are you saying that only black or hispanics steal cars? Thats kind of racist isn't it? Sounds like some of the posters here are using racial profiling.....

"If anything, the police in S.F. put up with a lot more crap than cops in most other places would tolerate"

Sometimes, it amazes me how little people in the Bay Area know about the rest of the world, or even the rest of their own country (which, like it or not, wants nothing to do with you).

Y'all dislike the police so much around here, no wonder the police force is anemic at best. If you tried to pull that kind of crap in, say, New Orleans or Houston or Miami or Atlanta or Denver or Dallas or Chicago or St. Louis or Cleveland or Pittsburgh, y'all would get a serious beatdown and the people would be thankful that another scumbag was off the street.

Y'all should be thankful that the Bay Area is so wealthy and gentrified, because otherwise there'd be a hell of a crime problem here. NYC suffered from this same malaise in the 1940s and 1970s, and it took close to 30 years to fix the problem.

<Y'all should be thankful that the Bay Area is so wealthy and gentrified, because otherwise there'd be a hell of a crime problem here. NYC suffered from this same malaise in the 1940s and 1970s, and it took close to 30 years to fix the problem.>

According to the 2000 Census, the median income in 4 of the 5 boroughs of New York City decreased in the 1990's. Manhatten--surprise, surprise--was the only borough that saw a spike in the median income during the 90s. Manhatten has become a preserve of the comfortable and affluent--and we all know what class the police serve and protect.

If blah wants to see the wonderful affluence that has allegedly brought about such a low crime rate, perhaps he should take a day-trip to East or West Oakland, North Richmond, Hunter's Point, Visitacion Valley, Pittsburg, the Tenderloin....

> if anything, the police in S.F. put up with a lot more crap than cops in most other places would tolerate

That's because they remember May 21, 1979, and don't ever want to have to go through that again.

cops lie. it's part of the job.

most likely, given that the family is comprised of HUMAN BEINGS, their first thought is about their murdered family member.

most likely, the reason you think that people with a murdered family member would think about money over human life is because you place a higher value on money over human life yourself.

it's called projecting. but that is to be expected from someone living in the grips of a society so deep in capitalism that it makes the soviet union's communism seem downright rare by comparison.

> you are talking about yourself

Refers to comment that was removed because it was spam.

I think there is some confusion on your behalf regarding my statement’s that was a rebuttal to Nessie’s regarding a disbanding of police in favor of armed community. And maybe I should have addressed the title “Nessie” instead of assuming that people that would understand that it was a rebuttal to Nessie’s statement so that it doesn’t seem like a “senseless argument”.

But if you want to talk about taking courses, you need to reexamine what you wrote and take your own advice and enroll in a couple college courses and maybe take some time to examine the world more carefully. Are good people put in bad situations, yes, but bad people are put into good situation as well. Sometimes good people arise in bad situation and sometimes they fall due to the pressure. That’s how life is because people are NOT “hard-wired for us to think badly of others when we have to think fast”, the reaction (both positive and negative) all depends on the actions and the end results. Motives are a secondary consideration after actions and results.

And yes I do perceive that there are bad people in society. There’s also good people too, there’s good and bad people in all societies, if you don’t know this, then I compliment you for your Polly Anna Rose Tinted Glasses Perception of the world. And maybe some day you will understand that there is a difference between Perception and Reality.

As to this case, I’m reserving my judgment until all of the facts are reviewed, but right now I would say you are dealing with two equally guilty parties. Unlike you Wolf, I reserve my “Pavolian Statements” until I review all the facts instead of making knee jerk statements that suites my political affiliation.

Never thought I'd agree with anyone called Isolationist, but PREACH it brother!

Spam = anything that deviates from the party line.

first of all, what the fuck does proto-fascist mean anyway? please enlighten us.

second, what's the 'party line' you refer to, as do others in so many words in their complaints about having their frontpagemag.com reposts hidden? i'm interested.

I would love to answer your questions, but my posts are always censored. Not all of them. Only the ones explaining my view. This site belongs to the IMC and they have chosen to deny me my freedom of speech here. That is their choice, and their freedom.

See you on the street.

Just to let everyone know......when an officer runs a check on a license plate (before pulling over the vehicle) it can return as stolen. So when the Civic was driven erratically, it was already subject to being pulled over. Once the plates came back as stolen, the driver is already in trouble. When the suspect backed into the officer, he knew what he was in for. He knew the vehicle was stolen. Prior to this incident, he had a pending case for breaking into a vehicle a month or so earlier. How can anyone say that the car is not a dangerous weapon??? The officer was performing his duties and his well being was put on the line. Now, to those that "try" to make sense in how someone could have time to shoot, but not have time to jump out of the way--the other officers shot the suspect, not the one pinned. When will people realize that once respect is shown to other's and other people's property, you don't get "crap" from the "pigs" and you finally realize that they give you crap because you give them the same crap. What have our laws come to???

Law enforcement has to perform their jobs with their hands tied behind their backs. When a burglar breaks into your home and you shoot him, you'll be in a heap of legal trouble facing charges and lawsuits from the bastard's family. Now, vice versa, when the burglar kills you, he'll face somewhere between 25-life, free room and board, free retirement, and free medical. All the while your family is left picking up the pieces.

Don't get me wrong....it's always hard to lose a loved one, whether it be someone going down the wrong path, or the victim. I feel for both the young man in the Civic and the officers involved. Both sides must deal with what has happened and there will always be hindsight where everyone's always thinking of the could haves and should haves. No matter what the bullshit we rant and rave about, we don't have to deal with it. They do. So, let's cut these guys some bullshit and let them do there jobs.

>When a burglar breaks into your home and you shoot him, you'll be in a heap of legal trouble facing charges and lawsuits from the bastard's family.

That depends where the body falls. If it falls entirely inside your home, you're off the hook, as long as there is clear forensic evidence that he broke in. If his corpse is found with a weapon, especially if it's in his hand, you are NOT going to jail unless the cops stumble on some contraband while their doing their crime scene investigation, or you mouth off or act crazy. It's best if you call them immediately. Tell them the truth. Ask for help. When they show up at your door, don't greet them with the gun in your hand. They might freak out and shoot you. While they are on their way, call your lawyer. Say nothing to the cops till he gets there.

Here's an example Just a little sample How I could just kill a man One-time tried to come in my home Take my chrome I said, "Yo, it's on!" Take cover son or you're assed-out How do you like my chrome then I watched the rookie pass out Didn't have to blast him but I did anyway That young punk had to pay So I just killed a man ----cypress hill

if you dont like a comment you immediately label it right wing.....weird!

Can you see the logic of someone trying to run someone over with a car and that the car would probably kill the person being run over?

If you can see that, then it's a short leap to shooting the person trying to run your ass over!

SHeesh.....not EVERYTHING is a fucking globalization conspiracy.

I am against police brutality, and certainly against shooting civilians. But you can't fault a person for acting in self-defense. If the driver really was attacking the cops with a car, that is not an "unarmed civilian." Cars are weapons. They kill more people than guns do. 3,000 people a day, worldwide.

Anyway, keep up the pressure. Don't let cops kill without questions.

If you don't steal cars and then violently resist arrest, you reduce by a factor of ten the chances of being shot by the police....

Well, everyone here definitely has their own opinion. As for the facts...they are still unclear. You will probably hear many different versions of the story...similar, but with little pieces left out or added here and there. Depending on what paper or news station is covering the issue.

Supposedly the kid rolled back into the officer, and what was the officer's exact location? Hmmm...thats where it gets a little tricky.

The officer was NOT seriously injured. Supposedly...(and I stress supposedly due to what i said earlier about the facts)...only the officer's arm was injured by the car. He recieved minor treatment at the hospital. So how is that life threatening? And where the hell was he positioned in order for only his arm to get injured? Bumper impact would normally hit you at leg or waist level depending on your height. Either he got hit by the rearview mirror and pinned...or he was still in the car...and had his arm hanging out......in any case its a weird scenario and one that does not call for the "shoot to kill" solution.

The kid should not have backed up in the first place....yes...i agree with that. It would be a different story. But what are the possibilities of what was going on in the the kids mind....Jesus Christ he was only like 16 years old or something......im sure he wasnt thinking rationally...and yes we are human. When we arent thinking staight, we tend to make mistakes. But where do we draw the line? Are the police officers using TOO much force because they are reacting to training that rationalizes excessive force? Are they robots programmed to react from flawed training?

We are all human here....and we all make mistakes, but there IS a problem with police training and YES there are many officers who abuse their priveleges and use violent means in a conflict that could be handled more intelligently. Police brutality DOES exist.....and yes, when it does happen....you bet your life there WILL be cover-ups....that has been going on for many many years.

So whats the solution? Thats also where it gets complicated. I am not saying that all police officers are corrupt. There are descent ones out there. But killing a human being for minor reasons due to the deadly instinct that has been programmed into your brain causes people, whether they are descent human beings or not, to do stupid things with violent results. Just because they are the law does NOT mean they can do whatever they want and violate OUR rights.

The car probably wouldnt have moved forward...and obviously it reversed fairly slowly if the officer is fine. What about the kid's rights? What if that was you in the car and you made a irrational decision and started going backwards......what if you were just freaked out. I know...thats still no excuse...but we will never know his side of the story....and the passenger isnt completey reliable...due to police intimidation tactics to make themselves look better.

The kid should have recieved jail time....not a death sentence.

Damn man.....the kid stole a car and had another pending case for breaking into a car. If think the fuzz is a little more apprehensive when dealing with offenders like that. If it were a law abiding citizen, then maybe there won't be that lethal force. Since the cops knew that they were dealing with a stolen vehicle, they don't know what they can find....weapons, drugs, whatever..... Come to think of it, these cops just saved SF taxpayers thousands of dollars!!!

I don't know if the car was an automatic, but if it was, the kid very well could have tried to put it in park, but accidentally put it in reverse instead. The two gears are right next to each other on all automatics. I guess we'll never have a chance to ask him.

Just a thought.

This is called self-defense; a simple concept people. When you pin someone between two cars, you are attempting to kill them.

Police have children who steal cars and do other crimes (Officer Fagan?)! If this child was another police officers child what would the cops who shot him say then! Its getting crazier people!

He's not a kid....he's 18 years old. Punishment has gotten so lenient, that crime actually pays. Now, there is one less thief to worry about. Insurance premiums have gotten so high because of the amount of auto theft. There are hard working people that can't afford a brand new car, so they don't have a choice but to buy a used car. After getting a used car, they can't afford the full coverage on the vehicle to replace it if it gets stolen. So for these people, if their car gets stolen then what. There livelihood depends on their ability to drop off and picking up the kids and then going and returning from work. It's called a living. So then there's a car thief that gets capped for doing something stupid. Shit....give the fucking fuzz a break. Let them do their jobs. Don't let several bad apples ruin it for the thousands of good cops out there. Why is it that whenever some criminal gets laid out, people always blame the police??? What about when the police get taken down??? What about their families??? Seems like nobody gives a shit about them. What??? Nobody cares about them??? So, will people quit crying and whining about a thief getting clipped. If getting pinned between two cars isn't threatening enough....what is???

Yup, it sure does, especially if you have a rich daddy to buy off your case when you get caught, like I do.

Otherwise, you're just SOL.

I agree with nessie here. Seeing first hand how much a person bleeds from a thru and thru gunshot I'd prefer they stole it part it out and I file a claim. Sure my insurance goes up for three years but do you want a car somebody bled a gallon of blood into?

Your kid is in the back seat trying to get a fry from the crack of the seat and gets bone fragment. No thanks.

Af for the moron, gunshot is a career risk. Your a fireman you have a greater risk of burning to death. You sell crack or steal cars you have a greater risk of lead poisioning or jail. Choices.

I don't give a fuck how much a thief bleeds....what's mine is mine. People work hard for their money and they stay straight. Fuck the thief. Violate, then we eliminate. Fuck that shit. No more of that fuckin' they get their's and us honest hard working peepz gotta pay. I believe that everyone has a right to keep what's theirs' theirs'. Working hard and buying things that you've always wanted with hard EARNED cash. Isn't that what the Constitution guarantees, the Pursuit of Happiness.

Tell that to the tax man.

The real victim here was the car owner. Who wants a car back that some dipshit bled all over. Remember Pulp Fiction..You know your insurance would make you pay the deductable before thay payed to clean it, replace the seats, etc. If you had comprehensive your rates go up, if not your fucked. I'd rather the guy take it than have to go through the bullshit.

I dont know why the media wont let the general public know this information, but the California has a department that handles complaints by the general public against the police departmnet and the district attorneys office called "the Public inquiry unit". If after you have tried the direct approach, and you have not recieved satisfaction, you can go way above the police officers head to the California Atty Generals Office / CA department of justice in Sacramento and file a complaint along with documentation of police corruption and brutality and the CA department of Justice will respond appropriately.. Bill Lockyear is a fair minded man and has shown in cases involving his office that he is not the type of person to play favoritism or"sweep" things under the carpet. There is a whole division dedicated to this concern. You can call information and ask for the California Attorney Generals Public inquiry unit. The Web address is:
http://caag.state.ca.us/consumers/otcomp.htm

I agree with "nuff said.."

Fuck this car thief. If he had not stolen the car in the first place, he never would have been in this position. He had every opportunity to give up peacefully and did not. The cops did what they had to do to stop this guy. Plain and simple. I would much rather see a car thief die than a police officer.

Ummm....if some guy gets blown away in your car, you can get the car replaced IF you have full insurance. Just a nice little insurance tip I thought I'd pass along.

Its your right to believe or think what you want. But the police accounts of that day don't make sense and the police need to answer for the actions. The say the driver was endangering lives, driving erratic, if you ever been on 19th avenue at rush hour you know you the traffic is too heavy to do so. Secondly, if you watched the news footage you can see how the cars were postioned that the driver did not have room to ram the police car, his car probably rolled back (it was a manual transmission) or maybe he thought he could get away. The police were in an unmarked police car and witnesses said that the driver had his hands on the steering wheel, the cops never identified themselves nor gave a warning. Witnesses also said that the driver was parked and out of the car 30 min. before and the same police were across the street watching him. Why not arrest him then? No the police wait until they are transporting a prisoner (informant?) and give chase. Then open fire at point blank and kill him only to give no assistance to a dying boy because they don't have gloves and refuse the help of a nurse on the scene who sees he's alive. Then to tow the vehicle with his body in it through the city. No one is saying that stealing a car is ok its far from it but have any of you ever made a mistake or can say that you have no regrets? Don't be so quick to judge lets wait and see the what the independent investigation finds. Let's hope that none of your family or friends make a bad choice or chose the wrong path and pay for it with their life.

Its your right to believe or think what you want. But the police accounts of that day don't make sense and the police need to answer for the actions. The say the driver was endangering lives, driving erratic, if you ever been on 19th avenue at rush hour you know you the traffic is too heavy to do so. Secondly, if you watched the news footage you can see how the cars were postioned that the driver did not have room to ram the police car, his car probably rolled back (it was a manual transmission) or maybe he thought he could get away. The police were in an unmarked police car and witnesses said that the driver had his hands on the steering wheel, the cops never identified themselves nor gave a warning. Witnesses also said that the driver was parked and out of the car 30 min. before and the same police were across the street watching him. Why not arrest him then? No the police wait until they are transporting a prisoner (informant?) and give chase. Then open fire at point blank and kill him only to give no assistance to a dying boy because they don't have gloves and refuse the help of a nurse on the scene who sees he's alive. Then to tow the vehicle with his body in it through the city. No one is saying that stealing a car is ok its far from it but have any of you ever made a mistake or can say that you have no regrets? Don't be so quick to judge lets wait and see the what the independent investigation finds. Let's hope that none of your family or friends make a bad choice or chose the wrong path and pay for it with their life.