SF Communist Breakaway Contingent January 18th

I want to know why the well-organized RCP-backed Not in Our Name coalition does not support the longer protests at these things.

They have the resources but do not show solidarity with those who keep protesting?

what are you talking about?

Black rules.

All FIVE showed up for this comminque?!! That's more Communists working together at any time since 1917. I say they'll split into six* different factions by noon.


*even Mao-Mao, the commune poodle, has been purged for capitalist tendencies. He was caught eating a too-expensive brand of Alpo.

"All FIVE showed up for this comminque?!! That's more Communists working together at any time since 1917."

They got the five that between them could form paragraphs.

I don't care how people identify, just as long as they want to raise the stakes. I think that any and all people who want to be out in the streets beyond the permitted strolling route, are a great idea.

I think this is great. Communism is the only solution to end the war which capitalism chronically produces. We need to make that very clear, instead of listening to every opprotunist politician who insincerly preaches the horrible aspects of war, at the same time up holding the very system which creates it. Then, we have these revisionist pseudo-marxists like the WWP, RCP, and ISO who are nothing but petty reformists and liberal supporters. Is there anyone in the US upholding the revolutionary Marxist tradition? We need an internationalist communist party in the bay area!

http://www.sinistra.net/ - Library of the Communist Left

This call to action is great! I was wondering how long it would take before the rank and file of communist organizations became upset because the anarchists get all the credit for militant protests.

January 18th is gearing up to be one fucking real protest. Now is the time -- will the RCPs and Committees of Correspondence and WWP show that they are more concerned with "party building" or taking a REAL STAND?

If NION and groups like that cannot stand up now, they never can. And if they never can, they need to quit sucking people in and pacifying them.

"Communism is the only solution to end the war"

really? Sounds sort of . . . sectarian . . . although I'm hoping that wasn't your plan.

I'm glad to see people starting to organize, but could we all try to respect each other? None of us or our groups are "IT" with the ultimate answer. Some have more power and numbers - so what? Some are extremist - so what? Etc. We all play a part Attacking ANY group (outside of our most common adversary - the moron regime) damages all of us.

How can we all be independent without needing to trash others to get there?

Easy. Worry about yourself, not others. Focus on your OWN message in it's own way, not how it isn't the other's message.

There's lots of time all year long to trash ANSWER - is now the time to do that? I'd rather focus on getting the word out about what EACH of our groups has to offer.

Dear Green,

Yes, communism is the solution to the capitalist war society. Every single anti-capitalist leftist believes this. They may disagree on the way to get there -- i.e. Trot strategy, anarchist strategy, or what have you. But they all agree that a society without need, without property, and without governments is the ultimate goal.

If you are a reformist, you do not share these goals. You may still choose to come on the breakaway marches, of course. But please do not create sectarian battles where they do not exist.

the reason none of the communist parties support breakaway stuff is because they want people to be pacified. they want the people they "suck in and pacify" to basically just turn over the apparatus of state power to them. then the theory goes, the new leaders will do good things for the people with that state power and eventually??? dismantle it.

i think this is an approach that will never encourage the individuality or stepping up of protest movements so that they confront the "war machine".

and apparently these 5 communists calling for another breakaway are kinda conflicted between controlling the politics of the breakaway and holding to the principle behind the breakaway itself.

what they are doing is trying to impose some form of the politics of communism on a breakaway march.
the "anarchist breakaway" does not do this, so it would not impose any politics on them if they chose to participate. participating as a matter of conscience, with no spcial kudos or extra recognition for being communist, seems not to be enough for these folks, so they want "their own" breakaway that is called communist.

wacky stuff.

So is the intent to join and participate in the black bloc breakaway that has been called?

Communism has never worked anywhere in the world. It's a bogus scheme.

Communism has never worked anywhere in the world. It's a bogus scheme.

what about primitivsm and other anti-capitalist and anti-communist view points?

http://www.indybay.org/news/2002/12/1552852_comment.php#1553028

I was at the last breakaway at the last peace march. I must say it was a whole lot better than the march, rally and speeches that contain little but nice sounding phrases about "peace" and "brotherhood".

Yes, what made Seattle significant was that people weren't into just one more nice, respectable protest; they actually shut down the WTO.

We need that approach again. We also need an approach that can draw in masses of working class people who are just watching from the sidelines at the moment.

to claim all primitivists are jerks is just silly.
if you dont agree with the ideology, fine, but it is an alternative to capitalism, that isnt communism.

capitalism has never worked anywhere. It's a bogus scheme.

so is feudalism.

well said, Nessie.

I heard Zerzan several months ago on the UFO-loving Art Bell show. For about a half hour before Zerzan came on Bell kept juicing the audience with the fact that he was gonna talk to "a real live anarchist" and how tittilating that was gonna be. Finally, after all the lead-ins, Zerzan came on and, incredibly, he made Bell seem like an exemplar of reason and lucidity by comparison (there's a first time for everything!). Zerzan sounded like he was on a jar-full of downers, dribbling on about how he wanted a society that wasn't "run". I think all of about 3 people in the universe could have deciphered what the fuck he was talking about. A real embarresment.

You're right Nessie: If Zerzan was saying shit that truly represented a threat to the system, the media wouldn't hail him as an interesting radical and flatter him with its attention.

These fake anarchists need to be removed from media attention one way or another. They hinder progress and give real anarchists a bad name. Too bad Emma Goldman is dead... We must find ways to defeat the lies of the corporate media industrial complex of war. The real power lies in the ability to influence the thoughts and faculties of the masses. If the media can be seized, the war can be won. Those in power know this, which is why they will do anything they can to discredit sound political movements in the early stages before they can be taken seriously by the masses.

One of the probably wealthiest people I know joined the communists. He is a patent attorney with degrees from Yale and Berkeley, and his father was a major real estate magnate in LA, and he ranked high in the student gov't of Beverly Hills high etc and used to work at a bank. He quit recently to spend his energies full time on protesting the Iraq war, and joined Refuse and Resist, which is basically an RCP venture - R&R is still a front group, but is still much closer to the RCP than a group like the IAC is to the WWP. He also was giving out these pro-authoritarian marxist statements with the viewpoint that the masses are sheep and are really ignorant (i.e. working class people who vote republican) and mostly people have no idea how bad it really is on the inside where he's been and seen things firsthand.

All the commies are afraid to really voice what they think. They argue, plan, write posts, and hide in back rooms, They are all talk no action.

Hiding in cities like Berkeley and SF prove my point. You are selling your ideas only to those tolerant enough to listen.

When will you act? Let's go! Grab a gun and start the revolution for cyin out loud! Scared? Once again all talk no action.

Five years from now we'll see that same crappy commie messages on this board, yet nothing--will--have--changed!

Get off your asses and do something besides march in ultra-liberal cities. Start the war. But youwon;t beacuse you're scared, you know you are wrong, and you are all probaly 98 lb weaklings and I could kick all 5 of your asses in 5 minutes.

Your heros seem to be Al Quaeda, running, hiding, plotting and ultimately fading into the wrong side of history.

Let's go dude you wanna start the revolution? When and where? Pussies.

Brent

All the commies are afraid to really voice what they think. They argue, plan, write posts, and hide in back rooms, They are all talk no action.

Hiding in cities like Berkeley and SF prove my point. You are selling your ideas only to those tolerant enough to listen.

When will you act? Let's go! Grab a gun and start the revolution for cyin out loud! Scared? Once again all talk no action.

Five years from now we'll see that same crappy commie messages on this board, yet nothing--will--have--changed!

Get off your asses and do something besides march in ultra-liberal cities. Start the war. But youwon;t beacuse you're scared, you know you are wrong, and you are all probaly 98 lb weaklings and I could kick all 5 of your asses in 5 minutes.

Your heros seem to be Al Quaeda, running, hiding, plotting and ultimately fading into the wrong side of history.

Let's go dude you wanna start the revolution? When and where? Pussies.

Brent

All the commies are afraid to really voice what they think. They argue, plan, write posts, and hide in back rooms, They are all talk no action.

Hiding in cities like Berkeley and SF prove my point. You are selling your ideas only to those tolerant enough to listen.

When will you act? Let's go! Grab a gun and start the revolution for cyin out loud! Scared? Once again all talk no action.

Five years from now we'll see that same crappy commie messages on this board, yet nothing--will--have--changed!

Get off your asses and do something besides march in ultra-liberal cities. Start the war. But youwon;t beacuse you're scared, you know you are wrong, and you are all probaly 98 lb weaklings and I could kick all 5 of your asses in 5 minutes.

Your heros seem to be Al Quaeda, running, hiding, plotting and ultimately fading into the wrong side of history.

Let's go dude you wanna start the revolution? When and where? Pussies.

Brent

All the commies are afraid to really voice what they think. They argue, plan, write posts, and hide in back rooms, They are all talk no action.

Hiding in cities like Berkeley and SF prove my point. You are selling your ideas only to those tolerant enough to listen.

When will you act? Let's go! Grab a gun and start the revolution for cyin out loud! Scared? Once again all talk no action.

Five years from now we'll see that same crappy commie messages on this board, yet nothing--will--have--changed!

Get off your asses and do something besides march in ultra-liberal cities. Start the war. But youwon;t beacuse you're scared, you know you are wrong, and you are all probaly 98 lb weaklings and I could kick all 5 of your asses in 5 minutes.

Your heros seem to be Al Quaeda, running, hiding, plotting and ultimately fading into the wrong side of history.

Let's go dude you wanna start the revolution? When and where? Pussies.

Brent

As an anarchist, I know more self-identified communists who are more dedicated to radical social change than almost all of the Bay Area infoshop, puppet-making, bookstore anarchists I've met in 10 years save one, Chris Carlsson.

I also know communists and socialists I wouldn't get near to in a 1000 years.

What it comes down to is walking the walk, and let's face it, most folks who ally themselves under sectarian leftists labels just don't do that, including most of the so-called anarchists that peruse here.

Oh, and while I support the militancy of the black bloc, I don't support folks hiding in a crowd and instigating the police to attack it, no matter what their politics are. If that turns out to be the case this 18th, those folks may be faced with an ass kicking not from the cops, but from the grannies. Be warned.

The Soviets proved it won't work.

The Chinese are becoming more capitalistic by the day.

The North Koreans starve trying to preserve it's police state.

And the Coup de Gras: Marx, the father of modern communism himself, admitted that Communism is perfect, but cannot exist in human society.

In light of the «confessions» made this August, we are forced, us «natural republicans» to paraphrase the hateful monarchist motto "The king is dead. Long live the king!" and plainly say: "Communism is dead. Long live Communism".

It won't be easy for Russian opportunism to admit that the fiction of «building» communism (as though it were just another example of grim neo-classical Stalinist architecture) has been exploded; it is a pretence that has been kept up for almost 70 years with the collusion and active support of the capitalist «enemy» of the entire world.

The Moscow method has been able to immobilise the working class on a global scale and act as the perfect deterrent to any attempt at revolutionary revival. The strike of the English miners in 1926; the bloody struggles of the proletarians of Shanghai; the attempted revolt of Berlin workers in 1953; all the attempts at proletarian revolt in Eastern Europe, right up to the recent events in Poland which were bloodily repressed by the Russian bourgeoisie in power, all were perfectly justified by the relations of forces and the status quo between the powers that came about after the defeat of the world revolution (which wasn't simply the Russian revolution) in the years between 1922 and 1926.

Not a word has been said by the Moscowites, or their faithless cronies elsewhere, about the fact that one of the «Lefts», and one in particular, fought a lone battle from the very first congresses of the International to defend the position that «Russian Communism» was a theoretical heresy destined to lead to defeat in practice.

We asserted in the past that when the Russian myth had collapsed, as was bound to happen, we shouldn't expect an honest recognition of our foresight, but rather, if anything, oppression or silence. And such it is. But it isn't that which rankles. We don't keep going now, and we haven't kept going in the past, through those post-mortem rehabilitations which are so much to the taste of opportunities swine. We anticipate, and know that an entire historical cycle must come to a close for communism to arise again as an urgent necessity. The mise en scène of its «downfall», and every corollary that can claim historical descent from a thesis so monstrous. Thus «the national roads to socialism» have degenerated into conflicts, which, though apparently ethnic and racist, are in fact nothing other than the expressions of struggles within the bourgeois class camouflaged in the most horrible and cannibalistic way. We need only see the Croatians, Slovenians and Serbians slaughtering each other; they who were once united together in the allegedly «most human of socialisms» that of the «Titoist» heresy.

But take note! We don't believe that the Gorbachovites, they, their opponents and successors, will altogether dispense playing their three-cornered game. Like all those with a weakness for quotations, they are masters at digging around for passages to prove their latest argument, thus: "... we have radically changed our point of view on socialism to that of Lenin in 1921 at the time of the NEP". For Gorbachov the Lenin of the NEP was correct, that is, a free market, but there is not a single word ... pardon us... to make it dialectical! In fact, Lenin's policy was due to his awareness of the fact that in 1921 in Russia, after the revolution and «war communism» (practised also by the bourgeois governments...) the conditions weren't there to «construct» socialism; exactly the opposite position to the one codified by the Marxist-Leninists à la Stalin.

But there it is, and without being master of linguistics, we all know that swine are used to quoting «out of context». That in itself wouldn't be so bad, but what is worse is that they go on to draw conclusions from their scrapbook of fragments, juggling words about as though they had a separate, nominalist, existence.

Their final word is this: "The crisis can be overcome and be followed by a new, revitalised idea of socialism".

Ever since 1921-24, the history of the PCUS has been far rockier than is commonly know in the West; and it can't be easy trying to convince the Russian proletariat, after 70 years prostrated before fake socialism, that, unfortunately, it has all been a dreadful mistake... They are going to have to find a way to sugar the pill; otherwise as the powerful strikes of the Donbass and the Kuzbass show, even the «democrats» could be toppled.

Western capital, led by the U.S.A. is aware and worried about it. Testing the water with a loan here, a loan there, it proposes the following time-schedule: 1) First of all, Russia and its satellites to be opened up to commercial capital so that commodities and technology can be easily exported 2) next, all going well (meaning without the wars that are menacing the Balkanisation of the entire east) a heftier dose of financial capital will be forthcoming.

This operation, let's come right out and say it, is certainly not going to be painless since the inherent contradictions of capitalism itself, as an economic, political and military system are only ever patched up by way of declarations of bankruptcy, and severe ones at that. And the official receivers, headed by the U.S.A. won't be there just to help Gorby and Yeltsin save face, it is their own supremacy they are concerned about, both today and tomorrow.

Meanwhile, as the saying goes, one thing leads to another. How will the Russian state, we ask, now openly capitalist, manage to compete with Western capital, bristling with weaponry, without recourse to arms? This is the question, this is the hurdle to be got over; and the bourgeoisie and opportunism in general, extremist or not, once they have got over their momentary intoxication at getting the proletariat and the propertyless in general into their cooking pot, are bound to be propelled once again into preparations for war.

Thus we say, if Communism is dead, Long live Communism!

Source: Translated from: «II Partito Comunista», No 194, August 1991 in «The Texts of the Communist Left», No.5, «Revolution and Counterrevolution in Russia» by «Editions of the 'International Communist Party'».

Cops have to read this stuff - how are they supposed to understand it? You need to make it a little easier for them, not just all theory and history mixed with right wing jokes. They need to get educated too, you know, and they aren't going to have the patience for long theory or jargon. Like this last post - can someone translate for the cops please?

Communists AGAINST a war? That's a laugh. Communism is war. War against freedom, against rights, against justice.
Communism only exists by bloodshed: Soviet, Cuban, Chinese, Ethiopian, Vietnamese, Cambodian, North Korean, Angolan, or Nicaraguan.

Of course, it has been laughed out of existence in all but two police states. Two slavepens that constantly live to wage war.

If there are going to be three separate breakaway marches, Red, Black and Green, and they're all going off in different directions at the same time, how on earth are the cops going to be able to deal with it?

that so many anarchists espouse completely liberal rhetoric about "rights," "justice," etc? There are no "rights" or "justice" in a revolutionary war. Proletarian revolution is the most illegal and unjust act, in that it breaks apart and ignores all "laws" of bourgeois society, ignores the myth of "individual freedoms" which the capitalists espouse to hide their own dictatorship, the so called "equality" between citizens, each having "equal say" in the decisions of society, when any class councious proletarian knows that this is a fraud, that only the capitalist swho own the means of production have power in the capitalist state, and that they will always be against the interests of the proletariat. The proletarian dictatorship will not recognize "human rights" because that would entail giving rights to the exploiter class, it would entail giving them the freedom to maintain their class dictatorship, and would end up in counter-revolution. Like the anonymous participant in the Paris Commune said, "what legality is there in revolution?" Proletarian revolution is the total liquidation of capitalist society, the capitalist state, and all other means of capitalist dictatorship, by the use of violence, totalitarianism, and terror, aimed at the bases of capitalist production. To say otherwise, that capital will merely "give up," is utopian dribble, and only serves confuse others of what is nessessary.

<a href="http://www.sinistra.net/lib/upt/compro/lipa/lipanbeboe.html" target=_new>FORCE, VIOLENCE AND DICTATORSHIP IN THE CLASS STRUGGLE

Enough about theory. Let's talk about practice.

What about the game plan? Which direction will each breakaway march head? Has the decision been made, or will there be a coin toss at 2:30?

Will the communist breakaway march and the anarchist breakaway march head off in opposite directions, or will they race down parallel streets to a predetermined goal? Or will they circle each other with Civic Center in the middle of the circle? Which one will attract the most police?

Although I am not organizing it, I don't think it would be wise to post the march routes or tactics on SF-IMC since they could be easily read by authorities. I am sure that the marches can be coordinated with the other contingents on the 18th.

But will they?

Life of Brian. I'm telling you... Life of Brian, where the Peoples Front of Judea is plotting their next move. Check it out while you read all this protest game planning. You will crack up.

ideology. men in cuba live an average 6 months longer than men in the US. free education, health care, and more private landownership per capita than the US, all the food is organic and the people are highly educated. there are more Cubans in prison in the US than in Cuba. While communism may have failed in some countries, the cuban revolution continues to inspire the people of Latin America.

While we should admire the cuban people as the last bastion of revolution, we should not occlude the fact that cuba is not a democracy, and communism and democracy should not be in opposition. The regime's politics have fossilized into inaction and the revolution aborted with the defeat of radical democracy.

if they had an american style system the cia would finance the party it wanted, like they have done in every other latin american pseudo-democracy. the rockefellers are the real dictators of latin america through exxon, chase bank and all their other corpsorations. cuba has a cia proof system, to ensure true freedom for its people. we need to develope democracy in the us, autonomous of the system which does not recognize the vote of the people ,based on technicalities. the zapatistas have developed autonomous democracy in chiapas, because the US style system only works for the rich.

Now that I've got your attention:

I don't know how the communist youth who put out this call define the content of what they believe in, but here are some documents that you might find of interest:

http://www.infoshop.org/myep/love1..html

http://www.infoshop.org/myep/love2.html

http://www.infoshop.org/myep/love3.html

dictatorship of the proletariat for the abolition of wage labor,

Tibor Szamuely

Now that I've got your attention:

I don't know how the communist youth who put out this call define the content of what they believe in, but here are some documents that you might find of interest:

http://www.infoshop.org/myep/love1.html

http://www.infoshop.org/myep/love2.html

http://www.infoshop.org/myep/love3.html

dictatorship of the proletariat for the abolition of wage labor,

Tibor Szamuely

Real (anti-revisionist) communists are not petrified, NOR are the revisionists (CPUSA, RCP, Trotskyists, Castroites, etc.) Either openly, or with silence, all of the latter are working to tie the anti-war movement to the coat-tails of the liberals, and thereby set it up for defeat after defeat. Meanwhile the anti-revisionists are working among the masses to win them away from liberal illusions. Revisionism or anti-revisionism---which side are you on? Check out http://www.communistvoice.org

Good stuff. "The Poor, the Bad and the Angry" also produced this leaflet which is hosted by ICG. It's applicable to today as well.

Against War, Against Peace

http://www.geocities.com/icgcikg/leaflets/asan_uk.htm