46 Arrested at Protest Against Congressional Vote For War: San Francisco Federal Building

This is an Excellent protest!!!!!!!

great job!

> "This is an Excellent protest!!!!!!!"

Are you all that delusional? You only succeeded in breaking the law, acting undemocratically, and behaving like children.

Are you so caught up in that your anti-democratic, selfish, "make-myself-feel-good" behavior that you don't realize you succeeded in accomplishing the opposite of what you intended?

You just made fools of yourselves.

Same squeal.
You seem concerned about children
AND spanking, not good.
You need to talk to somone who can
help you sort out your issues.

Good job! We need this level of protest to stop the war! Marches and vigils are important, but on their own they are not enough. Civil disobedience will not be enough, not if it's the strictly symbolic kind that gets choreographed with the police. We need not nonviolent direct action--we need to disrupt business as usual.

(So people broke the law? So did Martin Luther King, Jr. When the system is unjust, you must violate its rules and disrupt it if injustice is to be stopped.)

I'm glad to hear Buddhists monks were involved with the action.

Another idiot writes ;

>>So people broke the law? So did Martin Luther King, >>Jr. When the system is unjust, you must violate its >>rules and disrupt it if injustice is to be stopped.)

So just what injustice was perpetrated on you ?? Oh..I see...anytime you disagree with the decisions of a free republic, you feel that you can break the law...cool...hope you have a lawyer on retainer...

We also have the voting process, the constitution..and the courts...

But...Nooooo...lets take the shortcut and make A-holes out of ourselves and our cause...You do more damage than good with your infantile actions...makes people want to distance themselves from you..regardless of how noble your intentions are...

So Randy, I take it you got to vote for this war? No, you didn't? Thats right! Part of a free government is the right to express your feelings against the actions of that government. And only when the people do that will change be made.

> "Part of a free government is the right to express your feelings against the actions of that government. And only when the people do that will change be made."

Except when you violate other people's individual rights.

Which is what your protests aim to do, adocate doing, and succeed in doing. And then you don't want to face the consequences of violating the law.

Don't we all just LOVE the hypocrisy of it all?

Actually, I will happily accept the consequences should I get arrested in a protest. People that don't are a bunch of pussies

At little time in jail will help mend your ways. Not only will it teach you some good survival skills and how to fight, but it will also teach you that most peopel who are resisting opression try to avoid getting caught.

Part of the problem with the left is that we get manipulated by people like Sam B and spend all of our time trying to please them. We need to reach out beyond our current communities but someone like Sam B is not going to be convinced. We need to understand the impact of our actions but far right wing trolls DO NOT represent the views of an average American (when you talk with random proWar people online or in real life you will find them very open to antiwar views when they are expressed tactfully). We live in a country where many elections are still rigged by local political bosses and cities where the elected government often has less power than shadowy underworld figures. There IS a good segment of the MIddle Class that CAN be won over through traditional religous nonviolent actions, but the assumption that this is a majority is ill founded and creates much of the divisions between liberal and radical groups.

"But...Nooooo...lets take the shortcut and make A-holes out of ourselves and our cause...You do more damage than good with your infantile actions"

Amazingly, even the press was generally kind to us this time, and didn't make it look childish at all, despite some minimalizing.

Randy, virtually very person I know - college professors, college students, SFUCD teachers, workers of all sorts, people from my church - (and a fair number of people I didn't know!) supported me and even went out of their way to tell how important this action was to them, that *someone* was out on the streets while they were at their jobs, not yet ready to join in the visible protest, or to take time off from work for it, or not having known about it in time to join.

This action can help to spearhead others all across the country.

I hope you join can us in the coming days. Its really an amazing experience to be united with people of all walks of life - elderly, middle class, young people, people who join in as we march, people who you see again the next time and soon know closely - as we do the healthy thing, which is to make our anger known and to physically express it non-violently.

To describe some of the people I met on Friday - they have travelled all over the world, speak other languages fluently, work to lobby the state legislature for progressive causes, are unemployed, work as carpenters, are artists, have been arrested many times, have never been arrested, etc.

I even met someone who I'd known on email, but had never met in person. I was walking into the lobby of the senator's office and a woman said to me - Tell me your name (in case I was to get arrested), and I did, and she yelled, "Oh my god!" becuase we'd been emailing for some time about other issues.

Those are the kinds of things that happen in these marches. We're not hippies or wierdos. I was wearing a dress, stockings, and pumps, which keeps me (mildly) safer than a t-shirt and jeans when cops are around. And its to show that regular people are out there. I'm a researcher in a medical center and a green party voter. I walk precincts on weekends for propositions I consider important.

Please join us, so you can experience it for yourself. At first you might feel defensive because you don't know anyone. When I came up to the darkened peace camp on Thurday night around 9pm, I felt nervous and out of place - everyone else was in clusters, I didn't know anyone, there were tents. But then someone offered me some pizza, and then I asked someone for a lighter for my candle, and pretty soon it was fine. Only a few minutes go by before someone says something to you and then a conversation starts and you meet someone new. Everyone, homeless, middle class, children, etc., are welcome. Even people in business attire joined in the march the next day.

I come home with my pockets full of emails and phone numbers of people I've started conversations with about all sorts of stuff, and would like to continue the discussion with. And I do.

Most who are critical are afraid. People can lose all that fear (or anger) by taking a look and participating. We could sure use your help and your support. When the bombs start to fall there will be more actions. I hope you'll reconsider.

> " We need to reach out beyond our current communities but someone like Sam B is not going to be convinced."

You are reaching out and, yes, I will never be convinced of irrational thinking or behavior.

I will always be convinced, thank you.

>Sam B. is a distraction.
>by nessie • Monday October 14, 2002 at 08:31 AM

> If ever there was a time to focus, it is now.

Now you're catching on, Nessie.

Start by taking those blinders off.

do not try to change the mind of this guy Sam B.
what we did on the streets was and will always be our right as Americans, Civil Disobedience is an American......novel, yes and tradition
those of us who criticize our government and question it's actions are more american than those who stand by it without questioning.....

i swear if we had a few hundred more people we would have been able to shut down the building for the day. it was that easy - seriously! we need more actions like this - but more people to sacrifice a day off work or at home and come out to make an impact. On Oct 6 we had thousands of people at the NION rally. if we had just a small ammount of those we would have shut down the building for the day instead of just a few hours.

> "by Alexi K. • Wednesday October 16, 2002 at 09:27 PM"

> "do not try to change the mind of this guy Sam B.
what we did on the streets was and will always be our right as Americans, Civil Disobedience is an American......novel, yes and tradition
those of us who criticize our government and question it's actions are more american than those who stand by it without questioning....."

I guessed you had trouble understanding what I wrote. Let's try again, Alexi. Focus:

>> "Except when you violate other people's individual rights.

>> "Which is what your protests aim to do, adocate doing, and succeed in doing. And then you don't want to face the consequences of violating the law.

>> "Don't we all just LOVE the hypocrisy of it all?"

Alexi, another flaming hypocrite, exposes himself for all to see.

In almost all instances of peaceful protests during the last few years, it is the police who have disobeyed the law, flagrantly violated the American people's Constitutional rights, and behaved violently.

From D.C.:

My Dear Fellow Americans,

Let me tell you what was done on Friday, September 27th. It was done in your name in your capitol city to your children.

They are so young and so idealistic that they still believe in the preposterous notions we taught them in kindergarten. They still believe in peace and justice.

They are so young and so energetic that they can still sing, dance, drum, march, build beautiful banners and puppets, create street theater, and yes, express rage.

They were doing all this for you. They are trying to tell you that you have lost your way. To point out to you that you are actually discussing as a rational proposition that we bomb a small country as a “preventative” measure. They want you to see that this proposition is the negation of every moral principle that stands between us and utter chaos.

They spoke to you with dancing and singing and beating on drums. (So young and so beautiful!) They obeyed the orders of the policemen, those policemen you taught them to run to if they were afraid. They followed the rules. “You have a right to speak freely and to assemble to express your grievances.” Isn’t that the rule you taught them?

Let me tell you what the nice policemen did. They said, “don’t go over there with your protests. Come over here into the park.” Your children obeyed them. Then they said “Go further into the park. Stand close together. Do not move. No, you may not leave.” Then they bound their arms behind their backs with plastic straps, tight. Then they loaded them onto the buses, and transported them across the river. There they were kept, bound and seated, for fourteen hours. Some of them cried. Some pleaded. Mostly they sang songs and played games to encourage one another.

After midnight they were taken from the buses into the large gymnasium of a police training building. There they were strapped into plastic shackles: left-wrist-to -right ankle. They could not stand or kneel. They were kept in this position for another fourteen hours. Because they are young and strong and loving they kept one another’s spirits up.

The police are “the law” isn’t that right? The “law” told your children that they had to pay a fine and sign a paper admitting that they had “failed to obey”. If they didn’t they would be kept in the gymnasium in the painful shackles for two more days, until Monday.

Perhaps because you raised them right, but more likely because the young are also vulnerable, they believed and signed.

I saw many of them sobbing as they left.

I was there to pick up my daughter on Saturday afternoon. along with her father, my husband. He was corralled and cuffed and transported from the park too. He was dressed in his best navy blue pinstripe business suit. He just came for an hour, the park being just a block from his office. He likes to go with her to encourage her to participate in these demonstrations “legally” so as not to go to jail. It has been so painful to us when she has been jailed in other protests. He’s “elderly” though he’d never answer to that description. He’s sixty-nine and a half. Bad knee. Poor circulation. Although he’d be quick to point out that he can still jog four miles or play a round of handball. He was shackled for fourteen hours as well. Left wrist to right ankle.

So my Dear Fellow American parents, I hope you have some tears left to shed for your children. We’ve shed so many this year. They are your better selves. They still believe that you can be “good”. If you do not allow them to speak, if you refuse to listen, what measurement will you use to judge the morality, or even the wisdom of your actions?

Ignore these voices at your own peril. It is never the “other” who is our greatest threat. It is us.

> "They are so young and so energetic that they can still sing, dance, drum, march, build beautiful banners and puppets, create street theater, and yes, express rage."

I already said they are "Children of the Street" but everyone here got really upset about it.

Thanks for the support.

A number of activits sent me a copy of this. Read it it's shocking



"Revolutionary Communist Party" is the cult that set up "Not in Our Name" As much as protesting is important, it is also important that people not be lied to. Mary Lou Greenberg the spokeswoman for NION is a top RCP leader.
Now, what many people do not know is that RCP has a real sleazy history.

RCP HAS DONE ALL THE FOLLOWING

1. Supported the Pol Pot mass murder of over 3 millon people in Cambodia. At the time RCP called this slaughter a "legitimate revolutionary action".

2. Like Pol Pot RCP are Maoist crazies who also wear buttons of their other genocidal hero Stalin master of the murderous gulags in Soviet Union

3. Give a large percentage of their salaries and monies raised to their cult leader Bob Avakian who they call the chairman. Avakian lives in a huge edifice n France,swigs booze all the time and lives high off the hogs all the while masquarading as a "revolutionary leader" He now hasa the nickame "wine-women& song" just like Jim & Tammy Baker did !

4. Supported the vicious killers of Socialist Union organizers in Peru called Sendero Luminoso. The Sendero in the name of some Maoist revolution butchered Indians in Peru !

5. For a long period of years openly kept gays from joining the RCP. In fact Avakian has termed homosexuality "a degenerate disease from rotting capitalism" .In fact the National Lawyers Guild voted because of the homophopbia of Avakian & co is so reactionary and fascist no member of the NLG should defend any member of the RCP.

So all this speaks for itself, and indeed any sane open eyed progressive who wants to struggle sshould have nothing to do with RCP and NION. The fact as has been proven time and time again in other struggles is that the RCP has one goal only. To recruit through deception unknowing misguided people into its small cult operating out of its various bookstores, or Refuse & Resist another front group.

Spread this message far and wide so people will really know who the RCP & NION

also supported lots of mass murder in the 50s, 60s, 70s, 80s, 90s, and so on. I don't see anyone running around saying they're so awful now.

Most groups of any kind have evolved over time. The people I've known in RCP and NION are good people.

I hate to inform you, but the real people to fear are the ones at the yuppie rally in SF this morning with 'The Newsom Corporation' - much death will follow in that wake, not RCP's or NION's, who are working against people that support war and death through poverty.

They should have arrested more of those dirty hippy creeps... Good riddance to bad rubbish.

said like a true simpleton.