400,000-600,000 in UK March for Peace on 9/28

The BBC has a good article and gorgeous photo of the 9/28/02 peace march by the river in London with a good quote from filmmaker Ken Loach: "We can't get involved in this war we can't consider murdering another 100,000 Iraqis simply to pursue America's interest in oil and their dominance in the region." See:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_politics/2285861.stm

Another photo:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/2280386.stm

My friend just emailed me this decription . . .

London English Sep 28 2002

An eyewitness report on the Stop the Iraq War march of September 28th in London in this report I concentrated on the elements that are different between the U.S. and British opposition seen.

General impressions of the march

The march was the largest one I've ever attended there are no official or unofficial estimates yet but many tens of thousands, to Trafalgar Square was completely filled with many streams of people flowing into  and out of of it. In all directions the marchers filled all available space.

Two factions the British Muslim Association (BMA) and the stop war coalition sponsored the march. The March was made up of a mix of people with was much broader than what you'd see at an San Francisco rally in particular there were few hard-core Anarchist types present. Also different was a general demeanor of the marchers they occasionally would stop for traffic before the various streams of the March merged into an overwhelming throng which swarmed over everything barriers and scaffolding alike as the march grew more massive the police present seemed to disappear but there was no sign of a vandalism and people wandered in and out of stores buying things willy-nilly with no clear distinction between spectators and participants. Also the relations with the police were much better than what you see in the U.S. march organizers talked in a very cordial manner with the police in organizing the route. There is little evidence of police and demonstrators itching for a fight like you sometimes see in San Francisco. Many more middle-class people seem to be taking part in the march. This seems to be indicative of the left being a more integrated part of the mainstream political scene in Britain in general. Along the same lines there was a noticeable amount of positive or neutral mainstream publicity given to the organization of the march that would not have seen in the state.

One of the most striking difference was that at least 40 percent of the marchers carrying anti Israeli and pro Palestinians posters, and many of the positions taken on the posters were very aggressive some of which even bordered on calling for the violent elimination of Israel altogether the percentage of these extreme positions were very small one to 2% perhaps but still an unusual difference from what one would see an America. The general feeling is that the Israeli occupation of the West Bank is deeply disliked in Britain and heater people heater are not afraid to say so Muslim and non-Muslim alike.

My guess is that the breakdown on the signs ran about 40 percent were carrying anti Israeli and pro Palestinians signs and about 60 percent were carrying anti Iraq war signs.

A marked difference is probably a simply reflection of the very metropolitan and ethnically diverse nature of London society there were a much more defers set of groups in the march I ran across a non affiliated group of British middle-class Iraqi’s sporting large Iraqi flags they seem to have no particular agenda other than theirs is no good reason to for the British and Americans to boom their friends and family back home in Iraq.

The overall impression was that the march was a marked success it was huge, peaceful and people made at very loud and clear statement that they were not interested in any war in Iraq.

Your faithful temporary correspondent in London - -

In the interests of preserving the historical record that the peacniks of the world did protest this latest round of blood for oil wars, there are more outstanding photos of the 9/28/2 London Great Peace March. If I may, first, comment on the previous comments: The UK has a stronger labor movement and thus a more democratic electoral process, allowing for the socialist community to be more integrated into the political fabric. In addition, (1) this is primarily a US blood for oil war and there is nothing that unifies the rest of the world more than being anti-US imperialism, for good cause, as most of the rest of the world are its victims; and (2) thousands of immigrants from the former British empire, on which the sun once never set live in the UK, and that includes the Middle East. Now, the fabulous photos:
(1) Justice for Palestine; End Israeli Occupation
http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/MVC128F.JPG
(2) Stop the War Coalition: Not in My Name; Don't Attack Iraq:
http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/MVC133S.JPG
(3) Socialist Worker: Stop this Bloody War (with ancient building, a study in architecture, in background):
http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/MVC144S.JPG
(4) Peace banners on a bridge:
http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/MVC125F.JPG

This is how Iraqis really feel...


Demonstration in Washington on October 14, 2002


"No to Dictatorship, Yes to Democracy"
A meeting was conducted among major Iraqi organizations, unions, movements, foundations and centers in Michigan. A
decision was reached, in conjunction with the Iraqi community nationally, to hold a demonstration. The demonstration will be held on October 14, 2002 in front of the Iraqi Embassy in Washington, DC. The purpose of the demonstration is to oppose the dictatorship of Saddam Hussein and his upcoming imposed elections. In order for this event to be successful it is important that Iraqis from all communities participate in this event to reveal the truth about the "Dictator and his Gang" and their oppression of the people of Iraq.

Participants:
Democratic Union of Iraq
Kurdistan Democratic Party
Patriotic Union of Kurdish
Assyrian Democratic Movement
Al-Ghadeer Foundation
Imam Ali Mosque
Prophet Mohammad Mosque

Democratic Forum of Iraq

Iraqi Organization for Human Rights

Islamic Center of Iraq

Karbala Mosque and Center

House of Islamic Fatwah's
Free Iraq

This is from http://www.tortureiraq.com
These are examples of smuggled tapes from Udays(Saddams son)look alike.

Tape_1: A man tied up in a chair with electrodes connected to many parts of his body.
Tape_2:A man being wiped with a piece of metal cable (covered in plastic)
Tape_3:Two men in chains go to the gallows.
Tape_4: A naked man is made to sit on a bottle.
Tape_5: A naked man is made to sit on a gas heater.
Tape_6: A man hanging by the feet from a rotating ceiling fan while being beaten.
Tape_7: Torture by fire.
Tape_8: A man tied to an electic heater. His hands and nails burn.
Tape_9: A man branded with hot iron.
Tape_10: The use of solder iron on hands and feet.
Tape_11: Using a hammer to break a nose.
Tape_12: Broken jaws.
Tape_13: A man on a chair while his finger nails are pulled with pliers.
Tape_14: Using a chain saw to amputate limbs.
Tape_15: Pumping air in a mans rectum.
Tape_16: Breaking a mans shoulder blades.
Tape_17: The classic water torture.
Tape_18: A man in a hole full of filth.
Tape_19: A man clubbed on the head and between the legs.
Tape_20: Loud Noise torture.
Tape_21: A man crucified with his ears not hands fastened with nails. He can't sit down for fear of
loosing his ears.
Tape_22: Men in airtight room with temperature soaring.
Tape_23: Dentistry without sedation.
Tape_24: The use of nails on hands and finger nails..
Tape_25: Acid on skin.
Tape_26: Dead bodies left to rot in the vicinity of prisoners.
Tape_27: On the use of wild dogs.
Tape_28: Taping the nose to force a man breathe through the mouth.
Tape_28: The use of nails on a mans tongue.
Tape_30: Boiling oil on limbs.
Tape_31: Spraying eyes with insecticides.
Tape_32: Hanging women from their hair while their husbands and children watch.
Tape_33: Rape while the victim's spouse watches.
Tape_34: Hanging a woman by the legs.
Tape_35: Naked Children with hornets stinging them while their parents watch.
Tape_36: Amputating a mans penis with an electric saw.
Free Iraq

"Amputating a mans penis with an electric saw."

And I thought that was just a US thing . . . manually of course.

the CIA and pappa Bush. Hey, you think they didn't know what would happen when the supported a former interrogator (torturer) against those "evil commie leftists"? Brush up on your history, chump. We didn't put the guy there. Your hero's did. We just don't think they should slaughter 100,000 people just to replace their malfunctioning murderer tyrant puppet, with a functioning one.

P.S.- Speaking of barbaric nazi torture, ever hear of *all* of the US' middle east allies? Get ejamacated, bub.

If only 600,001 had showed up. Who went to the pub instead?

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A23386-2002Sep30.html

It was the arab run bath party that installed Saddam.Not Regon.not Bush,not anybody.The U.S. only allied with Saddam(at arms length)during the last few years of the Iran/Iraq war when the Iraqis were losing.Saddam denonced the U.S. in 1989 when he felt America owed him something.Thats one of the reasons he invaded Kuwait(not horizontal drilling which has never proved).The only way to rid the world of this monster is to invade Iraq.Thats it.If you have any better ideas then explain them.

Mind our own business.

http://www.nytimes.com/2002/10/01/international/01CND-INSP.html

After the Gulf war,the U.N. made mandates that Iraq had to comply,such as weapons inspections.Iraq has been violating U.N. law and has been practiceing crimes agaist humanity ever since.Iraqs propaganda machine is tring to paint a picture of Saddam as an underdog trying to fight against so called "American Impeirlism".Arabs not living in Iraq are buying into it as well as leftists.
We let Iraq down in 1991 when Iraqis tried to overthrow Saddam and the U.S. stood by and did nothing,costing the lives of 300,000.We can't let them down again.
Saying taking out Saddam is wrong becouse of the cost of Iraqis is wrong,it will save lives in the long term.
Buy the way,I am opposed to the sanctions,they only make Saddam stronger and keep the Iraqi people down.I would love to see what happend in Serbia to Iraq.But that can't happan. A democratic Iraq would shine like a beacon and help the way for democracy in the arab world.The Iraqi people are a smart and cleavor people,they started civilazation,wrote the first epics,and invented the wheel.
Free Iraq

Hey, "spider dude", what makes you think the US seeks a democracy in Iraq?

The US wants a pliant regime that will hand over oil to the "west". The new tack is to trump up some Iraqi CIA shills who say they want to work with US oil companies once Hussein is overthrown -- as if this is the representative voice of the Iraqi people! Only delusional dunces believe the US seeks a government that represents the aspirations of Iraqi's. Take a look at the rubber-stamp government of Karzai in Afghanistan and tell me differently. Look at the history of US policy in the Middle East and tell me differently. Shit, look at the history of US policy globally and tell me differently.

The US' policies in the past dozen years have killed hundreds of thousands of Iraqi's. Not just bombings and sanctions, but also the DELIBERATE destruction of Iraq's water system and infrastructure.

Remember the "Highway of Death"? What a despicable exhibition of military power -- killing RETREATING Iraqi soldiers en masse (most likely forced conscripts) while allowing the elite Republican Guard carte blanche to decimate uprisings against the regime. If you think that was a "mistake", you're a fool.

It would be best if you took you're ignorant sanctimony and take a hike.

Between 1983 and 1988 the U.S.gave Saddam $500 million a year in farm credits which was basically corporate welfare for U.S. agribusiness. In 1989 the U.S. increased the aid to 1 billion knowing full well Saddam had gassed both Iraqi Kurds("his own people") and Iranians. Check Samantha Powers new book on genocide for this bit of info. Furthermore the U.S. armed Iraq via Egypt and other Arab client states during the same time period.

Fist aaron,would you rather have the Taliban back in power,or are just sour grapes that the war in Afganistan went so well.All of you anti-war people wanted a veit-nam situation so you could start a major anti-war monement.I bet all of those flags of old glory made you sick to the stomich...
As for tricky,the Regime in Iran was very hostile to the U.S. at the time,and siding with Iraq seemed like a good idea at the time.Looking back that was a mistake.Remember that both of those regimes were guilty of starting it and they both basicly lost.
But that was then,differnt adminatrations,differnt agendas.
Saddam has to go.The Iraqi people are waiting to be freed from the monster that has destroyed thier nation.
Free Iraq

The U.S. government has never given two shits about anyone's freedom or human rights. The U.S. main interest in the mid-east is oil. Do you disagree? I'd also add that this war on Iraq is an election year ploy orchestrated by the far right. Thirdly if there was really a war on terrorism its main targets would be mainly in Saudi Arabia.

Afghanistan has virtually disappeared from the mainstream news, but can you say Q-U-A-G-M-I-R-E?

Your response was no response at all "spiderdude". How many "cleavor" Iraqi's are you willing to see die? Explain why a skeptic should believe that this is about freedom and democracy. Betchya can't mount a persuasive argument, spiderdudely.

Let us remember that the US armed both Iraq AND Iran during the war between those two countries. How generous!