Bomb in Berkley cafeteria - 7 Dead !

Here's a scenario.

If Berkeley were creating 'settlements' in San Francisco for only Berkley residents, making roads where only Berkeley residents could go (say, taking over the Bay Bridge, too), taking San Francisco's water, puttiing Berkeley cops all over San Francisco, occassionally accidentally shooting men women and chidren on the streets, issuing ID cards to San Franciscans, and saying it was Berkeley's land as decreed by God thousands of years ago - then yeah, I'd not be surprised at all if SF residents starting bombing Berkeley.

But Berkeley is a little more intelligent and compassionate than that. Plus, it's full of crazies and hippies too! Just how I like it.

Palestinians purposely target civilians.

The majority of civilian casualties caused by Israel are accidental, just as it is with most wars. Have you any idea how many thousands of civilians have been killed in Afghanistan by the American forces? Do some research on it.

I'd really like to see your reaction Oaktowner when your legs get blown off and you'll be wheelin your way around parties for the rest of your life.

I've known my share of hippies, and if you guys can just take your heads out of your fried out asses you might realize what Israel is doing is in self defense.

That's what the Nazis claimed.

The Problem is that you have no idea what really take palce in Isarel / Palestine.

Do you get your news from KPFA ?

For over 7 years (since 1994/1995) 98% of Palestinian population has not been under Isareli occupation.

Every Isareli has to carry an ID.
Every Palestinian has an ID issued by the Palestinian Authority - the body than governed the 98% of Palestinians population over the last 7 years.

The occupation was on it's way out when Palestinian started the intifada - an intifada that even Amnesty Int'l now calls: Crime Against Humanity !

Even if all your fiction was correct - do you agree with collective death Penalty against innocent civilians ?

If so, all americans should have been exceted on the crimes of bush in Afganistan. But I guess when the victims are jews you are willing to justify anything.

Sorry, I did not mean you are racist let's rephrase the last sentnce and make it Politically Correct:

But I guess when the victims are Zionists you are willing to justify anything - Now it is better, as long as you are anti-zionist no one can say you racist.

The Nazi did not claim Self defense.

The nazis wanted to make the world "PURE"

That is exactly what Bin-Laden wants as well

The Nazis wanted to create an ethnically pure state. The Zionists want to create a religiously pure state. The Nazis believed their state was larger than Germany. Many Zionists believe Israel (as a pure Jewish state) should be even larger than just the West Bank and Gaza. The Nazis had policies to "purify" conquered areas by killing people, the Zionists set up settlements and then use the IDF to make life impossible for those living near by in the hope that this will drive them out. The Nazis made people in the Jewish ghettos wear stars of david, the Israeli government requires special identification papers and restricts the movement of Palestinians in the West Bank and Gaza. The Nazis killed many more people directly but the Isralis have been destroying water treatment plants and basic infrastructure which can be genocidal in a similar way.

The scale is different but many of the beliefs are the same.

Nice try, Zionist. The violence of both sides of the "conflict" are not equal. Quit trying to put it in those terms. Palestinian militants are using the tactic of bombings because there are no other means for Palestinians to defend themselves against the racist state of Israel. Israel has driven Palestinians off their land historically and recently continued their policy of ethnic cleansing by using F16s and Tanks on civilians knowingly. It's no accident. It's a part of Israeli strategy, cowardly strategy, I might add. The Palestinians have the right to defend themselves. Suicide bombing is wrong, a waste of life and not productive, in my opinion. But, the Palestinians don't exactly have a military like Israel though, huh?

And to say the Intifada took place at a time when Israel was pulling back is just a distortion of reality. The whole Oslo "peace process" was a sham from the beginning and used by Israel to legally continue their expansionist aims.

History in a nut shell:

http://www.infoclick.org/

Che,
You too take your news from Dennis Bernstein and KPFA ?

What Ethnic Cleansing you are talking about - the Palestinian population is the FASTEST GROWING IN THE WORLD almost 4 per 1000 per year.

In comparison India is 1.56/1000, NIgeria is 2.4/1000

If Isarel, as you claim, would be ethnically cleansing Palestinian the population would be shrinking not growing (like what took place in Esat Timor where hundreds of thousands have been killed by Indionesia or in Tibet where over a Million were killed by Chineese)

You are just buying the BS propeganda that is pread by the Oil Reach Saudis on KPFA and based on that you justify war crimes.

I don't know anything about that. Even if that is true, and I doubt it, it doesn't change the fact that the very founding of the state of Israel was based on the mass expulsion of Palestinians from the region, not to mention the systematic racism that was practiced by Britain and early Zionists in marginalizing the Palestinians from economic life. Presently, the Palestinians are being further brutalized with the Military occupation and offensive. It's no coincidence that Israeli politicians are openly talking about the "transfer" of Palestinians. It quite literally means the forced removal of the Palestinian population from the region since, according to Israel, all Palestinians in some way or another support, harbor and/or are terrorists.

Free Palestine!

Palestine had a tiny population in 1800 in total because of Turkish mismanagement and war.

There were about 200,000 people in all.
It was not a very attractive place. Sawmpss & Maleria in some parts, Sand Dunes and desret in other parts.

Some Palestinians began returning - and some Egyptians as
well in the 19th century, and there was Jewish immigration both from Arab
countries and, later,
when the Turks permitted it, from Europe.

Despite the various hardships imposed by the Turks and local Arabs,
there was a Jewish majority in Jerusalem beginning in the latter half of the
19th century.

A policy of discrimination and objections of local people to immigration, as well as lousy conditions (Reda Mark Twain visit to Jerusalem) kept down the number of Jewish immigrants.

The "objections" of local people to Jews took the form
of peaceful protests to the Turkish government, as well as attacks on Jewish communities and the quaint custom of stoning Jews that has been recounted many times,
and
that was experienced
by my great grandfather of a friend of mine.

So there was a lot of racism and ethnic cleansing against jews in Palestine as well as other places in the world.

During WWI all foreign nationals were rounded up and kicked out. Since most Jews came from Russia and were not
granted Turkish citizenship, this reduced the Jewish population of Palestine by about 20,000-40,000.
During the first 20 years of the mandate, about 400,000 Jews entered Palestine (Leagly) or were born here.
At the same time, immigration from Jordan was not limited or controlled at all by the British until 1938,
and it is probable that a significant (though not overwhelming) number of Arabs entered Palestine as well.
Many who call them self Palestinians came from Syria to work in the Haifa docks and agriculture started by jews.

It is the procperity brought by jews, the drying of swamps that brought Arab migration into Palestine.

The UN partition plan (1947, resolution 181) called for two states - one with a Jewish majority and one with an Arab majority.

The Jewish majority was achieved without any "ethnic cleansing" If you don't believe me, then study Norman Finkelstein, who is an anti-Zionist. His analysis shows that
far from "ethnic cleansing,"
Jewish settlement in Palestine caused a movement of Arabs from the Syria, West Bank and Negev areas into
the Jewish areas where there was more work and better services.

That is one reason why it was difficult to
create a state with a Jewish majority.

The other reason of course was ethnic cleansing and Apartheid practiced by the
British under pressure from the Arabs of Palestine.

In 1939, the British closed Palestine to Jewish
immigration. Jews were also forbidden to purchase land in the West Bank and Galilee beginning in 1940.
These restrictions were imposed because of Arab pressure. Were it not for the 1939 white paper, as well as the
3 year revolt that preceded it, there might have been a clear Jewish majority in Palestine, though it was probably
too late to bring in masses of Jews.
Instead the Jews went up in smoke in Auschwitz, with the help of the Eastern European humanitarians like Ivan Demjanjuk.

If there had been no "ethnic cleasning" and racism in Palestine, there would have been a Jewish majority in Israel a long long time ago and this has nothing to do with any claim by religious jews about God Promises or the bible - this is pure history.

http://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook/index.html

Gaza Strip People Top of Page
Population: 1,178,119 (July 2001 est.)

note: in addition, there are some 6,900 Israeli settlers in the Gaza Strip (August 2000 est.) - they should leave at once (added by Abe)

Population growth rate: 4.01% (2001 est.)
Birth rate: 42.48 births/1,000 population (2001 est.)
Death rate: 4.21 deaths/1,000 population (2001 est.)
Net migration rate: 1.8 migrant(s)/1,000 population (2001 est.)


Comapre to India:


Population growth rate: 1.55% (2001 est.)
Birth rate: 24.28 births/1,000 population (2001 est.)
Death rate: 8.74 deaths/1,000 population (2001 est.)
Net migration rate: -0.08 migrant(s)/1,000 population (2001 est.)

So Palestinian birth rate is twice then India, Death rate is half than India and there is a positive net migration into Gaza Strip - this is not Ethnic Cleansing !

Nigeria:

Growth rate: 2.61% (2001 est.)
Birth rate: 39.69 births/1,000 population (2001 est.)
Death rate: 13.91 deaths/1,000 population (2001 est.)
Net migration rate: 0.28 migrant(s)/1,000 population (2001 est

If the CIA site would recognize Tibet and East Timor as independent countries (like it does on Gaza) you will see how Ethnic Cleansing really look like:
Hundrdes of Thousands of dead, 50% population decline over few years.

Bottom Line: What Dennis Bernstein cries and yells on KPFA is BS

More Jewish people immigrated to the US and other countries and places rather than settle in the region of Palestine and become pawns of the Zionist project. And to say that Palestinians weren't living there and sustaining themselves in credible number historically is just an outright lie. The fact of the matter is that Britian, as the first imperialist sponsor of Israel, favored early Zionist settlers economically, financially and politically. Early Zionists settlers physically fought with and prevented Palestinian merchants and workers from competing in economic life.

And the passing of the UN resolution coincided with an Israel land grab. It gave cover for Israel's colonial aims.

Che,
I am a supporter of a free Palestinian state in the West bank and Gaza. That is my political view. I do not let in interfer with the facts:

Britain indeed was a colonial power, it divided the Middle East. The Arabs got several states: Saudi Arabia, Lebanon, Iraq later they wanted Syria and in exchnge for this they accpeted that Palestine (with both Jewish and Palestinian population) will become the jewsih home land. The British later reversed that (during the 30s) and prefered the Arabs and at the end left and let the parties fight it out.

You want to know more, here is a site edited by both Palestinian and Israeli historians:


http://www.mideastweb.org/timeline.htm

http://www.mideastweb.org/briefhistory.htm

AMNESTY INTERNATIONAL
PRESS RELEASE
News Flash
AI Index: MDE 15/125/2002 (Public)

31 July 2002

Berkley: Amnesty International condemns attack on university campus


Amnesty International condemned today's bomb attack, claimed by Hamas, at the Hebrew University in Jerusalem, in which at least seven people were killed and some 85 people injured. According to Hamas, today's attack was carried out in retaliation for the Israeli army air strike on Gaza last week, which killed 15 people, including nine children and a leader of Hamas's military wing.

"Attacks on civilians are never justified," Amnesty International said. "We reiterate our call on the leadership of all Palestinian armed groups to end attacks on civilians immediately."

Background

Amnesty International has recently published a report on attacks against civilians. The report Without distinction -- attacks on civilians by Palestinian armed groups documents 128 attacks in which more than 350 civilians, most of them Israeli, were killed since the beginning of the Al-Aqsa intifada in September 2000.

For more information please see:
http://web.amnesty.org/ai.nsf/recent/MDE020032002!Open

For further information on Israel/Occupied Territories visit:
http://web.amnesty.org/web/web.nsf/pages/iot_home


Public Document
****************************************
For more information please call Amnesty International's press office in London, UK, on +44 20 7413 5566
Amnesty International, 1 Easton St., London WC1X 0DW. web: http://www.amnesty.org

For latest human rights news view http://news.amnesty.org

Its easy for people in the US to condemn violence by the Palestinians but asymetric warfare is all they have.

There were several hundred thousand Palestinians living in what is now Israel before WWI. Before the young Turk rebellion there are no recorded cases of antiSemitic acts by Palestinians (even thouh Zionists were already settling and trying to create Jewish only areas) Now, Palestinians are living in a state which does not recognize them as citizens or even humans; they are humiliated by their occupiers and killed by the thousands while the press only makes a big deal when Israeli nationals die.

While AI feels the necessity to condemn violence on both sides in Israel would they do the same for groups rising up to fight tyrany in Tibet, Iraq or Burma?

If you want to compare someone to nazi you choose well. In March 1988 Sadam Hussain gassed an Iraqi village in Curdish area of Iraq. 8000 people were killed in that one attack - this is comperable to numbers of jews the Nazi have killed in a day. Like the jewish victims of the Nazis the Kurdish suffer to this day, there are 10 times more cancer rates in this village and 14 times more miscarrige cases. This was only one such attack out of many but it was the biggest.

China record on what it did in Tibet is as bad: over a million tibetian have been killed.

AI condem violence. By the way the UN report on Jenin is out and it clearly sais: NO MASSACRE TOOK PLACE. it also confirmed that for years while UNDER UN AND PA RULR THE JENIN CAMP HAS BEEN USED AS A TERRORIST CAMP (this was many years after Isareli occupation in the camp has ended on 1995)

Your accusations of Isarel are based on Propeganda, antisemotism and ignorance - go and find out what really takes place.

History

The need of settling the “Yesha”{Judea-Shomron- Aza} territories and the indignation crisis after the Yom Kippur war engendered the “Gush Emonim” establishment. The first tentative started in “Yesha” and after the first settlements followed - Ofra, Kedumim and Maale Adumim. After other settlements added to. The settlements’ subsistence and their expansion need, entailed a “ settlement movement” creation, similar to the old ones.

In 1978 Amana was created – The “Gush Emonim colonization movement. Amana is the only colonization movement with offices in Jerusalem.

Missions

1 – Settlements’ establishment – “Amana” together with other associations is preparing the colonization program and is providing for their realization as per the politic conditions.

2 - Colonization’ cores establishment - the movement is supporting groups to get themselves organized into colonization’ cores, consolidate them socially and accompany them till the settlement’ establishment and also after it.

3 – Settlements accompaniment – Amana is accompanying the settlements and assist them with other agents contacts such as regional council, institutions, government offices. The movement is preparing the settlement to an independent management and hopes and helps it to develop social, financial and organized life.

4 – Immigration absorption - Amana is guiding the settlements to the national mission : immigration absorption from the all world, (Amana was also a partner in the Russian immigration) support and assist them in preparing the immigration framework, financial assistance, social care etc. In each Amana settlement there are new immigrants from different countries.

5 – Turning people towards colonization - Amana is amplifying the public awareness on colonization importance in Yesha through explanations, advertisements and marketing, and sustains, a consultation and information center, follow up to each appeal for colonization and for each Yesha settlement”: 1-800-260-240

6 – Construction department - Amana with the help of its subsidiary company “bar Amana buildings” is creating a building project in the settlement under its care. The construction is using the concentrated building system or the system” batey aguda” The principal line of this activity is to build a high quality level house, but not showy, art a reasonable fitting the dwellers requirements. The target: a wide and constant population in the different colonization areas. There are 2000 housing units already built in the two ways building system.

Objects and characteristics

In the face of the expected population increment and the jam in the lowland and the coasts, the Amana principal object is to settle the mountain areas which are the Israeli people only grounds reserve and their preservation is an existence condition.

In Yesha and in the Golan there are 160 settlement, 70 of them are members of Amana. Three Amana settlements were established in the Galil and one in the Negev, most of the Amana settlements are rural and have about 200 families each. The others are bigger settlements with hundreds of families. In the settlements there are educational, cultural and spiritual institutions, schools, ulpanot, yeshivot, midrashot, cultural and sport centers etc.

The Amana movement is a movement for all Israel. In its settlements are living new immigrants and sabras, young and old, seculars and religious. There are settlements where Amana built a framework with secular and religious together, with the same goal: to give their children a Jewish education in a common school.
http://www.amana.co.il/amana/site/


[this link is from a while back(last year?), the link doesn't work anymore]

http://www.internadlan.com/amana/otniel/
Following a recent expansion program, Otniel is now ready to consider applications by religious families of all ages and socio-economic groups. All applicants must be interviewed and are subject to acceptance and aapproval by the Otniel New Residents Committee.

The homes of Otniel are marketed by Amana - Gush Emunim Settlement Movement and the Otniel settlement. Amana is the settlement arm of Gush Emmunim and is responsible for developing and expanding over 100 settlements in Judea, Samaria and the Gaza Region.

Families purchasing or building their homes in Otniel are entitled to special mortgages and loans totaling up to $56,000. Of these mortgages and loans, approximately $21,000 are automatically converted into a grant (forgiven) if the family continues to reside in Otniel for 15 years.

First of all, regarding the Amnesty International Press release that so many Israeli supporters are waving around like a badge of honor, realize that almost daily Amnesty International publicly condemns the violations of international law that Israel continues to pursue in their occupation of Palestine and the resultant inhumane treatment of Palestinian civilians.

The number of statements and requests for inquisitions of Israel that AI makes far outnumber anything they have mentioned about Palestinian attacks. But on that tip, I don't think anyone here would advocate such violence. I know I don't personally, and I haven't met anyone that says that such killings are a good thing. To understand this fully however you must realize a number of things. One, as someone pointed out earlier is that Palestine has no army to fight for it. No means for defense other than the hapless suicide bomber against an insanely sophisticated military power armed to the teeth at the expense of the US taxpayer.

John Q. Public chose to foot the bill for this military operation, and that's exactly what it is. People can cry all they want about how Israel must 'protect herself' but they need to be reminded that prior to the failed Oslo Accords there were no cases of suicide bombings. Only after repeatedly being jerked around in the political theater that never failed to promise a fair compromise but always failed to deliver, did militant groups such as Hamas arise and attempt to take the fight for freedom into their own hands.

Hence the reason why many consider these people to be freedom fighters and not just common terrorists. When civilians are targetted it's a horrible thing and I don't condone it at all. I think anyone with a heart would agree to this, but in the same breath you must also compare the might of an organized military and a covert grassroots movement of people fighting an encroaching settler population. Again, I reiterate that I'm not standing up for violence against civilians but I understand that there is much more depth and gray area involved than either side of the conflict would have you believe. Still, the bottom line, and the resounding premise upon which most Palestinian supporters unite is that none of this violence and bloodshed would be commonplace today if Israel was not violating the humanitarian rights of these people in such a vile and genocidial manner. It's truely sickening...

Don't believe me? Ask some of the people that have been to Palestine. Average Americans who go to see for themselves and make up their mind while out there on the ground without any prior affiliation to either side of this conflict. Better yet, make a trip yourself.

And now a little more about Amnesty International postings:

There are a great number of Israeli soldiers who refuse to be a part of the military action against Palestinians on the basis of moral disagreement. This has been known for quite sometime but coincidentally, just recently AI posted about this very matter on their 'take action' page. Direct from their website:

"Conscientious Objectors - updated 29/07/02
Amnesty International is concerned about the increasing number of Israeli soldiers and reservists detained because of their refusal to perform their military service.Take Action"

Additionally, a statistic I see used often in this debate without any perspective to provide reference to is as follows (taken from AI):

"Killing of Israeli civilians
Since 29 September 2000, 311 Israeli civilians including 53 children have been killed in suicide bomb and other attacks carried out by members of Palestinian armed groups and individuals."

This is certainly a tragic matter indeed. Civilians and children don't deserve this violent bloodshed thrust upon them as the political theater of war boils hotter and hotter. Nonetheless in order to put this statistic in perspective you must also ask yourself how many casualties the other side has suffered. Well I'll tell you:

Keep in mind that the above 311 Israeli deaths are from September 2000 to our current date (well more accurately, very near to it), a period spanning roughly two years.

On the Palestinian side there were 282 civilians killed of which 66 were children. This statistic covers ONLY the period of September 29th, 2000 to December 17th, 2000 a period spanning just over one month and a half.

311 Israeli civilian deaths in 24 months compared to 282 Palestinian civilian deaths in just 1.5 months. Clearly the math doesn't add up. People that try to say the violence is equal on both sides would have you believe that up is down and down is up.

Don't believe the hype.

peace

Someone argued here that anti-semitism has only started during the 1900s. This is not true. Antisemitism (such as the famous blood libel case in Damasecus in 1840) existed long before zionism:

members.tripod.com/JCRelations/blood.html


Blood Libel - A History of Groundless Anti-Semitic Fables

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Quotation from a deluded, American, 19th century Vice-consul:

"A most barbarous secret for a long time suspected in the Jewish nation...at last came to light in the city of Damascus, that of serving themselves of Christian blood in their unleavened bread...a secret which these 1840 years must have made many unfortunate victims." Jasper Chasseaud, US vice-consul, Beirut, Lebanon, 1840 CE.



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The Blood Libel Myth:
Fables surround us. Almost everyone has heard of zombies, but it is incredibly difficult (perhaps impossible) to find a person who has actually seen one. It is said that millions of people have seen UFOs. But nobody seems to have actually taken a clear, detailed picture of one. Many people have heard of the full-size alligators living in the New York City sewer system, but nobody seems to have come across one first-hand. Fables also exist in the religious field. Perhaps the most common, and probably the most long-lasting and hurtful is the "Blood Libel" myth.
Blood Libel is the accusation by "religious group A" that "religious group B" is committing unbelievably despicable acts of ritual murder. Typically, the story contains a number of riveting details:

a victim is kidnapped by members of "religious group B."
the victim is usually an innocent person. An infant, young child or a blond teenage virgin girl are typical.
the victim may be abused or tortured. They are ritually killed in order to meet the requirements of the perpetrator's religion.
in an act of cannibalism, the victim's body is eaten and/or the blood is consumed.
obscene sexual orgies (sometimes involving incest) are held during or after the ritual.

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Blood Libel Accusations Against Jews:
In 1144 CE, an unfounded rumor began in eastern England, that Jews had kidnapped a Christian child, tied him to a cross, stabbed his head to simulate Jesus' crown of thorns, killed him, drained his body completely of blood, and mixed the blood into matzohs (unleavened bread) at time of Passover. The rumor arose from a former Jew, Theobald, who had become a Christian monk. He said that Jewish representatives gathered each year in Narbonne, France. They decided in which city a Christian child would be sacrificed. The boy became known as St. William of Norwich. Many people made pilgrimages to his tomb and claimed that miracles had resulted from appeals to St. William. The myth shows a complete lack of understanding of Judaism. Aside from the prohibition of killing innocent persons, the Torah specifically forbids the drinking or eating of any form of blood in any quantity. However, reality never has had much of an impact on blood libel myths. This rumor lasted for many centuries; even today it has not completely disappeared. (7)
Pope Innocent IV ordered a study in 1247 CE.. The investigators found that the myth was a Christian invention used to persecute the Jews. At least 4 other popes subsequently vindicated the Jews. However, the accusations, trials and executions continued.

Nicholls (10) reports that "there are 150 recorded cases of the charge of ritual murder, and many led to massacres of the Jews of the place."

Some of the incidents were:

1144 CE: Jews in Norwich, England were accused of the ritual murder; Jewish leaders in the area were executed.
1171: Jews in Blois, France were accused of ritual murder. All of the Jews in that town (34 men, 17 women) were tortured and burned alive. A second source says that 31 were killed.
1181: More accusations at Bury, St. Edmund, England
1183: More accusations in Bristol, England
1192: More accusations in Winchester, England
1244: London Jews were accused of ritual murder and fined heavily.
1250: Jews in Saragossa, spain, were accused of ritually killing a child, San Domenichino de Val.
1255: The body of a little boy, Hugh, was found in a cesspool near the house of a Jew in Lincoln, England. He was tortured, confessed that he had engaged in ritual murder, dragged through the streets, and finally hung. 100 Jews were transported to London and charged with ritual murder. One was acquitted; 2 were pardoned; the rest were hanged, either with or without a trial.
1283-5: Following a series of ritual murder charges, 10 Jews were murdered by a mob in Mainz; 26 were executed in Bacharach, 40 in Oberwellil, and 180 in Munich.
1431: After ritual murder charges, several Jewish communities were destroyed in southern Germany: Ravensburg, Uberlingen and Lindau.
1451: Pope Nicholas V appointed John of Capistrano to organize the Inquisition of the Jews. John repeated the old charges of ritual murder and host desecration.
1541: John Eck, a Roman Catholic writer, wrote a pamphlet "Refutation of a Jewish Book." He repeated the ritual murder and host desecration myths.
1840: An elderly Italian monk-priest, Padre Tommaso, disappeared in Damascus, Syria, after having visited the Jewish quarter in the city. 12 Jewish leaders were arrested and tortured. Four died from the mistreatment; most of the rest confessed involvement in a ritual murder. (4)
1870's: "With the rise of the modern antisemitic movement in the late 1870s, the traditional blood accusation merged easily with the new scientific racial arguments, serving as a lowest common denominator to unite its secular (and often anti-Christian), Catholic, and Protestant members." (4). Roman Catholic Bishop Martin of Pederborn, Germany, wrote that Jews ritually murdered Christian children.
1881: A Roman Catholic journal, Civilta Cattolica, started a series of articles which attempted to prove that ritual murder was an integral element of the Jewish religion. They argued that the ritual murders occurred at Purim rather than Passover. "It is in vain that Jews seek to slough off the weight of argument against them: the mystery has become known to all." (Not quite all. Historians have rejected the stories of blood libel as myth.) (4)
1911-3: An allegation of ritual murder, the Beilis case, surfaced in Kiev, Russia. The story formed the plot of novel, "The Fixer" by Bernard Malamud.
1930's +: Hitler re-used the blood-libel myth as justification for the Holocaust. The Nazi periodical, Der Stürmer, often published special issues devoted to allegations of ritual murder by Jews. Hitler had asked that a film be made of the 1840 Damascus case. World War II ended before it could be made.

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Host Desecration:
The host is a wafer used during the Roman Catholic mass. At a certain point during the ritual, it is believed to be converted into the actual body of Jesus Christ, just as the wine becomes Jesus' actual blood. These elements of the mass are then eaten by the believers.
A variation of the blood libel myth developed in Europe early in the 11th century. Instead of accusing the Jews of killing an innocent child, they were accused of desecrating the host. Sometimes they were accused stabbing pins into the host, or of stepping on it. Other times, they were accused of stabbing the host with a knife until Jesus' blood leaked out. Sometimes, they were accused of nailing the host, in a symbolic replay of the crucifixion.

Like the blood libel myth, host desecration makes no logical sense. Being Jews, they would not believe in the Christian doctrine of transubstantiation - that the host during mass becomes the actual body of Jesus. To them, the host is just a simple wafer with no religious significance.

Nicholls (10) reports that "100 instances of the charge have been recorded, in many cases leading to massacres." Some of the incidents were:

1021: Rome suffered through both an earthquake and hurricane on Good Friday of that year. Some Jews were charged with having caused the disaster driving a nail through a stolen host. They were tortured until they confessed; they were then burned alive.
1215: The Fourth Lateran Council in Rome declared the belief in transubstantiation. This established the theological basis for the host desecration myth.
1243: All Jews in Berlitz, Germany were burned alive for allegedly torturing a stolen host (8)
1308: The Bishop of Strasbourg charged Jews in Sulzmatt and Rufach with host desecration. They were burned alive.
1370: Jews in Brabant, Belgium, were accused of defiling the host and were burned alive. (6)
1389: Jews in Prague were accused of attacking a monk carrying a wafer. All of the Jews in the city were offered the choice of conversion to Christianity or death. They were all killed.(8)
1399: A rabbi and 13 elders in Posen, Poland, were charged with stabbing the host and tossing it into a pit. They were slowly roasted to death. Some townspeople believed that the host had bled.
Unlike the basic Blood Libel myth, rumors of host desecration by Jews appear to have died out in the Middle Ages. It has surfaced recently, during the mid-1990's. In at least two Roman Catholic cathedrals (one in Ontario, Canada and another in Mississippi) some parishioners believed that Satanists were masquerading as church members, attending mass but not swallowing the host. They believed that it was later taken from the cathedral and used in Satanic rituals.

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Other Groundless Anti-Semitic Fables:
693-4 CE: At the 16th & 17th church Councils of Toledo charged Jews with undermining the church, massacring Catholics, etc.
829: St. Agobard, The Archbishop of Lyon, said that Jews were kidnapping Christian children and selling them to the Arabs.
1130: Jews in London were accused of killing a sick man. They were fined 1 million marks.
1321: Jews were charged of arranging with criminals to poison fountains in Guienne, France. 5,000 Jews were burned alive.
1347+: The Bubonic Plague, a.k.a. the Black Death, struck Europe in 1347. Jews were accused of poisoning wells (or planning to do this) in France, Spain, Switzerland, and elsewhere. In excess of 20,000 were murdered across Europe.

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References:
"A Calendar of Jewish Persecution," at "HearNow," a Messianic Judaism web site. See: http://www.hearnow.org/caljp.htm
"Classical and Christian Anti-Semitism," at: http://www.virtualjerusalem.co.il/education/education/holocaust/guide/chap3/chap.html
Jasper Chasseaud, Letter to John Forsyth (1840-MAR-24, no. 12), microfilm 367, State Department archives, U.S. National Archives. Quoted in (4)
Jonathan Frankel, "'Ritual Murder' in the Modern Era: The Damascus Affair of 1840," Jewish Social Studies Volume 3, Number 2, at: http://www.indiana.edu/~iupress/journals/jss-art3.html#r4
Paul Johnson, "A History of Christianity," Atheneum, New York, NY, (1976), Page 490
Edward Vanhoutte, "Importance and unimportance of the Jews of Belgium from the Middle Ages to the Enlightenment," at: http://pcger17.uia.ac.be/JEWS.html
M.I. Dimont, "Jews, God and History," Mentor Books, Revised edition, (1994), Page 235. You can buy this book from Amazon.com bookstore
Wildwoman, at: http://www.loop.com/~bramble/famous.html#anchor585978
Arnold Leese, "Jewish Ritual Murder," Nazi propaganda by the "Father of British National Socialism." Available from Renaissance Press, a Neo-Nazi group at: http://home.onestop.net/rpress/index.html
William Nichol, "Christian Antisemitism: A History of Hate," Aronson, (1995).
This page originally found at: Religious Tolerance web site.

Soul,

No doubt that GushEmunin/Emuna and all setllers should be evaquated and sent back to Israel.

You are talking about Freedom fighters who resist occupation. Isarel has not been occupying Jenin for over 7 years (since 1994 or 1995) and a Hugh terror infrastructure was built there (Read the UN report that came out today)

You must listen to what "Freedom fighters" in Arabic not just english.

The Hammas spokesman Rantisi in English:

Our Resistance will continue until the End of the Occupation

And In Arabic:

Our Resistence will continue until all the jews will go back to the countries they came from.

In short, they want to destroy a country that existed for over 50 years and was established based on UN resolutions, so they use war crimes to achive it. This is wrong.

PALESTINIAN AUTHORITY: Fear of torture/legal concern/possible prisoner of conscience

PUBLIC, AI Index: MDE 21/010/2002, UA 207/02

8 July 2002

Khaidar Ghanem was arrested in the Gaza Strip on 3 July by the Palestinian Preventative Security forces. He is being held in incommunicado detention in Tel al-Hawa prison in Gaza. He is at risk of torture or ill-treatment. There are also concerns that he may not receive a fair trial if he is charged and brought to court.

As a human rights field researcher for the Israeli human rights organization B'Tselem, Khaidar Ghanem collects testimonies from Palestinian residents in the Rafah area of the Gaza Strip, where he also lives. In the course of his work, Ghanem may have uncovered information that could cause discomfort to the Palestinian Authority.

He has apparently been accused of being a "collaborator", but it is feared he has been arrested in connection with his work for B'Tselem, possibly in order to deter other human rights workers from carrying out their legitimate work.

BACKGROUND INFORMATION
Palestinians suspected of "collaboration" with Israel have frequently been arrested, held incommunicado and tortured by the Palestinian Authority security services. Scores of suspected "collaborators" are believed to be detained, without charge or trial, in the areas under the Palestinian Authority (PA) in Gaza and the West Bank.

Many of those accused of "collaboration" by the Palestinian Authority have been held without charge or trial for up to seven years. Others have been sentenced to death by the Palestinian State Security Court in grossly unfair trials which violate the fundamental principles of due process.

RECOMMENDED ACTION:

Please send appeals to arrive as quickly as possible, in English, Arabic or your own language:

- expressing concern for the safety of Khaidar Ghanem, and asking the authorities to ensure he is not tortured or ill-treated in custody;
- asking for Khaidar Ghanem to be immediately and unconditionally released if he is not to be promptly charged with a recognizable criminal offence;
- expressing concern that Khaidar Ghanem is being held incommunicado, and reminding the Palestinian authorities that while he is in custody, he has the right of access to his lawyer and family;
- calling on the authorities to investigate reports that other detainees have been tortured or ill-treated during interrogation, and urging the authorities to ensure that all those in detention are treated according to international standards.

APPEALS TO:

President Yasser Arafat
The President's Office, Gaza,
Palestinian Authority
Telegrams: President Arafat, Gaza, Palestinian Authority
Fax: + 972 8 2 822 159
Salutation: Dear President Arafat

Freih Abu Middein
Minister of Justice
P O Box 1021
Gaza
Palestinian Authority
Telegrams: Justice Minister, Gaza, Palestinian Authority
Fax: + 972 8 286 7109 (it may be difficult to get through, but please keep trying)
Salutation: Dear Minister

Abd el Razik Yihya
Minister of the Interior
Palestinian Authority
Telegrams: Interior Minister, Gaza, Palestinian Authority
Fax: + 972 2 2400668
Salutation: Dear Minister

COPIES TO:
B'Tselem
The Israeli Information Center for Human Rights in the Occupied Territories
8 Hata'asiya St.
Jerusalem 93420
Israel
Fax: + 972 2 6749111

and to diplomatic representatives of the Palestinian Authority accredited to your country.

PLEASE SEND APPEALS IMMEDIATELY. Check with the International Secretariat, or your section office, if sending appeals after 19 August 2002.

With the exception of a few who have some decentsy and common sense - the people on this site are either racist pro-Arabs, fascists, anti-semites, or just plain idiots. I have no arguments to make, just to say that the words I hear coming from my fellow Americans make me sick. I'm not racist and I don't hate Arabs, but the arguments I hear in favor of them are so poorly written and researched that I begin to understand why so many Americans are biased against Israel.

As unfortunate as it is, one day we're going to have bus-stop and restaurant bombings by the same people most of you are defending.

Shame on all of you, not for believing in what you believe, but for your ignorance.

You better tell the US govt., the govt. you work for, to stop training and funding them. The did it in the cold war and currently Indonesia comes to mind. Your lovely govt. just agreed to start refunding Indonesia again. The Indonesian military and govt. has very close ties to Muslim fundamentalists, including al Qaeda. Guess the US just can't stop playing the hypocrite, huh?

As far as US citizens being biased against Israel, I'd say the US population supports Israel right now, as superficial as that support is. And, furthermore, though anti-semitism exists in the US, it's not Jewish people who are being rounded up right now in the US. It's Arabs and Latinos.

Busy wasting our tax dollars I see, all while lecturing us....waht a joke.

Do you really work for Nasa ?

Do something that we do not have to continue using OIL. OIl is the biggest threat the human rights on this planet:
- Air Polution
- Pestecides
- Global warming
- poor human rights in Arab countries
- no incentive for Arab goverments to educate thye keep their people ignorant by focusing on Islam because they have no need to modernize
- Oil Money to saudi Arabia and Iraq funds world terrorism

So instead of telling us what we know work on Fuel Cells - Nasa have been using them back in the 70s why aren't they cheaper by now ?

You don't see Westerners and Israelis doing this when civilians are killed:

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/storydisplay.cfm?storyID=2347307

Come to room 26 in building 245 at Moffett Field... you'll find me putting my time in, earning next to nothing, trying to save your world from global warming and ozone depletion. As for Muslism fundamentalist, they're all religious fanatics who don't do a damn for the world or themselves, and with their jealous rage of other countries successes (mainly Israel) go out and murder many innocent people by commiting suicide. I don't hate their race, but I think that the world would be MUCH better off without them.

"People on this site are shit"

then you are poo too

Such joy have not been seen since Sep 11

Thousands in Gaza celebrate Jerusalem attack

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/storydisplay.cfm?storyID=2347307

01.08.2002
11.45am
GAZA - About 10,000 Palestinians handed out sweets, sang songs and
chanted anti-Israeli slogans as they marched through Gaza city on
Wednesday to celebrate the bombing that killed seven people at
Jerusalem's Hebrew University.

The rally was organised by the Islamic movement Hamas, which said it
carried out the attack to avenge an Israeli air strike on Gaza last
week that killed its military commander Salah Shehada and 14 others,
including nine children.

"The price of the Israeli crime to assassinate the leader Salah
Shehada is more than 100 Israeli soldiers and that will come in 10
martyrs' operations (suicide attacks)," the military wing of Hamas,
the Izz el-Deen al-Qassam brigades, said in a statement read through
a loudspeaker.

"We give this gift to the soul of Sheikh Salah Shehada and we say to
the al-Qassam brigades we are waiting for more," a voice shouted
through a loudspeaker.

Hamas regards most Israelis as soldiers because most are conscripted
at the age of 18 and serve annually in military reserve units.

The marchers walked past one of Shehada's family's homes and many
knelt and prayed for revenge. They described Wednesday's bombing
as "a gift to the soul" of Shehada and "a march of joy".

The marchers waved Hamas flags and included a large number of
children who clapped and laughed. Palestinians often hand out sweets
in such celebration marches.

In the Balata refugee camp near the West Bank city of Nablus, dozens
of people staged a rally chanting slogans of support for Wednesday's
attack.

Eight masked men set fire to an effigy of Israeli Prime Minister
Ariel Sharon. Another group of men carried a model of a Qassam
rocket -- the type used by Hamas.

Israel accused Shehada of masterminding a series of suicide bombings
against Israelis in the 22-month-old Palestinian uprising against
Israeli occupation in the Gaza Strip and the West Bank.

- REUTERS

"If Berkeley were creating 'settlements' in San Francisco for only Berkley residents, making roads where only Berkeley residents could go (say, taking over the Bay Bridge, too), taking San Francisco's water, puttiing Berkeley cops all over San Francisco..."

Who do you think lived in California before the white land thieves came from europe? You did all that and more.

And who was there before the indians ?, since we're talking about history. And who and who . . . ?

Palestinians have no rightful claim on the land they send babys to graves for. Palestinians/Arabs, hate children, their own, their neighbors, yours and mine.
American indians and American citizens do not hate their children or your children.

I was trying to make the point clear, and it was a fictional account, but you are right. In another posting where I posted that fiction I *did* mention Native Americans, who are actually much more equivalent to the current Palestinian situation. I'm in the middle of Since Predator Came, so I'm still learning.

Well, okay, saying I’m right is not enough. The situation of Native Americans is nothing like the one of the Palestinians. For starters, white Europeans never lived in North America until the colonization started, Jews have populated "Palestine" for five thousand years, long long before the "Palestinians" came from Jordan and Egypt (You do know Arafat was born in Egypt, don't you?). Who do you think build Jerusalem? Hebron? Zefat? No one can deny that Judaism started where modern Israel resides.

Dear friends,
Come visit me in my Jerusalem home. I've lived here for 16 years having come to the Holy Land from the US. We will be able to communicate only when you see what it is really about by coming to Israel. Before you do, you are, at least to a degree, uninformed, and therefore unqualified to pass judgment. You are swallowing the biased views of the press. Come, but be prepared to vomit up misconceptions. I promise you an eye-opening tour. Don't be afraid. My brother had an appointment in the World Trade Center on 9/11, but the guy from Cantor Fitzgerald pushed it off til the afternoon. No place is safe. Come to the Holy Land. It's as safe even safer than anywhere else.
Be in touch.
Daniel