Meanwhile in Oakland after the Raiders game

Avery wrote the subject line Meanwhile in Oakland after the Raiders game and then Avery declared If this happened at the anti-war demonstrations, we'd have rubber bullets and tear gas on our hands!

Well maybe not on your hands Avery, maybe your backsides and your eyes.

Then Avery pitched his billboard image and wrote Picture this.

A billboard, with a scene from Hegenberger Road or International Boulevard in Oakland last night, where Raiders fans celebrated their hometown victory and entry into the Superbowl by overturning cars, setting them on fire, and even torching an auto repair shop.

Billboard okay.

Avery: Then picture the caption:
"IF IT WEREN'T FOR SPORTS, THEY'D BE OVERTHROWING THE GOVERNMENT. - ESPN"

My caption would be:
IF IT WEREN'T FOR SPORTS, THEY'D BE RAPING CHILDREN, MUGGING OLD PEOPLE, PUSHING DRUGS, ROBBING BANKS, DOING DRIVE-BY SHOOTINGS AND PIMPING THEIR GIRL FRIENDS.

Here's the way I see it Avery — the Raider Riots remind both of us of how close the barbarian line is at any moment, especially in Governor Moonbeam's City of Oakland with its skyrocketing murder rate. I'm not persuaded by doom and gloom class warfare arguments, the real cause is not race or economics or anger with the government, the real cause is the inferior quality of Oakland culture. The same thing happened in Detroit after the 1984 World Series of Baseball, just like it happens in the urban centers of socialist Britain and Europe after soccer matches.

Either you are right, and sports is keeping the people of Oakland from perpetrating the menu of iniquities with which you charge them - in which case you would have no crimes to bemoan....

Or, sports is not keeping them from doing those things, and therefore my claim is still possible.

It was just a joke anyway. I'm well aware that the hypermarketed theme surrounding football will probably lead many of its fans headlong into the trap of militaristic fervor outlined by the saying: "those who can be made to believe absurdities can be made to commit atrocities".

When the Black Bloc and the Black Hole unite, we'll OWN this town.

What will the people in Oaktown do when the Raiders get beat in the Super Bowl? I know what I'm going to do. Rag the hell outta someone.

Seriously... if lefties didnt look down on normal people and spit on things like football which are a core part of our lives, upbringing, who we are, etc ... well then, maybe normal people would care about your "plan" for the working class. Or actually maybe the working class has its own plans and hopefully will execute bureaucrats in the inevitable revolution against the ruling and bourgeoise and bureaucrat classes.

VIVA LOS RAIDERS!
VIVA LA REVOLUCION!

"the real cause is the inferior quality of Oakland culture."

How would you know when you're too terrified to set foot in it?

"Governor Moonbeam's City of Oakland"

If you'd spent any time in Oakland you'd know that jerry isn't about moonbeams, he's about turning over housing and opportunity to the rich and creating a police state. He's stripping the city of the poor as fast as he can. He's had the military training for urban combat in Oakland, is creating military schools, and tried to use the murder rate as an excuse to hire a hundred more cops - no prevention there - while meanwhile the schools are falling apart. If anything, the so-called moonbeam is trying to turn Oakland into a police state.

"I'm not persuaded by doom and gloom class warfare arguments"

Why should you be? You're a moron.

Worked in manhattan. Pleasantly bum free..Low murder rate. Ends justify the means..Remember all the bitching about guiliani at first..It's great now..

Flip title with name, oops

http://www.bothways.com/tr/music/eddie/pitd.htm

(snip)

. . . the reds and the blacks and the criminals
Prostitutes, pansies and punks
Football hooligans, juvenile delinquents
Lesbians and left wing scum . . .

(snip)

The TA wrote Give it up after I wrote "the real cause is the inferior quality of Oakland culture." — whereupon The TA's psychotic, flight of fantasy response was to invent a "fact" with a bogus question How would you know when you're too terrified to set foot in it? — Now I have to say, no I don't live in Oakland, but, the TA doesn't know where I set my foot anywhere, let alone where and how often I set my foot in Oakland (Frequently, I know of that which I speak). It appears now that The TA's method of connecting the dots is to insert the dots himself — a common trait of conspiracy theorists and would-be political pointilists.

Then The TA rambled on — quoting my line "Governor Moonbeam's City of Oakland" — retaliating with a haughty swish of The TA skirt saying — If you'd spent any time in Oakland you'd know that jerry isn't about moonbeams, he's about turning over housing and opportunity to the rich and creating a police state. He's stripping the city of the poor as fast as he can. He's had the military training for urban combat in Oakland, is creating military schools, and tried to use the murder rate as an excuse to hire a hundred more cops - no prevention there - while meanwhile the schools are falling apart. If anything, the so-called moonbeam is trying to turn Oakland into a police state. — that's right TA that's why Governor Moonbeam is the moonbeam and that's why he's a perennial favorite of progressive elitists and their street lumpenproletariat.

But! — That's not all! — The TA on a roll, quoted me again — "I'm not persuaded by doom and gloom class warfare arguments" — which caused The TA to flaunt his/hers/its verbal superiority and moral turpitude with more progressive gibberish by asking Why should you be? You're a moron.

After reading a few more of The TA's posts I began to muse that The TA could be a COINTELPRO apparatchik — after The TA left a few dots here and there.

In thread "if We Can Stop This War, We Could Stop Any War" — The TA impersonated FBI COINTELPRO apparatchik that were already impersonating other FBI COINTELPRO apparatchik and attempted to create fog by posting — Wow Richard and then wrote standard TA drivel and nonsense — You sound like you're in love with Mike. Is this true?

The TA's disruptive style also includes — wow, another idiot. — Chris is a moron — and an attack on the very annoying Mike with — More on Mikey.

Voila! Now, as far as The TA being a COINTELPRO type I am not alone in my suspicions — consider what miner's canary the LIAR wrote in TA LIAR — TA I KNOW WHO YOU ARE AND I KNOW WHO YOU WORK FOR. Dont pretend to be with my cause you decietfull government employee

Of course, COINTELPRO has been replaced by new bowls of government alphabet soup, but it can still accelerate heart beats, elevate blood pressure and pop sweat on upper lips in the progressive politburos. See COINTELPRO.

"the TA doesn't know where I set my foot anywhere"

I don't have to, you give yourself away with your tone and choice of words. Interesting that you should use the word psychotic . . . .

My advice? Leave Oakland alone and go trash your own city.

Avery, in discussing the anti-war demonstrations, Raider Riots and Oakland's inferior culture, you had written If this happened at the anti-war demonstrations, we'd have rubber bullets and tear gas on our hands! — I don't think there were rubber bullets, but I think I saw TV footage of police using tear gas in Oakland after the Raider victory.

Then you wrote; Or, sports is not keeping them from doing those things, and therefore my claim is still possible. — I guess we can both be right — because, whereas "those things were"; "raping children, mugging old people, pushing drugs, robbing banks, doing drive-by shootings and pimping their girlfriends" — I can see now that the barbarians only temporarily suspend those activities while attending Raider games — which makes the case for midnight basketball, 24/7 adult day care centers and Raider games around the clock.

In other Raider Riot news, I guess that TA the COINTELPRO mudslinger doesn't like Moonbeam Brown either, for different reasons.

neo-COINTELPRO operator The TA — finally spoke the truth when He/She/It quoted me — "the TA doesn't know where I set my foot anywhere" — then spoiled it all by declaring I don't have to, you give yourself away with your tone and choice of words. Interesting that you should use the word psychotic . . . . — Hmmmm. Let's see — tone and choice of words trumps facts? — Yes, psychotic is an interesting choice — accurate too — as the picture clears with yet another post from TA the neo-COINTELPRO operative, the choice of the word psychotic for The TA becomes even more manifest and more appropriate.

Then, Dr. Laura (aka neo-COINTELPRO operator The TA) dispensed travel advice without a map, facts or a license — saying, My advice? Leave Oakland alone and go trash your own city.

What TA the neo-COINTELPRO operator keeps missing is the fact that I'm merely helping Oakland and it's residents enjoy the status and reputation that it's politicians and voters have earned and so justly deserve — Oakland's people are what trashes Oakland — and without a sea change in political philosophy and broad reform of Oakland's prevalent moral codes — Oakland remains self-trashed — just another city with an inferior culture despite the sincere efforts of its finest citizens and most fanatic neo-COINTELPRO defenders.

I have no advice for TA the neo-COINTELPRO operator.

"Oakland's people are what trashes Oakland "

yeah, wish we could just get rid of all those darn people in Oakland! What a problem they are for the city!

So how 'bout those Raiders?

Good old TA he done run out of gas or mellowed or something, so The TA posted RR by quoting a fact — "Oakland's people are what trashes Oakland " — and then went south again by writing more nonsense in a winding down, mellow, perhaps conciliatory way — yeah, wish we could just get rid of all those darn people in Oakland! What a problem they are for the city! — and then — and then — good old TA he up and asked So how 'bout those Raiders?

Damn, I don't know TA, I was just hashing it over this afternoon with a restaurant owner and restaurant customers — I told them I kind of think Oakland Raiders will win the Super Bowl — but I don't care who wins — I just want to see a tight, hotly contested game — and I don't think I will be disappointed — just having a Super Bowl game, we all win.

Maybe after the Super Bowl — win or lose — the Raiders can come back to Oakland and sing that sick mantra — "Giving back to the community" — but sadly — some Raider will show the kids how to do it — get busted for dope, bash a woman, tear up a bar or restaurant. In the end, Raider money and no kind of money will solve Oakland's real problems — you can give a man a fish for a day — or you can teach a man how to fish for his entire life — and that's tough, almost nobody has the patience — and I'm pessimistic, I don't think Oakland has shown enough sturdy moral foundations within it's communities to turn the city around — the recent spike in murders, steady high levels of shattered homes, shattered lives, shattered families, children out of wedlock, rampant drugs, etc. — progressivism and class warfare don't work — Nope — just like any other city or institution or organization in distress Oakland must heal itself from the inside out — one person at a time.

what examples are you thinking of?

The "fear factor" also hurts Oakland. I work there but there is no way I will ever stay past 5 p.m. Downtown Oakland is a ghost town after 5 on weekdays and on weekends. Oakland needs money (among other things) to fix its problems, but it won't make that money until people aren't afraid to go there. The only Oakland business I patronize is a parking garage that's closer to my office than the free parking my company provides because I'm afraid to walk four blocks down the street.

Then again, every metro region has a City that's considered the "hell hole" of the area. In that respect, Oakland is certainly better than other urban hell holes like Detroit, Newark NJ, etc.

In response to comments on football, I am sorry if you have experienced anyone looking down on you as a result of differing political or social values. However, as a leftist, professional sports represent a fundamentally corrupt part of "who we are, and how we were brought up."
1. Understand that professional sports have become nothing more than a vehicle for large corporations to conduct marketing and consumption-based brainwashing, and that...

2. The fleecing of tax payers by multi-billion dollar team owners ( through the public subsidizing of stadiums) perpetuates one of the largest transfers of wealth that we as a society suffer. All with the promise that jobs will be created...Minimum weage jobs selling hot dogs and beer.

3. The exploitation of young athletes' bodies and dreams reaches down into the ranks of high-school / college ages, turning public schools into talent farms competing ferociously for big sports program money and "raw meat" players.

4. Professional sports culture perpetuates sexist/patriarchal stereotypes, while reinforcing violent impulses, and providing a mesmerising distraction for people...distraction of wasted time and emotional energy that could be directed toward improving one's community and personal circumstance, instead of rioting in the streets because the "Raiders won."

5. We can continue believing the lie that professional sports somehow embody American ideals, or recognize that violence and competitve elitism are destructive cultural behaviors that have brought us to where we are today, with a democracy that has been stolen by the wealthy, and a poverty-stricken working class that proceeds to slowly kill each other off, or rot away in industrialized prisons.

Go Team!

Jerry rushed to the CA legislature to beg for more cops after this mayhem occurred - see? see? We don't have enough cops! Wahhhh!

But for once these Chronicle idiots appear to have revealed the manipulation Jerry no doubt was behind.

And one more thing - times when we've gone to the raiders game to collect signatures we found that there were so few local Oaklanders there that it was pointless. Who *were* these people that did this?
.............................................
Cops faulted for Raider response
Phillip Matier, Andrew Ross Wednesday, January 22, 2003

While Raider revelers were raising hell at Oakland's Jack London Square and tearing up businesses along International Boulevard, dozens of duty- ready Alameda County sheriff's deputies were standing around a few blocks away at the Coliseum.

Only no one called them for help.

"We were in contact with the Oakland PD and made it clear, 'If you need us, let us know,' " a frustrated Sheriff Charlie Plummer told us Tuesday, as videotapes of rioting Raider fans spinning cars and torching businesses continued to fill local and national news broadcasts.

"We had 58 officers ready to go, and we held them at the stadium until 10 o'clock . . . waiting for a call that never came," Plummer said.

The deputies had been on duty since Sunday morning as part of the stadium crowd control -- but were being held in place after the game just in case.

When no call for assistance came by 10 p.m., the deputies were sent on their way -- and then, an hour later, the Oakland PD finally put in a call to the sheriff for help.

"By then, we were scraping the walls at the substations for people to send, " Plummer said.

Oakland had about 100 extra police officers on duty for Sunday night's championship game -- but the beefed-up force was unable to stop people from trashing cars, tearing up benches and torching businesses.

"I don't know what was going on with the police," said Ciro Molina, who witnessed the melee from her beauty shop on International Boulevard.

According to Molina, people started showing up about 7:30 p.m. An hour later, the trash fires started, and shortly thereafter, a police helicopter appeared overhead.

"I don't know if they were waiting for someone to call or what, but I thought they knew what was going on," Molina said. "They were shining their light on everything."

Police did show up, but only to block off the area, she said. When one squad car ventured into the cordoned-off zone, she said, revelers "pounced on it."

"No one came in until 9:30," Molina said.

Deputy Chief Patrick Haw defended the police, saying, "To be honest with you, a lot of the initial reporting on this in the media was overblown."

"They were talking about riots, but it was more similar to the sideshow activities that we've been experiencing and handled," Haw said. "We had sufficient officers to handle the situations that did flare up."

By night's end, 20 people had been arrested in connection with the postgame mayhem, with most being charged with public intoxication and vandalism.

Hey,
For once I am going to give the cops a break. After all we are talking about those WPOD raider fans.

No one's really faulting them - they were no doubt just following orders, Jerry's orders, most likely.

I've been in situations were we had to call 911 because people in front of our apartment had left their burning trash cans in front of the housing project and had descended on the occupants of two cars that had crashed in the intersection. Who showed up first? The ambulance, and man, you should have seen the looks on their faces when they got out, they were petrified! Too many minutes later, the cops came in from all angles. But by then the damage was done. I wouldn't blame the cops - they had a plan. But they shouldn't allow ambulance drivers to show up alone with a mob.

And I wouldn't blame them for this Raiders thing. If they'd cracked heads I might have blamed them. But they apparently didn't.

Good Call.

I seem to recall a that San francisco had a few incidents after SuperBowl wins by the 49ers also...Store windows were smashed...shops looted..fires set.....

Of course...they used non-fossil fuels to set the fires..and didn't steal anything made of leather or other animal skins...

They are such a thoughtful bunch....

The situations always seem to happen when bars continue to serve obviously drunken fans..and then abruptly cut them off at 2 am and throw them out onto the unsuspecting city..

The sports bars need to be more responsible and not see the playoffs as a huge cash cow...maybe a sports event tax or damage insurance premium needs to be paid out by those establishments that create this drunken mob...

BLAME IT ON SACRAMENTO
This won't be the last time we hear this song

Friday, January 24, 2003

-- NEWS FLASH: Oakland Mayor Jerry Brown blames state budget cuts for contributing to the melee on Oakland'streets after Sunday's AFC championship game.

-- BACKGROUND: There is no question that cities and counties are getting shortchanged by the state -- and that Oakland is hurting. But it's absurd for Brown to blame Sacramento for the city's failure to anticipate and react to trouble. Even in the tightest of budget times, controlling a mob scene must be a city's top priority.

-- UPSHOT: Look for state budget cuts to be the scapegoat of the year. Once it was "Blame it on El Nino." Loma Prieta, Bill Clinton, the energy crisis and Sept. 11 have also been been used, at times, as catch-all excuses.

-- QUOTE: "In Oakland last Sunday, (police) didn't put out as many people as they thought they should because they were ordered by me to cut back."

-- Jerry Brown, testifying in Sacramento.

By the way, I did hear one thing that would seem to bring some issue of class warfare into this.

The fact that it takes a hell of a lot of money to even be the stadium at games like these. I had completely forgotten about that, since I'm not fanatic enough about sports to have it in the front of my head.

But perhaps a lot of the serious fans do.

I, for my part, have lived in Oakland, for about three years during and after my studies at Cal. Perhaps I'm lucky, but between renting near MacArthur BART and around Lake Merritt, I never saw or heard a gunfight, or any significant violence to speak of. Let's see, a homeless guy got into my apt one day when I didn't lock the door correctly, and may have made off with a walkman. One of my kittens disappeared. While working in flower delivery I got worked on a petty credit card scam by a family in the hood. And one other homeless guy managed to con me for a few dollars. That's about the worst of it. And frankly, when I was delivering flowers in the hood, I often got better tips from the guys down there than I got from far wealthier recipients up on the hill. I've walked around at night, and true, I'm a man, but I'm a particularly little man.

Oh, yeah, there was one more thing. On a bus I was looking at a youth wearing a bandana, and he glared at me suddenly and queried what I was looking at. When I indicated it was nothing of importance, he didn't persue the matter.

So all in all, I don't see where the inferiority is in Oakland's culture that doesn't exist just about anywhere that stores are open past six in the evening.

from today's Sunday Chronicle, local section, Matier & Ross.

SPOILSPORTS: Whether they like it or not, everybody in Alameda County has a stake in the Oakland Raiders.

For starters, there's the $20 million a year that the county and Oakland have been paying out on average since the team returned seven years ago.

Then there's the estimated $2 million a year the city and county have been paying lawyers to fend off the Raiders' charge that they were tricked into returning to Oakland with a false promise of a sold-out stadium.

Then there's the $1.3 billion the team wants if it wins the aforementioned lawsuit.

All this over a deal that supposedly wouldn't cost the public a dime.

But, thanks largely to the personal seat license debacle that led to years of half-filled stadiums, the public will almost certainly keep paying out millions -- for another 23 years.

And there may even be more costs down the line.

Stadium manager Mark Kaufman notes that Network Associates Coliseum is already 37 years old and will certainly require some big-ticket improvements over the next few years to keep it up to snuff.

In fact, the city-county Joint Powers Authority responsible for overseeing the Coliseum is spending $600,000 in emergency funds to seal cracks and paint over leaky construction defects in the portions of the stadium built for the Raiders' return.

Plus, in the aftermath of Sept. 11, the stadium has spent a half-million dollars for new security cameras.

And if that weren't enough, Kaufman also has his eye on new Jumbotrons, instant replay cameras and other improvements he plans to present to the Joint Powers Authority in the coming weeks